Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Attention:

I relaxed the rule a bit, it takes way too long. Instead of doing 5 paragraphes 2,3,4,5,6. I settled with only 2 paragraph, just paragraph 2 and 3.
Refer to the HWR game thread#35 on this posting.
Thanks for playing,

bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Experiment:
GVM stopclock.
Google>News>2nd topic>2nd and 3rd paragraph, no corrections, did not use shortcuts on HWR, did use 'suggested words'. Why the inconsistence, my old typing habbits, will soon change.

MS word did the letter counts, including space:
Preliminary results:
....................WPM...%Correct...Time(min)..Ri ght..Wrong
Onscreen KB....13.2........98.5.......6.1.........396...... ..6
Thumb KB.......10.3......100.00......9.0..........464... ....0
HWR...............8.6..........98.5......8.1...... ....342.......5

This is maemo HWR on N810. I doubted GVM is going to be way different, I may try someday. In fact using the HWR for typing is really fun, just to see whether the tablet gets it.


Legion
Word Per Min = letters per min/5
Thumb KB = sliding out KB and type with anything you have, I use fingers
HWR = I did not use shortcuts but I do take the suggested word, it helps, especially on names and city

Did I see some posters posting typing speed 40 - 60 WPM? I want to see that when typing on the tablet :)

What is my typing skill and credential? I operated a typing service on college campus for thesis/term paper during my college year and earned my degree. Of course that was before the time of notebook computers.

Edit: results are in, ave of two trials.
I will repeat the whole exercise next week, see 7 more days of learning curve would make any difference.

Preliminary conclusion:
HWR and OnScreenKB are having similar accuracy 98.5%, that says a lot!
With 3 days of learning curve, yes, three days, HWR (8.6) is currently 65% as fast as OnScreenKB (13.2). I will do more practise and see how it fare after 7 more days.

bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Thanks for testing that out, Bun. l wish l had your patience and attention span! Cant wait to see full results.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Everything goes with motivation and the amount of time one has. And today is Friday, TGIF! I really am would like to see the difference. Interesting, people 'estimate' a lot, I bet you 1 $, and I also know who, try to search on this forum, 'implying' (NOT claiming, just implication) about 130 WPM.........BTW, does anybody know what is WPM, word per minute? Word per minute in the typist world is NOT what you think.
Word per minute in fact is word unit (?) per minute. It is 'arbitrary' (maybe with some origin, somebody fill in please) defined 1 word unit equals to 5 letters, space is counted as one letter.

a little off topic........


bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

when ever i try hwr i feel like a monkey screwing a football...guess like underscore i need more patience..

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Some of the commercial HWR systems do learn your writing. The biggie I can think of is Paragraph/Calligrapher, which was the original Newton HWR engine, and is still around in various devices. It's a dictionary-based recognizer, so it tries to recognize entire words, and gets trained when you make word corrections.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

I don't remember if I wrote about my typing speed in this forum or not, but I type around 120 to 130 WPM. Not an estimate -- I graduated my typing class in high school on an IBM Selectric II typing 125 WPM. It may be slightly faster on the computer keyboard.

And, yes.. those numbers are with 'W' (in WPM) = 5 characters. For every incorrect letter, you subtract one word (five characters) from the count. Typical typing test is a timed 3- or 5-minute test. Oh, and spaces don't count. :D

On completely the same subject -- I seriously doubt I'll achieve that speed on the tablet -- the BT keyboard isn't responsive enough, so I have to type slower or it'll completely miss several characters... never mind trying to achieve that speed using the on-screen keyboard!

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

One incorrect letter subtract the whole word and spaces dont count sounds like my experiment protocol is totally goofy :( well, as long as there is a control, the conclusion still valid :o . Thanks for the official info.


bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

If we could only have something like PalmOS' "Graffiti Anywhere" (Thus saving the need for the keyboard/HWR pop-up area)...

Back in my old Palm days, I could graffiti notes during meetings, blindly while keeping my eyes on the speaker, with almost 100% accuracy.
Something I can now only do with a physical keyboard, or a paper pad.

Now, that would be a really compelling reason to switch to HWR...

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Couldn't someone put together a Grafitti rip that would be easily installed? That would be great. I suspect there is a way to do it that is not illegal, though Nokia couldn't, I am sure.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

On the entire ParaGraph/CalliGrapher/PenOffice/PhatWare/RitePen issue, here's an excerpt of part of an email conversation I had with one of the RiteScript people (in a -- semi-successfull -- attempt to interest them in Linux and the Nokia Itablets. Just to un-muddy the waters on the issue of what exactly happened to Newton's HWR after -- well, the Newton:

"It's exactly the other way around: PenOffice has been created by our team (former ParaGraph International then Pen&Internet division of SGI and Vadem) and is based on our CalliGrapher HWR technology. After Microsoft acquired our technologies from the company we've been part of in '99, Phatware (run by our friend and former partner who used to bundle CalliGrapher with his HTC Notes program) stepped forward and licensed PenOffice from that company..."

And yes, I've been confirmed that RiteScript is seriously considering the emerging Linux market, but is (unrealistically?) afraid of the "culture of everything for free" in the Linuxverse.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Has any one been able to get the keyboard from exideas to work on the nit? It is set up to allow 120+ shortcuts.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Yes, via GVM, and works beautifully. Unfortunately, the 120+ shortcuts are with Graffiti, right? And it does NOT work or I do not know how to make it work.

No. They do not have a version for the tablet. Do you happen to have a hacked one? I like that OSkeyboard.


TIA,

bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

It seems to me that lm2 sort of did that, no? I would guess that the modified HWR database he made resides in a single file, that he could upload it, and that a user could download it and have, pretty much, graffiti. That you could even swap out the standard HWR file and the graffiti-ized one at will. I don't know what file it is though.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

I saw your new signiture. Kind of cute ;) . Did some BIG BAD BULLY BAIT make you do it? :mad: Not even a duel? :eek: Dont worry, your Way is always my chosen FIRST-Easiest Way............

Hey Hey, BB PB, it just a joke..........


bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

I'm having grief; lost my MBR on the SD, hence no access to all those (3) systems...
At a conference halfway across the nation, with only my new, still Vista-only, laptop as backup. I'm trying Debian Lenny gpart (dpkg -i --force-depends-versioned into Chinook) as I speak; if I get things back, I'll try the typing experiment on the laptop and the N800 (with pseudoGraffiti) and post results.

(I'm open to suggestions to fix this; AFAIK, the partition table is all that's broken, and there's at least 4 Linux utilities and a couple of Windows (but not, AFAICT, Vista) sharewares that should do the trick by hunting around, recognizing old filesystems, and rebuilding the partition table from that; gpart is among them, and if it fails, I'll try to find the others. (I lost access to my build system, too, of course, so I can't build them from source at the moment... debian may have more, though, if I get that far.) I'm in no great need of advice (yet), or I'd start another thread, but it's welcome if someone has something to say...)

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

I type between 60-80 wpm, and I find my BT keyboard is too slow for me. Have you tried a USB keyboard to see if it's any faster? I've been condsidering it.


Michael

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Another advantage of using HWR: it allows one to insert character between 2 characters. Say, you typed "shotcuts", and you can write a letter 'r' between letters 'o' and 't' carefully, it will squeez out a space to make the word "shortcuts". Obviously, you cannot do this with OSKeyboard.

HWR learning curve continues. I have achieved 100% accuracy by now, speed remains low though. I hope I will NOT be the only one in the whole solar system to use HWR on the tablet........maybe some Martian will be my companion, just a thought.





bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

You can. You just have to position the cursor there, then enter the missing letter. In xterm you have to use the d-pad to go left (or a ctrl-b if you have it easily available), but UI oriented apps should allow you to use the stylus to set the cursor.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

And another obvious tip, you can just write over the wrong letters, i.e., you do not have to erase it, or delete it first, just write on top of it. Overall, I think there is quite some advantage in using HWR vs OSkeyboard, if one willing to go thru the learning curve.


bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

I think it's a mixed bag, and you should be proficient with both. HWR certainly is more generally helpful in portrait mode, but the stylus-board is essential for xterm work, and the finger-board is much better when entering text at a brisk walk.

(For most terminal work, though, you can get by with HWR. Unlike Vista's word-based recognizer, which is useless, and Vista's cell-based recognizer, which while it works quite well, takes way too much screen space. (Out of 1280x800, no less.))

Having a Vista-based tablet has helped show me more clearly what's right and wrong with the tablet's input methods.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Okay, I just picked up a USB keyboard and a USB gender changer, so I can answer my own (off-topic) question.

Typing with a USB keyboard is definitely snappier than with a BT keyboard. But it still lags slightly. If I typed 120 WPM, I'm sure I'd notice it. At my speed, it's fine.

USB Keyboard pros: faster, snappier response, can use on airplanes.

BT Keyboard pros: sexier, smaller, no tangle of cables


Michael

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

So, Vista 'did' serve her purpose, right? as an example of being 'wrong', uh?

Anyhow, I cannot help but keep on stressing that if one is NOT using the shortcuts, you are missing a bunch! I guess this is a computer thing, the shortcuts is very very forgiving, an order of magnitude more forgiving than writing a letter. Partly because the more complicated the pattern (your shortcut graph), the least choice the computer comes up to, so even if it is only remotely similar to the shortcut pattern, it comes up with the correct phrase.

In order to use all 32 shortcuts without forgetting about the patern, one has to come up with some system. Here is how I use it and is very effective.

Say, you are browsing on your pc on iTT and would like to download a link or software to your tablet.

I have a shortcut for,
"http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=".
On the tablet, I open a browser page, script my shortcut and enter the 6 digits for the thread from the PC, i will be right on the page where I want.

How do I remember all 32 shortcuts? I made all my shortcuts using the 1st two digits of the shortcut goals and use script writing to combine them into a pattern. As in the above example, I would script writing "it", as a patern. Script i or script t has been taken, but the combo is not. A couple of more examples,

Fix app manager corruption,
am: dpkg --configure -a

Flexible delay screen shot,
ds: /bin/sh -c 'stamp=`date +%Y-%m-%d-%H-%M`; i=1; while [ -f /media/mmc1/shot-$stamp-`printf %02d $i`.png ]; do i=$((i+1)); done; sleep 25; osso-screenshot-tool /media/mmc1/shot-$stamp-`printf %02d $i`.png'
Flexible in a sense, one change the sleeping time to capture the delay shots.

check battery status and output as battery.log text file on mmc1
bs: battery-status -d 30 > /media/mmc1/battery.log &

USB host
uh: echo host > /sys/devices/platform/musb_hdrc/mode

USB unhost/OTG
uu: echo otg > /sys/devices/platform/musb_hdrc/mode

iTT forums,
it: http://www.internettablettalk.com/fo...wthread.php?t=

To get xmms back after minimize
xm: xmmsctrl main 0 main 1

Remember the computer only has pattern for one alphabet, you should be able to use any combo of 2 or 3 aphabets using script writing as a patern to tie to the shortcuts. The more complicate the patern, the more accurate the shortcuts come up and faster, very counter intuitive. I would have guessed, the more complicate the patern the more difficult for you to reproduce the patern, the more likely it fail. No, aint that interesting?

You got the idea.

Making 32 shortcuts is one thing, to remember all of them without having resort to a list, you need to be systematic.

To summary, as Benson put it nicely, its a mixed bag. There is a learning curve, but I thing it is very rewardable. It is almost like typing on a typrewriter, once you learned it, you have a skill that other tablet user dont have. For me? I am completely sold on HWR, both in programming, xterm, websurf and intense data-entry on gnumeric on a daily basis (I used to do it on PC with x11vnc, not any more :) ).


bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

I have several coworkers want to borrow my shortcuts file, and too lazy to type them in, does anyone know where is the shortcut file located? I could just BT them the file, if that works. I am interested in thread #10 storage files for tricks 2), 3) and 4). TIA,


bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

@bun sorry no i haven't hacked it yet I just remember using it on my lifedrive and finding it much quicker than using graffiti2. If you look at their website though, you will see an n800 with their keyboard. I've asked them if it is running on gvm or if it can run natively.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

For the last month, I made myself using HWR and I am proud to say, I am now very comfortable with HWR. I am using HWR for everything, including working on progs. I am so comfortable with HWR that I started to shy away from progs that do not have such input venue, for e.g. KDE. I may look for a keyboard that has HWR then I may venture back into KDE-like apps. After one month of intensive boot-camp HWR training, is it faster than using OnScreenKB? Unfortunately, not yet, OSK still slightly faster. However, I now acquire one skill that average Tablet user dont, HWR. Like riding a bike, I learned and I now have it.

Today, I have to make a contact into GVM/palm, using HWR, understandly, it becomes very very slow for this 4 years palm veteran. My Nokia HWR style keeps getting in the way, despite the fact that I was still good at palm HWR even as recent as one month ago.

To connect the dots, HWR has a learning curve. Nokia or Palm cannot just build it and give it to you. The user has to take initiative/motivation to acquire it, like riding a bike. The nokia HWR is absolutely NOT inferior than palm, it is a different one and one has to unlearn palm and (re-)learn Nokia. Try to remember, for those palm users and are complaining about the Nokia HWR, did you forget those learning days when you first use palm?

I repeat one more time, HWR from the tablet is NOT inferior than palm, it is just different. I CAN say it, because I am a USER.

HWR fulltime user,

Edit: Where is the HWR boot camp? It is in your WILL. You just to tell yourself there is NO OSK, everything is HWR, you do it for a couple of week, you will start to get comfortable. AND continue doing it, you will then become, ummm....., bilingual? As one humming along, you start to build your library of shortcuts. By now, my shortcuts is over 16, anything I have to use more than a couple of time, I made a shortcut.

Edit: Whoever using HWR on a regular basis, I mean have your input method set to HWR, please identify yourself,
1) you have a skill that average tablet user dont, i.e., you are tablet bilingual :)
2) contrast on the HWR between Nokia and palm, in particular, is one better than the other?
TIA,




bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

Am I really the only one doing HWR on the tablets in the whole galaxy?

Would someone just stand up............pleeeeeeeeease!

bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

I use it sometimes, not always. It's possible to get it pretty much like Graffiti2 on the Palm, and it's ok. I've been using a Palm for years, so I'm used to it, but I just don't do that much input on my Nokia, so I don't use HWR that often. It works well enough, but I'm just not that excited about it, either way.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

It's just too painful and embarrassing. Certainly compared to my Newtons, but even the Decuma Alphabetic on my SE P910i runs rings around Nokia's "offering".

Like sgosnell, I no longer consider the Itablet an input-friendly device. I use it to consume content (and slowly but increasingly less so, I'm afraid), not to create it.

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

One more shortcut; after typing a few letters, press the tab key will show some suggested word to pick from - this is from the grand master fanoush.

Thanks, big guy.

bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

dont see that happening here...

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

xterm
l (tab tab key)
screen > a page of l commands

c (tab tab key)
screen > a page of c commands

m (tab tab key)
screen > a page of m commands

Well, it gives some hint for the newbies :-)

bun

Re: I finally found you:shortcuts for repetitive typing!
 

ah, tab completion in xterm. i thought it was the input system in general...

even cmd on windows have tab completion these days (if one know where in the registry to turn it on).