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-   Maemo 5 / Fremantle (https://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=40)
-   -   Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32676)

allnameswereout 2009-10-11 09:50
Re: Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcull (Post 343649)
[...]
Until informed otherwise all software refered to in this thread is suspect and may seriously effect the utility of your device. Although not dangerous to it physically, it could damage the utility or battery life of your device in lots of as yet, unknown ways.
You have been warned! :)

Isn't it ..and may seriously affect the utility of your device.? Or ...and may have serious effect on the utility of your device.? Or impact?

Is such notice not shown in Application Manager already?

jolo 2009-10-11 09:53
Re: Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVee (Post 343686)
Personally, I hate those kind of warnings. They are addressing the issue from the wrong (=negative) angle.
Suppose I'm not a developer, I'm not an experienced tester and I really don't know what I'm doing. How is that ever going to change if I follow warnings like this? The only way to learn what is going on is to ignore warning like this and try it anyway. The only way to become an experienced tester is to test software which actually has bugs, etc.

The warning should really be phrased positive, e.g. "Feel free to play with this software, but be aware that..." And add the 'Restore factory image' instructions in there, doing so will scare more people away then any warning will. ;)
Well, I kind of agree, as noone really reads the full text of these warnings when they install things. Have a short, simple text in plain English / French / German / etc. would probably be sufficient.

allnameswereout 2009-10-11 09:54
Re: Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVee (Post 343686)
Personally, I hate those kind of warnings. They are addressing the issue from the wrong (=negative) angle.
Suppose I'm not a developer, I'm not an experienced tester and I really don't know what I'm doing. How is that ever going to change if I follow warnings like this? The only way to learn what is going on is to ignore warning like this and try it anyway. The only way to become an experienced tester is to test software which actually has bugs, etc.

The warning should really be phrased positive, e.g. "Feel free to play with this software, but be aware that..." And add the 'Restore factory image' instructions in there, doing so will scare more people away then any warning will. ;)
That invites curious, innocent users. If they are curious they may want to play in SDK/VM, get a second device, ... and these options they can ask and/or read about here.

kalle 2009-10-11 10:06
Re: Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning
 
This notifications should NOT be seen every time you INSTALL a program (I really hate all the notification windows which tell me nothing but legal stuff). This is a message that should be clear BEFORE you can START to install a program. Ie. if you activate extras repository (or are all the activated repositories mixed together, and you can't see the source?) on your phone or come to the Extras -page.

allnameswereout 2009-10-11 10:16
Re: Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kalle (Post 343696)
This notifications should NOT be seen every time you INSTALL a program (I really hate all the notification windows which tell me nothing but legal stuff). This is a message that should be clear BEFORE you can START to install a program. Ie. if you activate extras repository (or are all the activated repositories mixed together, and you can't see the source?) on your phone or come to the Extras -page.
Hmm, any non-Nokia source showed a disclaimer warning in previous Maemo versions.

I think you're confusing Extras with Extras-Devel. The subject title is talking about innocent people replacing Extras with Extras-Devel.

kalle 2009-10-11 10:38
Re: Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning
 
And this disclaimer I would not like to see ;)

Yes, I ment the Extras-Devel aca "Maemo.org extras-testing" -repository. This is explained very well by Peter Schneider in this video (7:37):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxjfRE7GLno

I understand the concept but the terminology is still new to me ;)

allnameswereout 2009-10-11 10:51
Re: Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kalle (Post 343709)
And this disclaimer I would not like to see ;)
Well, it is now shown when you want to enable repository but its legal disclaimer. Not quite informative like the one suggested in this thread.

Quote:
Yes, I ment the Extras-Devel aca "Maemo.org extras-testing" -repository.
Good morning :p

rcull 2009-10-11 11:08
Re: Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning
 
Original post edited with suggestions by allnameswereout and AVee.

I am by no means suggesting that this warning be displayed anywhere other than on the first post of a thread advertising new-unfinished software.

I would rather frighten off a prospective user of my app(s) than risk users installing and then regretting it and putting them off using my software for life :) These apps will after all ( hopefully ) end up in Extras and be visible to all.

Rick

pelago 2009-10-11 11:21
Re: Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning
 
Sorry if this is slightly off-topic, but which repositories are enabled by default in N900? And which ones are "typed in", but need enabling?

duckyduck 2009-10-11 12:04
Re: Seriously: don't send users out of Extras without a big warning
 
I made the "mistake" yesterday, I enabled the dev repo and started installing programs, this, that, that, this.... The memory information tool says I have 2GB of memory, so who cares?
Until the moment that my phone froze.. 0 bytes free in root.. Package manager not working anymore (couldn't remove applications).. Now what?

For a customer that pays hard money for its phone this would be a nightmare, wouldn't it?

Luckyly I had installed SSH and Midnight Commander, so I could starting cleaning up the mess.

Resume: this would really happen, warnings or not... The question is, how can we as developers/testers prevent this from happening? If Maemo gets mainstream in a few years this simply may not happen.

The question I have is: why is the package manager not smart enough to refuse to install applications in the wrong location? (with a special developers mode that you need to enable by shell or something) Or simply correcting the install path.. It would force the developer to think about and install in the correct location.

I personally hate the fact that Linux puts all applciations in the same few directories... But that's another story.

Fair?

Wkr,
Joep


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