maemo.org - Talk - can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

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- - can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier? (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=23147)

Re: can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

Quote:

Originally Posted by salomc (Post 217796)

Not necessarily. It's enough if both methods are available all the time ;)

or nokia could mirror the controls on the other side off the screen ;)

Re: can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

Gah... I'm so late for the fun :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by benny1967 (Post 217665)

No, not really. The only thing crappy are the large GUI-elements that waste so much space on the screen. Make them smaller (as they were before OS2007) and its the perfect "micro-laptop" UI.

Okay, I've always imagined a context-sensitive finger-friendly interface. For instance - imagine you have a fullscreen browser without any toolbars or scrollbars. You drag somewhere on the page and scroll. Or you can click close to the right/left edge where a scrollbar is supposed to be and a biiig scrollbar appears (over the page, without re-layout, maybe transparent) - you scroll and after you get your finger up, the scrollbar disappears. You click on the bottom edge and you've got a toolbar the same way - do what you want, press a button and it is gone. How does that sounds as a finger friendly not wasting space interface? :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by benny1967 (Post 217665)

One of the things I like most about the concept of the tablets is that they use well-established desktop technologies (such as GTK). End users dont care about this, but it makes it easier to bring already existing applications to the tablets without re-writing too much.

Breaking with well-established concepts might (not necessarily has to, but there's a risk) cause incompatibilities here. Its not that thousands of developers work on 3rd party apps for the tablets right now, right? I wonder if this number would further decrease if completely new UI-concepts would require devs to re-learn everything from scratch and make it harder (or impossible) to port desktop-application to the tablets.

I can say the same but the other way round - old and well established desktop technologies are ***** to program a new and usable interface, which doesn't fit in the old frame (and the mobile interfaces certainly are not). GTK+ for sure, didn't try QT yet, but i bet it also has its quirks. The technologies are moving for the better, adopting CSS for styling, but until that happens, we will enjoy crap GUIs, 'cause you're unable to do better without going to the roots (like lcuk does).

Re: can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

With the long click the way it's implemented right now, I find inconsistent behavior. Half the time when I take my finger off the screen so I can read the menu it's bringing up, the menu disappears.

So I ask, why does a context sensitive UI have to be activated by a long click? Why not a short click? Isn't the whole process of clicking on an object within an application indicating "Hey I want to do something with this"?

As for the stylus debate, anyone ever try using a stylus while driving? Windows Mobile 5.0 tried to force me to with its tiny interface, so I had to get good at being precise with my fingers and it sucked big time. Please don't force people to use the stylus to use your interface, and please give people the choice of using the stylus, it can't be that hard.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texrat (Post 217718)

I like the ability of a long click to represent a right mouse click. As a former product designer (and thus heavy user of parametric modeling tools such as SolidWorks) I am a big, BIG evangelist for context-sensitive UI approaches. Hide what the user doesn't need, and bring up what he/she does need based mainly on current context. Beautiful. Reduction of used real estate, reduction of clicks, win for the happy user.

I don't see a better way for right clicks to be emulated on the tablets, unless one considers combining touch with a hardware button press-- and I just don't see that as better. But to each his own.

Re: can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texrat (Post 217653)

In my opinion what's called for here is a revolutionary approach that throws old paradigms out the window and starts from scratch. Some time back we had that discussion here but unfortunately it seemed to have ultimately gone nowhere.

I want to forget conventional menus, zooming, scrolling, etc, and come up with an approach that is specifically designed around the tablets' capabilities. That means, IMO, increased usage of gestures and decreased emphasis on things like dropdown menus. Long clicks, finger motions, multitaps, etc. I'll take heat for this from traditionalists I know but something that borrows heavily from Canola, iPhone and other similar approaches.

Out with the old.

In with the new.

You may think you're a radical, but you've basically just described the Newton UI.

Well, except for the multitaps. That's just plain silly.

Re: can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

Totally liking your proposal Bundyo! Though instead of invisible points to click at I'd give users the option of transluscent clickable elements or at least force them through a tutorial the first time they start it up so the learning curve isn't as steep. I definitely like the idea of the user interface floating above the application when needed instead of constraining its usable space.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bundyo (Post 217803)

Gah... I'm so late for the fun :)

Okay, I've always imagined a context-sensitive finger-friendly interface. For instance - imagine you have a fullscreen browser without any toolbars or scrollbars. You drag somewhere on the page and scroll. Or you can click close to the right/left edge where a scrollbar is supposed to be and a biiig scrollbar appears (over the page, without re-layout, maybe transparent) - you scroll and after you get your finger up, the scrollbar disappears. You click on the bottom edge and you've got a toolbar the same way - do what you want, press a button and it is gone. How does that sounds as a finger friendly not wasting space interface? :)

Re: can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

Tutorial is maybe better, translucent elements will probably get in the way. At least in my way :)

Re: can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

Quote:

Originally Posted by qole (Post 217786)

You can never be too careful, you could end up looking like a real click.

Qolled! :p

Re: can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karel Jansens (Post 217819)

Well, except for the multitaps. That's just plain silly.

No, you. :p

And of course I'm a radical. I advocate techniques from dead devices.

Re: can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bundyo (Post 217803)

I can say the same but the other way round - old and well established desktop technologies are ***** to program a new and usable interface,

The current interface is perfectly usable. Cmon, it's ridiculous to make people believe it's unusable now that there's 3 years of proof that it works perfectly well. OS2008 was a small step backwards compared to 2006 and 2007, but its still OK and theres nothing fundamentally wrong with it.

Re: can the '08 GUI be ANY crappier?

Cripes all this complaining, and claims of "unuseability", you'd think you could pick one of these things up used for like $20.