Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I wouldn't say a great deal has been misquoted or taken out of context....
The MAIN problem (despite LOTS of attempts to get any semblance of a dialogue going) is that there's been little-to-no communication, even in the more "official" channels.
People aren't asking for a running commentary, they're trying to help w/a constructive dialogue, one that needn't be hugely time consuming & could actually be beneficial if leveraged well.*
The record to date hasn't been all that stellar, maybe things will change after the SDK's out, I sincerely hope so...

I did not know that, interesting, thanks for sharing....

*this is precisely what they touted they wanted to do "differently", the expectation hasn't materialised out of nowhere

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Misquotes, poor language interpretations, assumptions that have turned into "factoids" (the nokia patent gifting story as an example), fanboy wet dreams that, because some kid on the continent has a blog, all of a sudden becomes reality and all based on FUD.....

the MAIN problem is an inability for an eager fanbase to appreciate that Jolla owe us nothing.....

....yet.

We have no builds publicly available, no SDK (OS or application), IDE or simulator (Beyond the patched up build of Qt Creator that MER is using) and no Hardware.
What we have is a commitment to deliver at least two of the above against a timeframe that has not yet expired. They're not late and we're not their shareholders.

Jolla have consistently stated that the best way to get on board RIGHT NOW, is to support MER.

I can certainly appreciate the feeling of frustrated impatience (I have money burning a hole in my pocket right now!), but am happy to wait, given that there is no other viable alternative to the awesomeness of my N9 on the horizen.

wait, out

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Well this is the Jolla Sailfish MWC 2013 staff I guess:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BD8gNreCYAESQDO.jpg:large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BD8VeuXCMAEkH17.jpg:large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BD8nxKQCQAAAKxw.jpg:large


tbh I am not really impressed how things are being done :(

"Scan my QR code"
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BD8HJRiCAAA9CJk.jpg:large


Cheap tactics but known to work!!!

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Sexy...Sailfish!

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I disagree with the assertion that the only way to engage is via MeR, this isn't what they themselves have communicated, & it's not the only way to engage in useful back-n-forth.
You may feel that anything outside engagement via MeR/Nemo is a "eager fanbase that's owed nothing", but I don't think this whole exercise is a total waste of time, at least yet.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Did I read no SDK? :p

Go to sailfishos.org and enjoy ;)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

w00t!!!! Decent overhaul of that horrid site too, awesome!
Hope Windows & OSX SDK is available by the end of the mth too.

Qt dev 101, free course being offered at Eliademy (CBtec)
https://twitter.com/melsop74/status/306077828309450752

Man there's lotsa well-organised doco there now, far cry from the original site, this is one of my fav sections so far:
https://sailfishos.org/design.html

Some interesting (yet still somewhat opaque) sentences in About:
Plus this entire section in About...
https://sailfishos.org/about-license.html

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Good, looks like they are resolute to open source it after all.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

The entire stack? I don't think it's 100% clear yet on the full chain.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Is there still support for the sdk image?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

At least it sounds this way:

Note that nothing is said about keeping parts closed. So it looks like they are working towards opening it all up (even if at first not all stuff will be open). Time will tell of course.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

People are already getting emulators working, from what I read the experience for an emulated OS is really smooth. Some say smoother than Ubuntu mobile OS

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BD-Zcm_CEAIcZfm.jpg:large

[edit]

sorry @Morpog no bad intentions :(

Picture and tweet info from @Morpog

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Lol mariusmssj, you ripped my twitter pic and my tweets in an own post.....

That's the SailfishOS SDK which you can get since today on sailfishos.org.

People are alreay trying their apps on it:
<pyksy> works \o/ http://pyksy.ath.cx/temp/SFVasama.png

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I see wget included in Sailfish (which is GPLv3) as part of Nemo packages. I don't think Sailfish has any problems with that. The whole issue is around Mer itself. I.e. it gives a potential for some vendors to go that route, but it doesn't mandate it. Sailfish (as a vendor) already obviously doesn't go there - so don't worry.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Cute girls...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I never "asserted" the only way to engage is vie mer. I merely referenced what Jolla has been saying.
Perhaps your misinterpretation of my comment is my fault?

Jolla has opened a number of streams for comms and have been pretty responsive on all of them, perhaps the disappointment lay in the fact that their answers aren't satisfying some people?

Anyways, SDK is out and that's great news. lets get hacking:)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Reading your entire response it sure as heck sounded like that, they haven't been responsive on all of them...
There's still a ****-load of unanswered/unclear things, but with the SDK out now a large component will at least start to become less murky, & through feedback can be refined.
Getting there, hopefully soon we'll also get feedback to all content in the docs, some of which -no doubt- has been cleared-up now, thanks to the recent site overhaul.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Isn't that the same thing we heard from Nokia? They said similar things about how open they were and about how they contributed tons to the kernel... Meanwhile, they continued to close up more and more of the OS and deprecate older hardware with planned obsolescence by making sure the core of the operating system and as much of the system remained closed-source and irrevocably locked up from any new kernels, security updates and even open-source replacements for system-dependent applications (battery system, media player, even calendar, etc.). They say one thing, but in practice they do other things. It's like someone telling you that you're perfectly fine and safe, while they reach around you to repeatedly stab you in the back.

I've learned to believe it when I see it.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

It's a metric **** tonne better than where Tizen's been going, not sure you've been following either all that closely, we just have some unknowns still...
Those unknowns at this relatively early stage doesn't automatically mean the same approach as Maemo/Harmattan's being taken, so far it's still looking much more like MeeGo.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

If I get this right We should be able to have 18 apps open at the same time 9 per screen(2 Screens available) and a Events screen.

From this picture I think that:
https://sailfishos.org//images/desig...gn-core-ux.png

There will be 3 screen from left to right to swipe to. Home - Apps - Events. Home and Apps might have the same feature, but I am not sure. What's almost clear that there is a dedicated Events screen which can be accessed with 2 swipes to right or single swipe to left like on N9 basically.

[Edit]
This is only my speculation

and here is more info:
https://sailfishos.org//images/desig...pplication.png
https://sailfishos.org//images/desig...ture-event.png

UX Framework

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

mariusmssj,

You are thinking the "App" screen is for mult-tasking but I don't think so. To me its an application. So from that open application you can either return to the multi-tasking view or you can go to the events feed. Its showing you the possible routes from an application.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Not quite. The events screen is only one swipe away all the time. And you don't swipe between Home, App, and Events in Harmattan style. This diagram means that you either see Home, the current app, or Events.
From the app you can peek into home or events with a single gesture that fades out the app window. By completing the gesture you'll land on Home or Events, and by cancelling it, you are back in the app.
Try it in the emulator. It's nice. :)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Thanks for that guys, I knew I might have been missing something :)

I got the SDK installed last night but didn't have the chance to play around with it

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Using the Sailfish Emulator (SDK), after opening 10 meego-terminal, only 9 covers are visible. When one of them is closed, the hidden one is shown.

I don't know if there is some way to see more than 9 covers.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Oh I see, any idea if the 10th app is closed or suspended or just hidden from the view?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I think it's just hidden from view. The UI stops at 9, simply ignoring what's beyond. But I agree that 9 is simply not enough! :)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

http://tweakers.net/nieuws/87523/kpn...h-toestel.html

For all dutchies. In +/- July Jolla wants to release their first device in the Netherlands :)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

It would be nice to start seeing some basic apps (like the ones they showed in SLUSH). I'm particularly interested in what they are going to do about maps, especially now that Nokia is licensing their aggressively.
Also, I reckon it's critical for certian type of apps that integrate with maps.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I don't see why certent open apps must be so big, it's only a few you would like to interact with. Make the rest smaller.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

If nokia is putting their maps on firefoox, i assume they will do the same for sailfish.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Nokia has confirmed this?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Well every site i've been on is saying so
link
Link2

So the firefox marketplace will have Here maps app


[edit]
here we go:
http://mynokiablog.com/wp-content/up...2/DSC02084.jpg

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

yes nokia maps on firefox but i don't think it will a donation :) everything has price especially the only decent nokia service .

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

yeah at firefox's and nokia's press conference at mwc yesterday.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Nokia won't charge heaps, it's part of their Maps strategy, there's been some detailed write-ups at MNB...
Being ubiquitous is far more important to them than charging a premium, ofc, WP will "generally" get the goodies 1st, & in some cases have "exclusive" features.
And on some platforms it prolly won't be "technically feasible" to add (some) functionality that exists on others, esp. the ones focused heavily/mainly on HTML5.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Still better than BB10, which just plainly kills the oldest application when the 9th is opened.

I wonder how they will implemented that - if as a real "native" Firefox HTML5 & js application, or if they can reuse some code from other platforms and do a real compiled/binary native app. :)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

isn't the maps for n9 buit with qt, it would be a pretty easy to port and update. That is me just guessing, I hope they don't do a webwrapper app. Nokia wants maps used by more people so they get more data back. They are building the android and ios, so lets hope they build a proper native app.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

This is a nice touch (CBtec was also formed by ex-Nokians).

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Again nothing will be fully open in ANY OS. People should stop being so naive Stallman fanatics.

In case of SailfishOS: my guess is the silica library(means the SDK) will be opensource but not the core apps delivered on theyr end device.