Re: Ask the Council!
 

:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:
what a mess :mad:
even only reading the last two or three posts here & the last few on the coding competition thread...
i'm (@ least) glad i'm not involved in any way...

have you any idea what impression this makes (in not particular order)

• on a NOKIA person (how does the Maemo community fare...)
• on a potential N9 buyer (what is this Harmattan stuff? is it more then MeeGo???)
• on a community member thinking about joining the council (no comment...)

:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

i know there were many community members shouting for more openness of the council and community direction in general, but that's the kind of dirty laundry you could and should maybe not hang out to dry in public :( :eek:

Re: Ask the Council!
 

one impression this thread will definitely make on a Nokia person reading this thread is he/she will know better how to color his font better when representing Nokia or MeeGo in an official press release :p

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Well, I have not been involved in any way before, and was not the person who gave the advice, but I try to help now.

I think the worse impression would be if the coding competition could not be decided. I would hope a community member thinking about joining council would do that so they can help the community.

The request was fine in this thread. That is what the thread is for. Usually, there is the problem that people ask things of Council in some random thread and think that somehow Council will magically become aware of it. I think the Coding Competition is still a positive thing to do and not dirty laundry to raise their problem in the open.

Let's keep this thread for people to contact Council and get replies, and commentary can go elsewhere.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

¦-))))))))

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Saying no comment but actually comenting is a really douchey move.
That Ralph Waldo Emerson quote can be applied to you, just switch the places of solution and problem, or even better switch solution and problem with nothing and nothing.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

I would like to ask the Council what is the status of CSSU?
Since a while there is no activity on Gitorious and IRC logs show that the interest in CSSU is close to 0.
My question is- will we have a one more update? There are a few good things waiting like arceans portrait mode etc.
Further more CSSU was one of the things taht should make maemo survive. Looking at the activity we should dump all hopes on CSSU which leaves us with Cordia and MeeGo only.
To be clear. I don't blame anyone, I don't demand anything. I'm just asking for some information. Good or bad I will take it as it is without complais but I need something. I think that I'm not the only one in here with my thoughts.
Sory for my English.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Is this an abstract piece of art, or do you actually expect people to read this without getting a headache?

Total of 15 emoticons and text in 4 different colours... Maybe try preview and check out the formatting before submitting?

Re: Ask the Council!
 

+1 and bump, ho ever, I think it should be addressed @ CSSU team.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

You think council still cares about CSSU? I will be surprised if that is the case. Anyway, estel is right, "CSSU team" (whoever is left of it) should be asked about that.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

I would not draw conclusion from inactivity during August. Many people are on holiday. And, yes, you want to ask this of CSSU.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Off-topic - let me guess, our "bellowed" and "favorite" N950 renting program resulted in less interest amongst some CSSU team members?
[/off-topic]

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Also known as the N900 effect.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Where is the place to adress CSSU team in public so everyone cn see what is their answer?

This is a thing for the council but as I see things also the Cordia project isn't much hope for Maemo as only Smoku is developing for it. This means that there is onlt MeeGo. Since there is no MeeGo (N9 is a big mistake and I wont buy one) what is the solution for Maemo?
This are very important queations. It was nice to read a while ago that we have 3 roads but after a bit of reaserch it comes out that we have no options then jump to other platform.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

PERHAPS a CSSU thread instead of the Council thread?!

Re: Ask the Council!
 

as CSSU was supposed to be one of the hopes for maemo this is the right place in my opinion. If you would look at the CSSU hread- developers don't show up in there so what is the point in asking questions in there? There is absolutely no comunication with the devs so no one knows what is going on and why and this situation brought me to the Council as the governing body which should be interested in CSSU and have more info.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

N900 wasn't limited to "choosen ones".

As for asking about CSSU here - I remember news, when it was listed amongst main "goals" of Council (to support it, together with Cordia) so I don't think it's bad place.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Look at today's log for #maemo-ssu, interesting stuff to read

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Thank you. This is realy something interesting to read! Finally some news!

Re: Ask the Council!
 

My reference was to that 1) there was a N900 developer programme from sometime before actual launch called Fremantle Stars and 2) the hand-out of loaner N900s in Amsterdam at MeeGo summit before shipping started

The effect were the same, key application contributors and hackers moved on to "next" device, hence, the N900 effect.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Since the actual number of votes needed to promote an application to Extras was lowered to 6, a big number of applications haver reached the status to be promoted, but they haven't, probably due to lack of time/interest of their developers.

I propose that promotion from Extras Testing to Extras should be automatic.

What would be the point to promote from Devel to Testing if then the application is not going to be promoted to Extras?

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Because some apps can be quite dangerous. I think there should be an option: `automatically promote to extras when possible.`

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Regarding the Coding Competition 2011

We have prepared everything to setup the voting process but we have the problem we need access to the server and some one with enought skills to setup the voting. I wrote Bergie a PM if he is able to help us.

This was the reply:

After a short discussion we are sure he want's a official order for this to create a ticket.

Could the Council help? What information do you need?

Re: Ask the Council!
 

...no reply, not even a "just a moment, the council members have to talk about this appeal first"... :(

Very frustrating and I feel so sorry for the 63 developers which has spent a lot of time and effort to create the 79 promising applications for our present platform maemo and our possible future MeeGo.

Sure, the organisator could have prepared everything before the competition ended. But it was the first time and without much experience you can't see the obstacles before they hit you with all their power directly in your face. And sometimes it is hard to schedule and know how much time you could allocate in 5 months if you start such a project in April. Some private stuff is out of your control even if you try it as hard as you can. And all of my respect to everyone (Kojacker last year and Zehjotkah this year) who runs such a project in his spare time.

Not all members are able to develop software. But we are a community, we should stay together, help each other and motivate developers to support our beloved devices.

The Maemo / MeeGo Coding Competition 2011 has clearly done this job outstanding.

Sadly it feels currently like this was the last community coding competition - and I'm very unhappy with this feeling. I still love my Nokia N900. And it clearly deserved much more interest. From the manufacturer, from the community and even their elected Councils.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Face it. There is no longer such thing as a Council in here. There are 5 members and not even one answered to your request.

When things will move like this there will be no ellection for the next council so I think that we you have to solve the voting in other way.

As you wrote it is sad that so many people worked hard and...

Re: Ask the Council!
 

I asked X-Fade directly in the council meeting on Tuesday if Nemein could help with the coding competition vote. As I said before, I was not involved but I try to help now. I was the one who initiated email to Dave Neary before and he at least was in contact even if he is not available to help.

Sorry you are having difficulty. To be candid, I would not expect the Council to address your appeal in the urgent time that remains even though it is fully worthy of its attention. I was the only council member who participated in the meeting on Tuesday. You should PM Texrat if you haven't already.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Thanks SD69 for your reply and sorry for my harsh post. I guess I left this morning my bed with the wrong feet first... ;) I'm today easily irritable... :o (my colleague told my already)
I was aware of your first message several days ago. But we still need further help. (the official Council message to Bergie)

I still hope we are able to finish this competition somehow successful.

I wrote him now at forum.meego.com a private message. Thanks.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

I have just responded separately to yesterday's request, and I also responded to the request made before that. Please allow at least 24 hours for a response to a query in this thread.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Fair enough ;)

Re: Ask the Council!
 

No problem. I share your frustration.


Unfortunately, I myself can't act officially for Council as I am only 1 out of 5. :(

Even if you have to conduct the vote by a poll again, I would still call the competition successful judging by the number of entries and the prizes.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

:)

I guess before we follow this "Plan F" we try to follow Zehjotkah's new Plan B to setup our own voting system on a different server with the user data from TMO.
But I would still prefer Plan A - the official maemo.org election system, on the maemo server and in the best case with a maemo.org eMail adress in the from field to avoid confusion for the receivers. In the best case setup by a person with enough skills to avoid thousands of eMails without or with the wrong content.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Slightly off topic for the current discussion, but please, explain something to me. The only 2 active council (current) members I've ever seen, are SD69 (thanks guy, You got to have really tough skin, but don't give up!) and Texrat (which now may be more interested in mico$oft phone...).

I don't want to judge too early on Texrat (despite he was active on his blog, with inability to check his Council PM account at the same time...) so lets leave his current absence alone. But, what about other members. I think no one is forced to remain Council member to the end - if one is not interested anymore, why not resign? It's not a way of man of honor to remain as inactive obstruction.

What is all that 3/5 inactivity about? they want to put "been Maemo Council representative for full cadence" into CV, or what?

Yes, i know it's a rant in some part, sorry about that ;) Ho ever, at the same time, I would like to show my deepest respect for SD69, for acting like one man army and still being here, despite all frustrating things.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

It was made very clear in that Tuesday meeting that we have to do it all ourselves. If there is someone in this community who knows their way around hackish scripts and SQL, we can probably get them access to the database (probably a Nemein ticket as said above).

You need to follow Dave Neary's instructions on the wiki:

http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_team...ng_an_election

Can anyone do this? Please? Volunteers?

It is all well and good to sit at your computer and complain about some vague council who isn't doing what you think they should be doing.

It is quite another thing to step up to the plate and say, "I can do this for you!"

(And hey, Estel, I'm somewhat active, no?)

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Take my excuses qole, You're so active in many other areas, that I've totally forget about You being Council member. Shame on me, and excuse again.

Ho ever, as for other Council members (beside SD69, You, and Texrat), I can't even recall Their names without checking.

My post was not like "nasty Council isn't doing" - I mean that, if other 2 (3?) members are not interested, it would be much easier for Council to make decisions in group of 3 (2?), than dealing with "dead souls" obstruction.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Ok I was re-reading the logs from the IRC meeting:

IRC logs here

And X-Fade (paid maemo.org team) clearly steps up and offers to run the council election, but he says that the coding competition is just too much for him to do, and he doesn't believe a volunteer will be able to get access to all of the databases, etc. that are needed. He says the coding competition should use another voting mechanism.

:(

Re: Ask the Council!
 

So, they are paid for deciding what they will be doing, and what is too much exercise for them?

Do You still think that it's too early to make decision about cutting ties with nokia, and taking this whole mess on our own?;) No, really, it's plain joke. Even paid maintenance team doesn't respect it own customer, when "one who pay bills" made it clear that it's epilog.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

*yawns* have you noticed that maemo.org is up and running? to me it seems that they are doing their job.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Thanks a lot. The IRC log was a very interesting reading. Haven't known about it. :)

We already prepared a lot of stuff for the Coding Competition election at our competition thread.
We got the users.csv file with all eMail Adresses, we got a draft for the instructions.txt (needs a review and we have to adapt some parts for each vote - or have to insert placeholder for text blocks if something like this exists) and we prepared all 9 *.sql files. So the most work should be already done. So no need to work a whole day for x-fade on this topic. :)

The problem is now the access, the needed knowledge and the security concerns. Als already said I'm very scared that it was that easy to get the users.csv without much discussion. I share in this point x-fades opinion. Nobody excepts the paid admins should have access to the servers.

If I understood Bergie correct the Council have now only to send a official request.
X-Fades concerns regarding the number of created EMails is correct. To reduce the load we could start each poll with 12 hours gap between. If I understood the *.SQL files correct we are able to setup this before. So nobody has to do this manually. 9 emails from maemo.org are a lot - but if we explain it in the first line of the instructions.txt I'm sure the users would be fine.

If we are unable to use the maemo.org infrastructure I guess we should try to setup our own server and take the user data we got from talk.maemo.org - personally I would prefer to elect a committee (Plan C) that selects the winners in a open discussion before we run again a catastrophically forum poll (Plan F ...or Z).

Re: Ask the Council!
 

I got a reply for my PM from texrat:
So perhaps we collected 3 councils out of 5 to try to solve this issue... :rolleyes:

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Let's just agree to disagree here, especially, that it seems in alone in my opinion about this. Let's just say that IMO it's looking exactly opposite, still, no need for yaw work ;)

Re: Ask the Council!
 

I have a proposal which is posted in this topic.