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-   OS2008 / Maemo 4 / Chinook - Diablo (https://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=29)
-   -   N8x0 Doomsday repositories (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=75985)

ivgalvez 2012-10-05 09:10
Re: N8x0 Doomsday repositories
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by www.rzr.online.fr (Post 1276697)
Is it legal to "backup" it on a dropbox service ?
Probably not, but no one will accuse you for doing you "own personal backup".

Momcilo, lma, once we can sort out all the issues with Nemein and Nokia, we will need administrators for the different services, would you like to be part of the administration group, maybe in charge of N8x0 repositories?

It would also be useful to make backups of firmware images, flasher and SDK, just in case...

danramos 2012-10-05 09:13
Re: N8x0 Doomsday repositories
 
There goes the resale value on the N8x0's. Meanwhile, I can still use and re-sell my ancient Motorola Droid (my first Android device) and it's STILL getting updates from CyanogenMod (I thought they'd stopped.. but apparently, they've been committing and releasing updates to CM7 even as recently as only a few days ago and every several days.. thanks to increasingly opened Android source code) AND even the closed-source Google apps continue to get updates and run fine.

It's simply boggling the way Nokia took an open operating system and locked it down tighter and tighter with every new Nokia Maemo device and made it nearly impossible to keep the resale value on these devices the way Android managed to for a myriad of devices by many manufacturers. It's infuriating that even mirroring the repositories has to become a crippling legal issue.

lma 2012-10-05 09:42
Re: N8x0 Doomsday repositories
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ivgalvez (Post 1276720)
Probably not, but no one will accuse you for doing you "own personal backup".
Personal backups are absolutely fine if you own a Diablo device, what is not allowed is redistribution of the proprietary bits.

Quote:
Momcilo, lma, once we can sort out all the issues with Nemein and Nokia, we will need administrators for the different services, would you like to be part of the administration group, maybe in charge of N8x0 repositories?
Sure, I've already volunteered for precisely that a while ago.

Quote:
It would also be useful to make backups of firmware images, flasher and SDK, just in case...
Until/unless Nokia licences the foundation to host these, it would be wise for everyone to make backups of those.

lma 2012-10-05 09:48
Re: N8x0 Doomsday repositories
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by danramos (Post 1276722)
There goes the resale value on the N8x0's.
What resale value? After all, they are 5-6 year-old devices and you can still find unused ones for sale if you look a bit.

Quote:
Meanwhile, I can still use and re-sell my ancient Motorola Droid (my first Android device) and it's STILL getting updates from CyanogenMod
Sure, Android is more open source than Maemo and Google have not set their platform on fire. This isn't the thread to talk about that though ;-)

danramos 2012-10-05 11:24
Re: N8x0 Doomsday repositories
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lma (Post 1276744)
What resale value? After all, they are 5-6 year-old devices and you can still find unused ones for sale if you look a bit.
You seem to be making opposing points within the same sentence. What are you saying?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lma (Post 1276744)
Sure, Android is more open source than Maemo and Google have not set their platform on fire. This isn't the thread to talk about that though ;-)
Maybe... Maybe... But this IS a "doomsday" thread, right? It is still relevant point to make that Nokia really has wretchedly crippled and hobbled this "based on open-source" platform and turned it into a horrible legal exercise now. The legal permission to at LEAST distribute closed-source freely may ultimately be the only fix until someone comes along to write an altogether replacement operating system--which we know is unlikely given previous attempts and the closed architecture. It almost begs the question of whether it's even worth it. What a mess.

lma 2012-10-05 11:40
Re: N8x0 Doomsday repositories
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by danramos (Post 1276782)
You seem to be making opposing points within the same sentence. What are you saying?
I mean that there's not a big market for second-hand units while there are still new ones to be had at low prices. For instance, I got my latest one for £60 last summer, and that was the rare (especially in Europe) WiMAX edition.

Quote:
It is still relevant point to make that Nokia really has wretchedly crippled and hobbled
Consider the audience ;-) We all agree on that, but re-iterating doesn't help people make personal backups of the bits they're going to need once the repositories go down.

Quote:
The legal permission to at LEAST distribute closed-source freely may ultimately be the only fix until someone comes along to write an altogether replacement operating system--which we know is unlikely given previous attempts and the closed architecture.
N8x0s are not that closed in that respect, and there are other distributions working fine on them. It's just that there's not enough developer critical mass to polish them (again, the hardware is 6 years old and there are shinier toys available all over the place).

auouymous 2012-10-05 14:31
Re: N8x0 Doomsday repositories
 
I don't want to mirror the repositories but I do want to make sure all the packages I've installed are available in case my device needs to be restored. So here are a couple scripts for anyone who wants to backup their installed packages.

http://maemo.qzx.com/#backup_repos

danramos 2012-10-07 12:49
Re: N8x0 Doomsday repositories
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lma (Post 1276789)
N8x0s are not that closed in that respect, and there are other distributions working fine on them. It's just that there's not enough developer critical mass to polish them (again, the hardware is 6 years old and there are shinier toys available all over the place).
Wait, what? What other distributions will run on an N800? You're not referring to stuff like Mer... which ultimately never really ran very well at all even in their heyday when the N8x0's were still the CURRENT devices.

Quote:
Originally Posted by auouymous (Post 1276856)
I don't want to mirror the repositories but I do want to make sure all the packages I've installed are available in case my device needs to be restored. So here are a couple scripts for anyone who wants to backup their installed packages.

http://maemo.qzx.com/#backup_repos
To that end, why isn't there an IMAGE backup like you get with nandroid on the Android devices (thusly eliminating the need for repositories just to get your system back to where it was before you started experimenting)?

lma 2012-10-07 13:06
Re: N8x0 Doomsday repositories
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by danramos (Post 1277596)
Wait, what? What other distributions will run on an N800?
(Note I said N8x0, most efforts concentrate on the N810 as the keyboard obviously makes things a bit easier). A few efforts I'm aware of include Debian, Gentoo and OpenWRT.

Quote:
To that end, why isn't there an IMAGE backup like you get with nandroid on the Android devices (thusly eliminating the need for repositories just to get your system back to where it was before you started experimenting)?
Isn't that (among other things) what bootmenu is for? ;-)

thedead1440 2012-10-07 13:13
Re: N8x0 Doomsday repositories
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lma (Post 1277603)
Isn't that (among other things) what bootmenu is for? ;-)
And I was thinking Android got the idea from the n900...:D


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