Cor, I can't tell much from the UI sketches on the 770.

Sorry, I *live* by the buttons!! One of my gripes isthe pair of Mag icons in the Opera toolbar. What a waste!! Optimized View should be there (or your 4th or 5th front button!). Going to the menu for OV is ¥#%@!!

Oh, I understand completely. Some people like to be able to "feel" what they are doing more than "see" what they're doing. It's what makes us all so special. ;) Also some people just have grown up using buttons all their life and rather not change that way of working with things like this.

I do find it kind of funny that some of the same people that scream for change are yelling to keep things the same. Sort of an inner conflict. In fact, I think I may have that problem at times. :D Guess that's some flaw somewhere in the decision making skills. Anyway, I'm getting way too much into psychology here.

I'm going to work on some more sketches over the next week in my spare time to come up with a "happy medium" of sorts that doesn't make anyone cringe too much. :)

I think my gripes have been 95% software, 5% CPU/RAM. Well, throw in there a *suggestion* for an OQO-likee sliding keyboard. The exterior hardware hasn't been an issue with me. Just the guts!

Apple wouldn't like that at all; they recently took out "patents" on multiple input touchscreen user interfaces.

Mind you, they didn't actually develop such a touchscreen, they just took dibs on how to use it, should anyone ever be actually productive and make one.

Jobs is a nutter.

So, if the OSS community produces a "working" solution, does it still violate patent law?

I know the multiple simultaneous input idea can't be done through software, but looking at things a little closely, we already have caps lock functionality.

Here's what I think: the Apple patents on a user interface without any hardware tied to them, are shameful. It is nothing short of extortion on future creativity. I would go so far as to state that, if I were to meet Steve Jobs in a dark alley, I would kick him in the 'nads.

And drop a dustbin on his head while he was down.

As to your earlier question: the Apple patents are on algorythms, gestures and a general philosophy, not on anything specific. As far as I can see, any working solution would violate them. Obviously, even a patet court in the middle of the Gobi desert would throw Apple's claims out, because they're so ludicrously generic, but in the mean time it would have cost some OSS developer money, plus given Apple time to steal his idea.

Compare it to the mafia-style way Apple is coming down on anyone who dares to use "i" or "pod" in their product name. It's silly, nearly criminal and unwinnable in court, but nevertheless countless small businesses and individuals have cringed and ran from a "Cease and desist" letter from the Apple vult^H^H^H^Hlawyers.

That's how patents work. And they do eventually expire.

As for podcast, it's because Apple is trying to snag a trademark on "iPodcast." Too bloody late, I say, and so far the USPTO isn't granting it.

People say the word should be changed. I agree.

Maybe. They have not been granted yet, though, I think.

And even if they were, we don't know what Apple intend to do with the patents - they can either sue OSS practitioners over infringement (and lose serious amounts of kudos) or grant the OSS community immunity from prosecution.

We're pre-judging Apple here - IBM have been granted thousands of fundamental software patents, yet they have handed over several hundred patents to the OSS community. Who is to say Apple won't do the same? Maybe Apple are claiming the patent before Microsoft do - who would you rather held the patent, Apple or M$? :)

If they were trying to protect the word "iPodcast", I'd be in half a mind to support them. They are, however, trying to bully people out of using the term "podcast', one letter but a huge difference.

Neither. I have no problems however with IBM, who have grokked Open Source perfectly.

Not that it's my job to defend them, but I thought they were going after two specific companies who are, themselves, trying to trademark the term "podcast"; and used "made for iPod" or somesuch on their marketing material.

Cheers,

Andrew

Considering significant parts of Mac OS X are based on OSS derivatives, I hold out the hope that Apple are more on board when it comes to OSS than Microsoft.

If Apple want to start picking fights with the OSS community, I wonder if OSS software can be licensed for "free use by anyone but Apple Corp."? :)

Not to mention that Trademarks and Patents are very different things.

Trademarks are about brand ownership, which should not be exploited by others unchallenged otherwise Apple risk losing all claims of ownership; Patents are about intelectual property and here Apple have the option to enforce their ownership or not, and if they decide not to enforce they do not lose ownership.

Milhouse,

Indeed, and having worked at IBM and having got a couple of software patents to my name I'm aware of both the good and bad that software patents bring.

Nevertheless, they do exist and for big tech companies it's often a case of patenting practically anything they can to form a MAD-like "patent shield".

As has been said, it's what a company does with its patents, rather than the patents they apply for.

Cheers,

Andrew

Both Engadget and SlashDot have reported cases where Apple's lawyers sent C&D letters to people/companies who named their product (which, I hasten to add, had absolutely nada to do with "portabe", "music", "playing" and/or "downloading") something with "pod" in it.

I think someone should remind Jobs -- preferrably with a 2-by-4 -- that, if your product name is turning into a generic denominator, there is exactly nothing you can do about it.

Wow, so far afield of my initial post!

No matter...

Well there is - by enforcing your trademark you reduce the risk of genericide, which is precisely what Apple Computer Inc. appear to be doing.

If Apple Computer Inc are going after people/companies who use the term "pod" for non-portable, non-music playing and non-downloading musical devices then it is actually quite ironic - even hypocritical, and possibly without merit - when you consider the recent legal verdict handed down in the recent Apple Corps Ltd. vs. Apple Computer Inc. courtroom drama. The court found in Apple Computers favour, focusing mainly on the following clause from the original Apple vs. Apple agreement:

The way I read it, as long as these "pod" devices make no reference to Apple Computer Inc., have nothing to do with music playback or recording, and basically cannot be confused with an iPod, then I see little reason why Apple should resort to sending out the C&D letters (pot, kettle).

On the other hand, if these devices do fall into the "Apple Computer Field of Use" then yes, Apple Computer has every right to enforce it's trademark in whatever way it sees fit.

...two bastions of journalistic integrity and accuracy.

Cheers,

Andrew

PS. I'm afraid I don't remember the details of the news reports in question (though do remember seeing the Slashdot article and the subsequent clarifications of the restrictions based on the field of use in the comments), but I largely agree with Milhouse's assessment.

Let's say that I agree with what Milhouse wrote Apple should do. Other than that, I'm going to let this part of the thread slide; I'm already sorry I brought it up. :o

Just in time. Here are the new drawings I cooked up. Let me know what you all think.
[3] [4]
And the previous sketches...
[2] [1]

I like #4 a lot (no, make that A LOT), but not #3 (I think the tablet should stay usable without a keyboard, sliding or separate or whatever, and the three buttons beneath the rocker would be unusable as shown anyway...).
Well done !

Ditto; I especially like the way that the device layout means it can be used in three orientations, and all three orientations have the buttons placed most sensibly.

Totally agree about the three layouts, that idea is simply brilliant! Combined with a tilt sensor, it'll be made automagically...

My own favourite accessory would be a portable docking station:

http://www.bleb.org/misc/770-docking-station.jpg

It'd feature a USB hub, power pack, port replicator, desktop stand, ethernet (using USB); 770 slots in the top and you've got a powerful portable workstation; slip it out and you've got a portable internet tablet.

Versions with a slide-up keyboard or built-in USB hard disk are also possible; not necessarily part of the core idea, but if necessary to be built, I could live with 20GB of storage :-)

Cheers,

Andrew

PS. Forgive the really very poor Gimp skills which demonstrate it, whether you end up using the speaker and D-pad on the 770, or replicate them and only expose the screen is a matter of design.

I hate small keyboards. I took the flip of my SE P910 because pecking those chicklets was even worse than the half-arsed Jot character recognizer (I now use Decuma Alphabetic, which is a lot better, despite the fact that it relies on a dedicated input area). Heck, I can barely tolerate the keyboard on my Psion 5MX and that's universally acknowledged as the best keyboard on a handheld ever.

If the 770 had HWR that actually worked, people wouldn't be so fixated on dumb-pads. As a comparison: on the Newton (yes, I'm incorrigible) mailing list, keyboard-related threads are quite scarce.

You proposal for a universal portrait mode rockxxx though, provided it can be implemented without making the installed software base obsolete.

Thanks everyone. Yeah, I like the fourth design better also. I think the tilt sensor idea is awesome as well. Andrew's portable docking station is something I would have never thought of either. I like it! I was thinking of the cover maybe sliding horizontally and leaving everything but the screen exposed. And have the cover made of some sort of clear [scratch resistant] plastic in order to operate the tablet without removing the cover.

I still wonder what potential the device has that is hidden, think of the connector in the battery compartment. Of course it is a test point and serial but there are a bunch more connections in there.

SIM card, CF or likes output, system bus expansion????



I think a built in GPS would be nice too, lately I've come up with the idea that a location alarm would be nice. Leave a particualar area and an alarm is triggered. Really though, a slide out keyboard would make surfing so much easier.


I have no doubts that the dsp scaling can be utilized to make this a nice media machine with mplayer as the provider. If anyone has noticed the new Nokia media server device has a bluetooth button, I think I can see where the 770 will profit from that :)

Man. All this from a survey oriented at software.

I like the idea of a window on the case so you can still see the screen. Maybe a slidebar with the magnet on it so you can choose whether the screen is on or off with the cover on.

Otherwise, I really think the existing hardware platform should be tapped for all it's worth. Back in the day, programmers had to cram everything they could into 65K of memory. There was crazy innovation and skill. Now, we live in a world of bloat where a bleedin word processor needs a P4 2.0GHz to function.

Are the requirements that low? :)

so... a transparent cover which permits to see the screen while still on and perhaps with a tactile keyboard in the transparent layer...
BINGO!
The problem could be how to get the power for the keyboard, but a simple brush connector could be enough...

I like #3, but want a larger Spacebar. Teeny Spacebars have stopped me many times from importing stuff from Japan. I also think the 3 buttons should remain horizontal. Damn nice work.

I hope Nokia shocks us all with even more!

Here's my idea of how the case would work for #4. It would probably need more space between the left part of the screen and the D-pad and other buttons to be ergonomic.

As for #3, I guess a couple buttons next to the space bar could make way for a longer space bar. Also it's just a matter of flipping the buttons 90 degrees to suit your needs. Everyone feel free to play around with my drawings to change, add, or remove anything you would like.

Guys,

I've compiled your suggestions about a faster processor, better input method, more RAM, etc and come up with the following:

http://img106.imageshack.us/img106/8599/lappyvw0.jpg

Unfortauntely it raises the price by about a thousand bucks.

Sarcastically yours,
Hedge

Now that is the future of computing. :D

(trying an on-topic post for a change)

I took the Nokia poll on the Tableteer site today and started out with the intention not to be nice. What I find remarkable is that, although many, many aspects of the 770 which I consider important to me (webbrowser, HWR, editor, file manager, application manager, ...) are badly implemented in the device, I nevertheless am not dissatisfied with it.

Mind you, it's not a glaring endorsement, but somehow the 770, with all its deficiencies and shortcomings, still manages to bring a smile to my face everytime I whip it out. It' sometimes a very short-lived smile, but nevertheless... :cool:

Suffice to say that, as far as I'm concerned, Nokia made a big mistake by providing me with a textbox to give my personel comments. Still, I managed to keep it under a thousand words. :rolleyes:

That survey was too constricting. I don't have a cell phone. I don't want a cell phone. Phones are the worst invention of all time. They're one of the only ones that require immediate attention and constantly interrupt our lives. The last thing I want is a portable annoyance strapped to me. (You can guess how I reacted to the fashion accessory question).

It has yet to make me smile, although the near-miracle 6-8 open Opera windows vs 2-3 with OS 2005 came close. The closest to joy I've gotten was aflegg's YouTube converter -- which is no thanks to Nokia!

Someone earlier mentioned the seemingly-silly phone Qs. I think Nokia knows who's buying the 770. The As to those Qs will just confirm it for them further.

I doubt there is any overlap between 770 owners and owners of this:

http://www.mobile-review.com/review/vertu-en.shtml

Well I bought my first phone when I ordered the 770. A Nokia of course, just to be sure they'd work well together. I hardly ever speak into it, mostly it serves as a modem for the tablet :-)