Re: Do you want INSTALL FROM FILE back?
 

You don't read HowardForums, definitely. But if you read you may find a lot of people who exchange different ways how to unlock/unbrand their phones. Sometime works, sometime stupid but - this community does exist and very well known. And the reason for that is pretty same as Open Software movement.

BTW, the talk is not about you, the discussion is about ordinary N900 user - you try to keep HIM from destroying his FS, not you, right? I try to prove you that he has his own mind and he needs the listing of ALL applications. If he doesn't have it - HowardForum and other forums will be full of advices how to do it.

Red pill was actually hidden much better then rootsh and apt- packages. But it was a simple way to give to that kind of user a tool to "haaack" device. And that tool actually may have some guardians in comparison with plain root shell.

Re: Do you want INSTALL FROM FILE back?
 

flasher-3.5 --enable-rd-mode

fatalsaint, your whole argument is based around the idea that a user with a broken Application Manager and without rootsh or ssh installed is stuck. This is clearly not the case, so I suggest you reevaluate your position.

Re: Do you want INSTALL FROM FILE back?
 

It is already filed by me (bug 7149) - I think it has a common reason.

Re: Do you want INSTALL FROM FILE back?
 

A completely hypothetical and unlikely scenario. Hardly justification for Red Pill mode. The average person does not have .deb files just lying around on their system, nor should they. If you're writing your own app, you should be comfortable enough with the command line to know what you're doing. And no one will support you (nor should they) if you insist on manually installing .deb files directly unless they EXPLICITLY tell you to do so (and that's rare.)

Then suggest that the rootsh package be included by default. I suspect, however, that anyone who truly needs it will have internet access. It was the first package I installed when I got my N900. You're arguing for extremely obscure corner cases.

Each time we encounter a case where you have to go to the shell or use Red Pill mode to fix something isn't a reason FOR Red Pill, it's a bug in the base UI that should be fixed.

No, standards are -extremely- important. They keep the system running.

Being a high end open source tablet with mobile phone capabilities means you don't run roughshod over the proper operation of your package management system. It's open, not a rickety hack.

Re: Do you want INSTALL FROM FILE back?
 

I know what I'm doing on my own, I am very good with linux. I know everything I need in the command line. The problem lies that I cannot do it without rootsh, and I cannot get rootsh without internet. I go on family vacations.. I have, in the past, downloaded entire sets of debs for my laptops that I know I'll need while I'm reinstalling my Linux's out on family vacation, in the mountains, with no internet.

Sometimes I don't plan so well.. and miss some debs.. and yes that's frustrating :D. Sometimes.. works out great.. and I can get a lot done hidden away in a trailer in the middle of no where.

Hello? Where have you been? That's exactly what I've been arguing for - putting rootsh in by default. I am arguing for a case that actually happened.

Re: Do you want INSTALL FROM FILE back?
 

I would suggest not wrecking your system's software while on vacation.

And my point would be that the case you described should handle itself automatically, without requiring red pill mode or rootsh.

Re: Do you want INSTALL FROM FILE back?
 

Funny coming from you GA.

R&D mode enables more than just root access.

Edit: Also, enabling R&D mode for a typical end-user is just intrusive as reflashing. They may as well reflash the device to fix the problem in the other thread. A very simple problem.. with a very simple fix. But complicated solely due to the lack of access to the device.

Re: Do you want INSTALL FROM FILE back?
 

You asked for a way to get root with no way to install rootsh and not other root access. This is it. The reason I'm not recommending that users pick R&D mode as the default root access solution.

Of course it does, but this is a troubleshoot-or-reflash situation. After the issue has been fixed all they need to run is.

flasher-3.5 --disable-rd-mode

Re: Do you want INSTALL FROM FILE back?
 

Well.. I suppose that'll have to be good enough. I don't believe it should be necessary to use a computer to gain root. Again.. no different than an iPhone :(.

Re: Do you want INSTALL FROM FILE back?
 

So connecting their device to a computer and enabling R&D mode, troubleshooting their issue, then disabling it is more intrusive than having to start from scratch (perhaps with no backup available)? Interesting.

Either way, the issue here isn't whether the solution is more or less convenient. You're claim was that there was no other way out, which is quite clearly not the case.

You can make an argument for a nice, friendly recovery mode, but that's outside the scope of this particular discussion. :)