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-   -   2012 Coding Competition (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=83761)

Custodian 2012-05-17 13:51
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
maemo.org Coding Competition 2012 sounds quite well

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsellout (Post 1207817)
+1 on the limiting it to new apps, it can get confusing to voters how much work has been done for the competition and is unfair on new submissions when competing against something that is much more polished.
what about apps, that has been released years ago, and havent been maintained or even dont do their functions?

I vote for an "Best update" (or "Long start" or whatever) category for such apps. There will be stimul for developing, and chance to compete with others ;)

zehjotkah 2012-05-17 15:14
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by helex (Post 1207733)
The name MeeGo is simply outdated.
Read again... ;) "MaeGo" ;)


Okay, then lets start to think about the categories.
Should we have as many categories as main prizes (N950s)?

helex 2012-05-17 21:23
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1207851)
Read again... ;) "MaeGo" ;)


Okay, then lets start to think about the categories.
Should we have as many categories as main prizes (N950s)?
20 different categories?!

Mmh... I would say lets consider at maximum 7 categories
  • +1 categorie for updates to existing applications
  • +1 categorie for portings of old applications from the N900 (or older) to the N9
  • +1 categorie for Tablets (all maemo based Tablets until the N810) and all other Tablets and open source projects with official Qt support

So we would get 10 categories (perhaps fewer because many developers have left the community) and have 20 devices.

I would say, 1 device at each category as main prize and the remaining devices are spread depending how many contributors we get in each category. At example a games category with 20 entrys and a Office category with only 3. We need to discuss a system how to spread the remaining 10 devices but I would say 3 N9(50) for a category with 20 entrys would be more fairer in comparsion to only a single device.

Hm, something like this. I'm not sure. It's a idea. Does anyone out there like it? :)

zehjotkah 2012-05-18 06:07
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Last year we had 8 categories (http://competition.meetmeego.org/) plus the beginner category.
The probem with your third category is, that we can't test these apps due to lack of hardware (other tablets)...
We have 25 N950, so we should have about 12 categories.

I like your idea to spread the devices depending on the amount of submissions in each category, though.

Estel 2012-05-18 06:33
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
As for Coding Competition, I *think* (= it's just a suggestion) that it would be great to recognize multi-platform programs, i.e. ones that are (and will) be developed constantly for both Maemo 5 and Harmattan, at least.

The more platform-independent code, the better - after start of COBS, it should be even much easier to target multiple platforms, so we should already promote good practices.

timoph 2012-05-18 07:10
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Estel (Post 1208407)
As for Coding Competition, I *think* (= it's just a suggestion) that it would be great to recognize multi-platform programs, i.e. ones that are (and will) be developed constantly for both Maemo 5 and Harmattan, at least.

The more platform-independent code, the better - after start of COBS, it should be even much easier to target multiple platforms, so we should already promote good practices.
Yep. I'd also put weight in apps being cross-platform. Maybe the theme of the competition could be cross platform / portability? For example with Qt that isn't even hard to do since just by using Qt you're writing for multiple platforms by default.

Personally I'd drop updates to existing applications from the competition unless it's close to a complete rewrite. At least I would like to see *new* interesting apps as a results of this competition.

MartinK 2012-05-18 07:28
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Well, I would say long term updates are rather important. IMHO an incrementally developed and up to date application > half finished on-off application that goes unmaintained a while after release. :)

Estel 2012-05-18 08:06
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Of course, but it sounds like good candidate for Community Awards, not exactly Coding Competition. the latter, both historically and ideologically, was always focused on influencing creation of *new* things.

Now, it can also promote good coding practices, via focus on multiple target platforms.

/Estel

pipould 2012-05-18 09:23
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
I'm in, hope it will be interesting :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Estel (Post 1208407)
As for Coding Competition, I *think* (= it's just a suggestion) that it would be great to recognize multi-platform programs, i.e. ones that are (and will) be developed constantly for both Maemo 5 and Harmattan, at least.

The more platform-independent code, the better - after start of COBS, it should be even much easier to target multiple platforms, so we should already promote good practices.
Well, it's already quite easy to dev both for S^3 and Meego, just a question of target, I would say even too easy (just resolution and icons changes). Then about Maemo/Meego... I don't know, I just started to dev in Qt/Qml few months ago...

Venemo 2012-05-18 10:29
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Hey guys!

I have a bunch of good ideas and stuff that'd be nice to do. Such as, releasing some of the unreleased apps for Harmattan, backporting my apps for Maemo 5, and I also have some new ideas to implement.

However, I already received an N950 from the original meego.com device program. Am I still eligible for this?

I of course wouldn't want another N950, but I could definitely use an N9. :)

helex 2012-05-18 10:35
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1208399)
Last year we had 8 categories (http://competition.meetmeego.org/) plus the beginner category.
I had last year the feeling we have toooo many cateories and not enought contributors. In the end it was fine, but I don't know how many developers are still around maemo for this year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1208399)
The probem with your third category is, that we can't test these apps due to lack of hardware (other tablets)...
Good point. I had this doubts already last year (I had a ExoPC, but who else) so I thought this is not a reason against such kind of applications. :)

So no Tablets, only maemo Mobiles. :)

Hm, but in this case... what about your mentioned N810?
I was at example born in the maemo world at the point the N900 was released. So no N810 over here. :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1208399)
We have 25 N950, so we should have about 12 categories.

I like your idea to spread the devices depending on the amount of submissions in each category, though.
Thanks. Perhaps "How to spread?" will get a different question. But lets see first which categories we could have this year. :)

I would vote for a special "Apps made by helex" category! :D

b0unc3 2012-05-18 11:18
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
25 Devices, 12 Categories?
IMHO I would like to avoid to create useless categories where there will be one/two entries, instead I would like to see the standard categories strengthened by giving prizes (device) until the 3rd or something like that.

zehjotkah 2012-05-18 17:47
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Venemo (Post 1208564)
However, I already received an N950 from the original meego.com device program. Am I still eligible for this?

I of course wouldn't want another N950, but I could definitely use an N9. :)
Quim said that instead of N950s, N9s could be sended.

qgil 2012-05-18 18:35
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1208796)
Quim said that instead of N950s, N9s could be sended.
The only problem is about logistics: 75 devices will have been hopefully sent by the time the Coding Competition winners are nominated. This means that we will have no choice at that point.

Let me know how many N950 / N9 you want for the prizes and we will act accordingly.

szopin 2012-05-18 18:36
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Venemo (Post 1208564)
Hey guys!

I have a bunch of good ideas and stuff that'd be nice to do. Such as, releasing some of the unreleased apps for Harmattan, backporting my apps for Maemo 5, and I also have some new ideas to implement.

However, I already received an N950 from the original meego.com device program. Am I still eligible for this?

I of course wouldn't want another N950, but I could definitely use an N9. :)
LOL? As qgil stated in another thread, these N950s would be 'owned', so you can easily sell it and get 4 N9s in the process...

zehjotkah 2012-05-18 19:19
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
I think we'll take the N950s... ;)

helex 2012-05-18 20:07
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1208843)
I think we'll take the N950s... ;)
Hm, in this case I guess I would be unable to win anyting. I will participate anyway, but I just want to mention it... ;)

Hm, the N950 devices from last year were lent, so perhaps it is fine to give it to someone else after receiving a new N950 (which is this time owned) from this compitition?

Venemo 2012-05-18 20:50
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by szopin (Post 1208822)
LOL? As qgil stated in another thread, these N950s would be 'owned', so you can easily sell it and get 4 N9s in the process...
Seriously?
Huh, that's awesome.
So, there's another question: am I eligible?

szopin 2012-05-18 21:14
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
You can probably get 2000$ for one (if lucky? or is it low, considering 40 becoming available and hundreds are looking for such a toy, who knows if not more, legality of those could lower the price, all sold so far were illegally passed as loan prohibited this, so the price might go down, time will tell), for a second hand N9... maybe even 6:1 is the right appraisal.

The Wizard of Huz 2012-05-18 22:28
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
I would like to participate, but I still need to learn QT. How long does one need to learn QT?
And is PyQT easier to learn?
Is PyQT better/worse than QT?
I did JAVA a little bit but don't know C+

Wonko 2012-05-18 23:01
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Wizard of Huz (Post 1208953)
I would like to participate, but I still need to learn QT. How long does one need to learn QT?
And is PyQT easier to learn?
Is PyQT better/worse than QT?
I did JAVA a little bit but don't know C+
"Just do it!" ;)

I think it's worth the effort in any case. No matter if you win some price or not. If you have fun coding and you improve your skills you are already a winner.

As for the technical side: I would suggest to go with QML. One has to differentiate between the Qt C++ stuff and QML quite heavily.
QML itself is, I'd say, pretty easy to learn and you have the benefit (development-wise) that it is interpreted. Hence, you can easily hack on your device and develop very quickly without needing any compile steps.
And if you go with PySide (that's the python binding stuff for Qt) you gain even more flexibility. But, honestly, I don't know if PySide is actually maintained currently and if there are aims to port it to Qt 5.

qgil 2012-05-18 23:16
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
http://www.developer.nokia.com/Develop/Qt/ and I also recommend you to try Qt Quick / QML in the first place. If you are interested, my first hand experience (as a non-programmer) can be found here.

PySide activity, see commits and release tags in the past weeks: http://qt.gitorious.org/pyside

No idea about Qt but I would understand if nobody touches it before Qt 5 itself is at least beta. Anyway, we are digressing. No newbie needs to put their hands in Qt 5 at this point.

MartinK 2012-05-20 09:56
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wonko (Post 1208967)
And if you go with PySide (that's the python binding stuff for Qt) you gain even more flexibility. But, honestly, I don't know if PySide is actually maintained currently and if there are aims to port it to Qt 5.
As PySide recently became part of the Qt Project, it would be weird if it didn't support Qt 5 in the future. :) Also, the latest release is about a month old.

Estel 2012-05-20 11:13
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
If I recall correctly, "we" have 40 N950's and 60 N9's.

As we have 4 "device seeding" main categories - while coding competition is only one of them - it sounds logical to set "default" as 10 N950's and 15 N9's. If, due to - for example - less devices being used for niche categories like qt5 - their could be used for CC.

I hope that things like Community Awards won't get hurt by CC participants apetite for N950. I don't see any reason why 25 of 40 N950's should be allocated to coding competition.

/Estel

Dead1nside 2012-05-20 12:18
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
I have been thinking for a while about doing something like Firefox Home on the iPhone. I know that we have Fennec on both the N900 and N9 etc., but I like to use the Firefox Sync capability as a password storage and retrieval mechanism. By building a client that can access the Firefox Sync database, and perhaps generate passwords and facilitate easy copying and pasting, this would make my online life easier and hopefully securer as I used all randomised passwords making life a bit difficult, if secure sometimes :)

I'm completely new to Qt though, with a bit of C++ experience.

Wonko 2012-05-21 15:13
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
With respect to the voting system I think it was already proposed to use the one we used for last years competition. I also think, we should "formalize" the voting system as soon as possible in order to avoid any hassle later on.

So, for last years competition we decided to use FTSTV (Fractional Transfer Single Transferable Vote) with a script created by neal to establish an order amongst the participants.
Code:
election=$1

tail -n 1 $election | sed 's/"//g'

>/tmp/result
for i in $(seq $(expr $(head -c 2 $election) - 1))
do
  openstv-run-election -r CsvReport -s $i FTSTV $election \
    | awk -F, '/Elected/ { print $1 }' \
    | while read w
        do if ! grep -q "$w" /tmp/result
          then
            echo $w >> /tmp/result
            break
          fi
        done
done
awk 'BEGIN { i = 1; } { print i, $0; i++; }' /tmp/result | sed 's/"//g'
Which is run as follows:
Code:
for i in *.blt; do sh results $i; done
iirc, the above code of the script needs to be stored in a file named "results" that is called from the for-loop quoted above.

You can find neals post where he posted this script there: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php...36#post1132136
Furthermore, on this page of last years thread there are many posts that explain the situation etc.: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=71561&page=89

If it helps I would volunteer for counting the votes this time as well. But I would like some other people to do the counting as well in order to avoid errors or concerns. Generally, the results via the proposed system above should be reproducible by everyone.

Edit: You can get the openstv version we used also last time from: http://packages.debian.org/squeeze/openstv
You can simply extract the exectuble from the debian package.

sakya 2012-05-23 10:27
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
I'd like to partecipate to the coding competition, how should I submit my application?
The wiki just links to this topic.
Is there some place with more info (like the deadline) or I just have to wait?

Thanks

misiak 2012-05-23 12:27
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sakya (Post 1211260)
I'd like to partecipate to the coding competition, how should I submit my application?
The wiki just links to this topic.
Is there some place with more info (like the deadline) or I just have to wait?

Thanks
+1, I want to participate, I'm coding some stuff, if I relase soon (next 1-2 weeks) an alpha-quality version, will I be still able to participate? Rephrasing the question: will only apps released after certain date be allowed to enter or basically any up which is relatively new (few weeks old at most)?

zehjotkah 2012-05-23 14:14
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
The submissions-period hasn't started yet.
So it would be better for you to continue developing your app, so it has beta or final quality when the submission period starts.
I expect it to start mid June.

zehjotkah 2012-05-24 07:21
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Hi everyone!
Good news!
We'll relaunch competition.meetmeego.org in a new design, close to the maemo.org design.
If you have a proposal for a new banner (instead of the Berlin skyline) please let me know.

The old site will continue to be available as working backup.

Now we need to agree on categories.

To start brainstorming:
The ones from last year:
- Business & Office
- Games
- Desktop (Widgets)
- Fun & Strange
- Graphics & Multimedia
- Location & Navigation
- Network & Communication
- System & Utilities
- plus one Beginner Prize possible from any category (like last year)

New rule: just new apps allowed, no updates to existing apps, except in the new category "Best update to an existing app".

New categories:
- Best Qt app
- Best update to an existing app
- Multi-Platform-Award (if your app runs on as many platforms (all maemo flavours, Harmattan, Nemo, Desktop, MeeGo, BB10, WebOS, Android, iOS, you name it) as possible)

Would make 12 categories.
I'd love to have fewer. What do you think about killing those which had the fewest submissions last year?
i.e. "Desktop (Widgets)" and "Fun & Strange" (check http://competition.meetmeego.org/categories for an overview)
Now we would be at 10 categories.


How many N950s?
What about as many N950 as we have categories, to have one N950 per category?

1st prize: N950
(if winner has a N950 already, a N9 will automatically be the 1st prize, N950 will be the 2nd prize
or
1st prize winner can decide to take a N9 instead of the N950 (but could also decide to go with the N950 despite of having one already).
I'd like to see all N950 in hands of devs instead of on ebay)

2nd prize: N9 (N950 if 1st prize winner decides to take the N9)

3rd prize: money from community fund


Please let me know your thoughts.

nicolai 2012-05-24 07:29
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1211755)
Hi everyone!
Good news!
We'll relaunch competition.meetmeego.org in a new design, close to the maemo.org design.
If you have a proposal for a new banner (instead of the Berlin skyline) please let me know.
Please use different colours (at least the text colour).

Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1211755)
New rule: just new apps allowed, no updates to existing apps.
....
New categories:
- Best Qt app
- Best update to an existing app
?

zehjotkah 2012-05-24 07:41
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolai (Post 1211758)
Please use different colours (at least the text colour).
Do you mean different colors than at the moment, or different colors than maemo.org?
The idea was to use exact the same colors as maemo.org to subline that it is the "maemo.org coding competition".


Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolai (Post 1211758)
?
just new apps allowed in every category despite except category "Best update to existing app".
This category is for all the updates, to encourage making updates to existing apps and not abandon them, but not put highly developed apps in competition with new apps.


@all
I made also some edits to the last post, maybe re-read it...

nicolai 2012-05-24 07:47
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1211761)
Do you mean different colors than at the moment, or different colors than maemo.org?
Different colors than the last time. This ugly pink was hard to read :-)

zehjotkah 2012-05-24 07:58
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
We have a wiki-page: http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_coding_competition_2012

ivgalvez 2012-05-24 10:42
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
I agree that "Desktop(widgets)" and "Fun&Strange" could fit into just a "Others" category.

kojacker 2012-05-24 11:12
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Hey zehjotkah, I had the same query as nicolai :p I think what you're proposing is that the new rule ("New rule: just new apps allowed, no updates to existing apps") applies to the existing 9 categories, ie.

- Business & Office
- Games
- Desktop (Widgets)
- Fun & Strange
- Graphics & Multimedia
- Location & Navigation
- Network & Communication
- System & Utilities
- plus one Beginner Prize possible from any category

and any other category(s) that might be introduced later - except for the special category for updates ("Best update to existing app").

Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1211761)
just new apps allowed in every category despite category "Best update to existing app".
In that case, I'd suggest 'except' is maybe a clearer word than 'despite' to use. Or I might have it all wrong :)

The only risk to the 'new apps only' rule is that it's sure to cut down the number of entries, so there may be too many categories. It would look bad if there were lots of categories but only a few entries in each.

I'd miss the "Fun & Strange" category if it went, even though it's not often over subscribed with entries it does raise some gems and a few smiles - who can forget rmerren's entry 'Old School' (Old School for n900) or helex's entry 'N900 X-Ray' (N900-X-Ray - this will convert your N900 into a hi-resolution mobile X-Ray unit) lol :p We definitely need to keep a place somewhere for the eccentric side of maemo.org, even if it's just a catch-all 'others' category ;)

I think that N900 X-Ray thread is one of my favorites on maemo.org :p And this follow up thread n900 xray is it real??? too .. in fact maybe we should have a category where the winner is the application that generates the best threads with the most ridiculous replies :D

Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1211768)
And our first donation pledge to the community bounty ;)

http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_codi...ity_Prize_Fund

Elleo 2012-05-24 12:32
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1211755)
New rule: just new apps allowed, no updates to existing apps.
What's the cut off point for things being counted as being "new"?

zehjotkah 2012-05-24 13:50
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kojacker (Post 1211839)
In that case, I'd suggest 'except' is maybe a clearer word than 'despite' to use. Or I might have it all wrong :)
Oh yes, you're right. That's what I meant. Sorry, not a native english speaker over here... :o

Quote:
Originally Posted by kojacker (Post 1211839)
And our first donation pledge to the community bounty ;)

http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_codi...ity_Prize_Fund
You're the best!

@all do you want to use the same (my) paypal account again?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Elleo (Post 1211876)
What's the cut off point for things being counted as being "new"?
All apps released and submitted within the (yet to be announced) timeframe.
I hope to get the new instance of the submission site online this week or end of week, so it will start soon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kojacker (Post 1211839)
The only risk to the 'new apps only' rule is that it's sure to cut down the number of entries, so there may be too many categories. It would look bad if there were lots of categories but only a few entries in each.
Hopefully the N950s as prizes will overcome this risk...

zehjotkah 2012-05-24 14:21
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
New category proposal:

1. Business & Office
2. Games
3. Graphics & Multimedia
4. Location & Navigation
5. Network & Communication
6. Others
7. System & Utilities
8. Update to an existing app

9. Beginner-Award (one from any category)
10. Multi-Platform-Award (one from any category)

Categories 1 to 7: Only new apps allowed (released within the competitions timeframe).

Now we would have 8 categories to fill up. I've remove the "Best Qt-App" category, because I think 99% of the apps will be developed using Qt/QML, so it's not an achievement anymore like last year, where the N9 was new and different to the N900-development with hildon.

Please let me know what you think! :)

ivgalvez 2012-05-24 15:28
Re: 2012 Coding Competition
 
It seems fine to me. And don't forget to repost the Paypal account.

We should also start collecting proposals to give some handy ideas to the developers.


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