Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

Also sony123 and qwazix,

Now that your'll have BB10 loaded what's all this hype about 70k apps being there at launch? Some say that 1k are native apps while the remaining 69k are Android ports, Web apps, downright ridiculous apps and Playbook apps that are unusable due to small buttons etc...

Could your'll share a bit more on it?

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

PR bullshite as usual. Of course many will be glorified web links and crude ports, just as with any new platform. They just want to get the numbers up so they can have a nice big headline figure reported by the bloggers and tech journos. I don't think it's the best way to attract users to a platform. I think most people are savvy enough to notice if the quality is poor.

Free app quality is no were near what we have on our N9.

Most game apps are web games

Still there are some good apps.

My bigger problem is that dev device only connecting Tmobile USA edge. Not even 3G.

Anyone else experiencing this?
Does it have 3G/4G support?

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

The bolded, by me. section above seems to be true. Don't know actual numbers but I usually end up removing most of the apps I download. Never happened on the N9/00. Today the android runtime has crashed and all android apps come up as black, I presume until reboot.
Another interesting experience is that I downloaded a fine android pdf viewer, but the mail client still complains there's no viewer. Fortunately there's access to the filesystem from both apps so I did my job, but I wouldn't expect that app to pass QA.

I noticed it works about everywhere after the latest update, but it surely works in the hub.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

I also find myself deleting downloaded apps more often than not : p

Android compatibility layer is a double sword... I only came across a few good apps and hope there is a way to filter out Android apps. Qt apps are currently not much better, many of them for playbook and don't work well on BB10. Native Cascade apps are the best, of course. However, good titles are showing up day by day, e.g today I saw the familiar Sports Tracker.

It is a shame I couldn't get the most basic Facebook/Twitter to work on dev alpha. It seems like a common problem...

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

I heard that BB10 can be installed on the Playbook. Would you recommend that I buy one now?

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

I wouldn't...

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

I was thinking the same thing since I can buy a new 64gb Playbook for under $200.00. But I think it's best to wait until they release the update for BB10 and see how it runs on the Playbook. Also, the price might drop a little more by then. :)

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

I resorted to the mobile twitter website which works really well. One launcher that I downloaded couldn't do copy&paste or open outside links.

Does anyone have a Z10? I wonder if there are any performance differences that matter between it and the Dev Alpha devices.

I am also curious about the app situation in BB World. I saw that Angry Birds is available now, but what about some of the other show-stopper apps that they announced were "committed to" BB10, like WhatsApp, Skype, etc.? Also, I saw a vid for a free app called Nobex radio that looked solid, plus I know that some of the developers on this forum code for BB10, so it can't be too bad, right?

If apps are of this quality, that'd be good enough for me: Nobex Radio for BlackBerry 10, http://youtu.be/97kbqyE-ZH0

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

I wait for Jolla and then decide. If both fail I'll get a Nexus 4 and wait for another mobile OSS.

And maybe get a Firefox OS device to play with and flash my N9 with Nemo or Sailfish.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

BB10 is probably just as good as iOS and WP is for application developers. But I couldn't port ProfileMatic to it, the APIs just are not there at the moment.

But hey, at the last minute, I did "Date Difference Calculator" just to have something there. So go ahead and download it, and calculate how much time you have until the next end of the world date :).

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

Don't have a Z10 at the moment, but I know where one's located. The Z10 will have 2gb RAM whereas the Dev Alpha B has only 1gb. That will make a difference under load.

I have to mirror what Marxian said earlier. Of the proposed 70k, so far I've seen a lot of poor Android ports or apps that were the same app, but specific to one area or city - like there's a ton of apps by some developers that seem to be rapid fire submissions. Not too sure about that.

Rumors have put WhatsApp into May.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

I don't like the UI. First of all, I never used swipe up on my N9. The swipe from the right or left is effortless while the swipe from the bottom requires you to bend your thumb as if you'd want to hit a button. In fact hitting a central touch sensitive control button is easier.

Apart from that I don't think I can live without widgets AND without an event/notification screen. Unfortunately Sailfish has the same problem.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

Use the swipe on the N9; trust me 15mins with it and you'll not want the central touch button ;)

Secondly, Jolla have said there will be something similar re notifications/events feed; we don't know how it would look like but I think they have taken feedback on board hence their statement...

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

I saw the exact same app 4 times by "different" publisher (first name, full name and two random company names ending both in -labs. Come on BlackBerry don't make us who played fair feel stupid.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

If that is true, tgalal should troll and release wazapp on bb10. Hell, I wont be surprised if someone else gives it a shot seeing as yousup is foss!

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

I'm deeply excited and deeply disappointed by BB10.
I was hoping for something that can hold onto 5-10% of the global market share but that seems highly unlikely. I have many bones to pick with WP8, but its nonetheless somewhat competent. I hope it would achieve 10-15% global market share... yet that's highly unlikely.

What this means is that in the next 2-4 years, Android will dominate anywhere between 50-75% and iOS will dominate anywhere between 20-35%. Leaving less than 10% for competitors.

That means there will be no [worthy] competition in this market, so only gradual improvements will be made. As evident from the subpar leap on Gnex-Nex4, or Note1-Note2, or i4S-i5.

I've got a great ideas for:
- Physical hardware (mini 4.0 cheap phone, flagship 4.5 phone, QWERTY, large 5.4 phone, gaming peripheral, 7in tablet, 9in 4:3 pad, 11in hybrid)

- Device specs and pricing model

- Modern UX (GUI)

- Modern mobile OS (Very opensource, Linux (3.7) and Qt-based framework).

You all seem to forget the enterprise oriented features. This may catch a huge market as no one is currently offering a true business phone. One that enterprises can depend on and can lock securely within their location/network.

+1 million.

The top priority of the BB10 gameplan seems to be to secure the business phone market segment. And while the improvements in terms of hardware, media, gaming, UI, etc. are welcome to some mass market consumer types, the idea that a first generation BB10 is going to steal marketshare from iDrones or Android types who have a very high repurchase loyalty rate is fantasy, if you only take the consumer side of the picture into account. But people increasingly have multiple phones, and one of those is a business phone (the other is a mistress phone).

So, regarding mature smartphone markets, the BB10 smartphone installed base could grow due to its popularity as a business phone, either as an additional specialty phone or as a two-in-one device. In developing markets, being a true business+personal phone that has fewer compromises with the modern smartphone experience offered by competitors may be enough to win some sales. Overall, I think these steps were taken to decrease the rate of defections to iOS and Android due to increasing popularity of BYOD policies.

I think BB has a FAR better chance at 5% to 10% share than does WP8, which will hopefully drive the innovation that Kangal and so many of us want.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

BB10 is still too buggy to be sold as a premium product. The android runtime crashes randomly and requires reboot, the browser starts to flash sometimes while rendering, the recent calls list doesn't refresh until you change views and messages in Greek some times are sent normally and sometimes only squares. I'm sure I've missed more of them too.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

What build are you running? My experience hasn't been that bad since the earlier builds.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

10.9.10.35

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

http://www.thorstenfixplease.co.uk/

Not that we didn't have a good share of similar issues with N9 too :)

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

Oh, so that Crackberry thread went viral ? :)

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

BB was quite agressive in setting deadlines for submitting apps (port-a-thons, $10000 pledge, dev alpha exchange...) that most developers submitted their half-baked app quickly, just to get in there. BB went for numbers, rather than quality, for their launch. Once the dust settles, I'd expect a lot of these apps to be updated to become more useful, or to go down in rating hell, forgotten in the store's abyss like most of the Android/iPhone apps.
But right now, their app world is a bit lacking...

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

some more thoughts: http://play.qwazix.com/grog/?p=296

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

Ok, just for a little break of all this gestures/UI nonsense - what about system? If, talking about FOSS and holding to linux standards, (lack of) binary blobs etc, we put Maemo5 on one end of line (despite, that it wasn't ideal in those term), and Harmattan on the opposite (aka muuuch further from what FOSS and linux enthusiast expect), where this new blackberry would be?

Or it is even further away from being true mobile computer (with phone functionality) than harmattan was?

/Estel

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

@Estel
I don't know where you would put WinPho in that line... is really Harmattan such at the end of the line for you?

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

wow, just wow.

I guess Harmattan was perfect. As was Maemo 5. Oh well... back to the earlier discussion. Qwazix, we're running the same version, which is not the final retail version - there's quite a few iterations in-between that actually include Twitter and LinkedIn integration.

Anyway, after 3 days of battling with AT&T over which data plan I need, they finally listened and I got 4G LTE for the device. It works as I'd expect. Some odd things I've had happen - it'll flip to landscape when the phone rings and it's as vertical as you can get in my hands. Same for text messages.

Getting to mail, not going directly to the hub but directly through the notifications page has yielded some odd things. Sometimes it'll go to the right account - I have three set up - or sometimes it won't.

I could compare this to my N9 experiences whereas the mail app would just freak the **** out and not know where I wanted to go, stall and I'd swipe past where I want to go thinking that it had not registered my input. Meh, it happens.

Having Qt isn't enough it seems. Having some of the crappiest, quickest built apps and/or Android re-wrapped apps isn't what I'd call a popular way to go, but they did it. Let's hope that the popular apps come sooner than later. That's more than can be said for MeeGo/N9.

Regardless... was this launch flawless? No. It reeks of desperation. But I remember fondly how flawed the iPhone and Google Android launches were.

But like Jolla, Firefox OS and even Tizen, I wish BB10 a lot of luck. I'm tired of Android and iOS. They bore me.

Oh... and it seems that the final OS has "leaked" out if you know where to look. I'll update in a bit.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

Dunno, didn't see it :)

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

Googles released the OS figures for Android.
I contend that Android 2.3.3 Gingerbread is a good OS.
And Android 4.0 ICS is a good OS.
And Android 4.1 Jellybean also worthy.

The rest are outdated piece of ****, and they compose about 12 - 14% of the Total Android Devices in use.

Recently it was noted that Android has something like 69% of the World Phone Market Share. That mean 9% of all phones in the world is TRASH.

Why cant BBX take that cut?
Why cant WP8 (7, 7.5, 7.8 are PoS) take its cut?
Wtf is wrong with people? Why must they create a Monopoly?

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

Kangal, this 9% is people that bought their phone two years ago with that OS and still have it. I doubt anybody buys a pre Gingerbread phone today, and if anybody does, it is going to cost 1/5th or less than the price of the cheapest BlackBerry. So that 9% is probably not the target for BB.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

"Oh My"... When i read about that messy state (window spawning, inconsistent navigation, too many menus etc), i'm not too sure if i should evaluate / count on BB10. Also for Sailfish it looks to me it's in a similar situation.

Maybe it's better to stick with Android. The shortcomings are well-known, and there you won't have silly navigation issues. Plus, the infrastructure is there for long.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

didn't know you would have become such a Android lover. I salut you... :D

The whole google maps application is a big BUG!

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

...i'm not "lovin'" it, but from an "availability of really usable / feature-complete programs" POV its a fact its better than many competitors. So i can say i can accomplish the needful ("things just work"), whereas i'm still allowed to hack away fully. I would have issues to say the first part about Maemo, and definitely not about iOS and HP's/ Palm's crapOS.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

Piracy? Same thing that helped Microsoft not so long ago :)

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

The fact I'm running a leaked version of BB10 on a Dev Alpha device, I'd say piracy isn't as persuasive now as it was then - Windows proliferation has been argued to be at its highest due to floppies and CD's being shared so commonly between friends, families and corporations.

Regardless... I mean, if you know what you're looking for, you can find it. It's easier now. I think now, you have to have something else compelling folks to buy the device.

Re: BlackBerry 10 Launch
 

I think when it comes down to it, every worthy competitor is exactly 1 year late.

1) MS was right on target time with WP7, however it was buggy and it should've been the WP7.5 instead. MS sealed their grave when they decided that 800x480 was the only resolution and QSD the only processor.

2) I can't decide if WinRT is a year "too late" or simply just sucks.

3) Palm was sold to HP for a ridiculously bargain price of $1.2B. This would've been the perfect acquisition for Nokia, and a perfect partner for them (much better than Intel). HP tried to use Palm's and developed the TouchPad Tablet. But it was too late, as Android began to take the "cheap or alternate tablet" category. They were a year late.

4) The RIM PlayBook was an excellent tablet. It was very buggy and limited to begin with. Its version 2 OS which arrived a year later should've been its release firmware. The PlayBook should've been released at least a few weeks before the iPad 2. Oh, and fix up the hardware like small weirdly arranged buttons, gigantic bezel, and somewhat thick profile.

5) BBX (ahem BB10) is very innovative. It comes on great hardware. It doesn't lack too many Apps, and has a form to solve it. However, its lackluster compared to the iPhone 5, HTC One X, and NOTE1/2. It could've competed nicely against the Gnex, but the delay was, you guessed it, a year too late.

6) AMD has decided to get in on the low-powered processor market. The Tegra2 SoC, the first (and slowest) dualcore processor based on ARM's Cortex A9 was so much ahead (time-wise) in market to Qualcomm and Samsung... that they literally paved a way for themselves in the market. AMD could've (very easily) beaten Nvidia at every turn. They could've owned a large chunk of the mobile processor market, the market which continues to rapidly grow as the x86 market continues stagnantly.

7) Nokia was a year late with the roll out of the N8. The "first" Symbian smartphone, which had the best camera and could've provided them with the needed the profits to stay healthy/afloat.

8) Nokia was also (at least) a year late with Symbian v3 (Anna) release, and utilizing Qt for an App ecosystem.

9) MeeGo was never released, however Maemo 6 was at least a year late. The N9 would've been a good contender against the SGS i9000 but a little weak next to the iPhone 4 and Motorola Atrix.

10) Jolla is a year late. Many of the MeeGo/Qt advocates have moved on to other platforms. Now there's another "decent" option to move to (BBX). Jolla won't have the strong support it would've gotten a year ago.

...Do you guys have examples of anymore?

I agree with Kangal that so many things appear about a year too late, but I have a theory as to why this is happening and how it impacts BB10.

I think that given the lag time that it takes to get a phone designed, approved, and marketed, most new companies cannot forecast where the specifications of market leaders will be. Consequently, they (1) go cheap and (2) underestimate the competition.

Take the BB10 Z10, for instance. It'll be marketed in the US in March, with other markets having it available now. Did BlackBerry really expect the specs of top Android phones to be quad core S4 pro, 1080p screens at 441 ppi, packing 2300+ mAh batteries? It's like taking a knife to a gun fight.

And that's not all. I have an n900, E7, and N9. My issue with these, the BB10, WPx and the other "smaller" OS class is that they are always starting over. Bugs that have long since been worked out generations ago from older platforms continually re-emerge in newer ones. Like how the email IMAP counter for Yahoo unread email is buggy in my N9. So younger systems have to devote scarce resources to debugging while established powers are building cool *** features like Google Now. BB10 has a many more bugs, gaps and misfires than do established powers, though perhaps fewer than many other young OS's do. I do not know of any way around this disadvantage. :-(

I won't discuss the app-gap, other than to say that BB10 had better get that Android 4.1 runtime environment up ASAFP to minimize the app-gap.

I think that these reasons of hardware, software, and OS sophistication are what make the new OS's seem like they are a year behind the leaders. In many ways, they are. The benefit of my N9 is that it presents a cool UX that is original and fun.

Can't we have both? I would love if someone would make a perfect N9 skin for Android AND dual boot Harmattan onto, say, an Xperia Z? I could have my Harmattan apps, my Google stuff, top-end specs, all with an authentic or carefully replicated swipe UI. A guy can dream . . .