Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

I already see a problem. Use of both hands. You know why? The corners are uncomfortable.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

The masses don't care. IPhone still selling extremely well.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

It does but the world change. Just look at Nokia. You can't take anything for granted.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Apple spends much time being in tune with masses. That is their forte.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

I am reposting this article that is very interesting and tells you the problems at NOKIA of serving tech geeks rather than regular crowd. That is why Symbian ultimately failed:

http://www.hs.fi/m/kuukausiliite/Thi...f=hs-art-new-1

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Will Jolla be able to throw away their imprints and be in tune with consumers ? Or will they design stuff that is good for tech geeks as this guy criticizes subsequent Symbian phones:

"In fact, I get the feeling that it was designed as if its main purpose all along would be to advertise itself to telephone technology enthusiasts. All kinds of amazing functions are promoted on the display, but since I do not understand what the names mean, my guess is that I will never use them."

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

http://static.cargurus.com/images/si...518349253.jpeg

http://www.thecaterhamregister.net/i.../R500%20CC.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Hummer_H2_.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._blue_gray.jpg

http://cdn-static.zdnet.com/i/r/stor...tkAJ&upscale=1

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

iPhone's market share is shrinking, it's the lowest it's been since 2010. The iPhone might have been good in the dim and distant past but nobody wants Apple's Taliban phones in 2013.

Random rebooting, the blue screen of death, defective new 'security' features, a UI that makes its users puke - you just can't afford to release beta products like that in todays super competitive smartphone market.

Apple are not a software company, they just can't compete with the big boys. They need to dump iOS and adopt a failed third party OS from the most toxic partner they can find before it's too late.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Lumiaman, it's a simple answer : Because no Windowz; that's why!
And it's reason enough :)
Now join the bright side of the force and admit y00 l0v3 it like the rest of us!

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Did you confuse your OSs....somehow above is sooo reminiscent of Symbian...

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Ever answered the question on why you bought Windows Phone or iOS in the past? What compelled you? What sold you on those platforms?

And no... "for the lulz" or "it just works" aren't quality answers. I'm genuinely curious and can probably match your story about why WP8 with my very own wife's reasons for choosing that platform.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Lumiaman are you on Prozac again ?

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

I think a better question would be... how could Jolla convince a non-believer. Not that Lumiaman isn't probably trolling each and everyone of us; but there's a point in this thread.

If you're already invested into iOS, Android or even WP, how will Jolla convince those folks to switch? The Android folks might have a good reason due to ACL. But to the non-geeks, how will Jolla convince them?

And I doubt that anybody in this forum could do so without invoking what folks/laymen would call either a "too technical", "too geeky", "too fanyboy" or something else that's "too" something but not overly convincing.

I'd rather err on the side of caution but the last portion I'm talking about could be what Jolla needs to concentrate on the most - right after distribution channels and quality assurance that is.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

The same way apple id with iphone.
sexyness + radical design.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

radical design? Where?

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

I will tell you why. Apple was always a temptation, and I was a lover of everything Nokia, but apple was the first touch screen what N900 didn't do: very easy to use, you can use it for both personal and biz. Even n900 was not considered biz device and lacked many features I needed. IPhone was the first device that had flawless email and entertainment in one. With lumias, nokia and ms copied apple. Naturally I liked Nokia design and bought WP. I love the simplicity, best biz tools, and I only use handful of apps, so big and small tiles are great as I can immediately find what I want. I currently use both. Prefer Lumia call quality to iPhone but that could be because of ATT for iPhone. I still prefer social integration of Maemo, but you can't have it all.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

I still haven't heard how Jolla will attract average Joe. No convincing points so far. It seems to me like Jolla is destined for obscurity before getting out of the shadows of San Diegos La Jolla beach.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

The thing you can't grasp seems to be that not everyone goes for the average joe. Like the cars I posted, they are marques that go for a specific market, or even part of a market. If you started a new car company today you'd have no remote idea of a chance if you went after Toyota or VW. You don't make a Golf/Corolla competitor for a first car. You choose a niche (fast, big, electric, whatever), you exploit the fans, the people that will try and search for something non-standard, different, and then you clutch on that small marketshare to try and conquer bigger and bigger parts of the pie.

The car analogy works well here, it's a mature market that has settled since long ago, there are all kinds of cars radically different from one another and still there is space for niche manufacturers to get a small piece of the pie. It's even more difficult there as cars are much more expensive and there is a significant cost of ownership of an additional car.

For phones on the other hand there isn't. Between geeks, gadget fans and all those people who will learn about jolla either because they come here, or read engadget every day, there is a pretty big percentage who can afford to buy a second phone. The average joe will probably have never heard of jolla when the phone first gets in the stores. Designing the product for them is a waste of time. Appealing to the people who are actively looking for something different though will work. Due to the complete lack of differentiation in the market (yet. We'll get there, see cars), not being (i|A|W) is enough to sell adequate items to survive another year.

@gerbick, my point is they don't need to convince a non-believer yet. Their china strategy can provide enough first-time smartphone owners, and in Europe people who search for an alternative IMO will be an adequate market for a first product. It might even turn out to be good, because a converted non-believer will be easily discontented, and might be poisonous (see Lumiaman). The already believers will be more forgiving of v1.0 bugs just like we all here have been for the N900 and N9 and will be promoters for v2.0 which will inevitably be designed to appeal to a bigger market.

There are 3 categories in the smartphone landscape right now:
1. Free-for-all, low-end experience, led by android. Android is open but the end user experience is something that can only be compared to Windows for the desktop: full of nagging software, inconsistent UI, zillions of ads everywhere, and Google behind your back, tracking every move of yours. History has proved that this experience is Good Enough™ for the majority of people (90+% of PC users use windows)

2. Walled garden with much higher quality: iOS. The end user experience of iOS is significantly higher but the cost of entry is huge compared to android, and ofc you get your walled garden. WP7 was firmly in this category, but it slowly starts to cover some middle ground.

3. Blackberry tried to cover the middle ground, an OSX of phones, but failed IMO due to other things (delays etc) and because their phones are expensive, not because of their OS.

There is still room for a phone that looks good, feels premium (software wise) in the hands of the user and still does not cost a fortune. Apple showed they are not interested in that market by pricing the 5C too high, so that space is up for grabs.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Lets take BB for example, they have faithful followers, came out with N9 like UI, allowed use of android apps, yet they clearly failed. Reason for failure: lack of apps, not enough good differentiation from established players. Jollla is following the same path, their faithful are tiny compared to BB, they want to allow use of android apps. It seems to me they are headed in the same direction of BB. If you want android apps, buy android, if you want touch screen experience, plenty out there. Jolla specs are no Ferrari specs, hence you can't put them in exceptional sports car category. Now, UBuntu phone tried that, but we know how it ended.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

I didn't link to any ferrari Caterham costs significantly less than your average VW golf. But it offers something special, even if you are exposed to nature's whim while driving.

BB10 failed because they overproduced and overpriced. If jolla gets even a quarter of BB10 2 million devices it will be an extraordinary success for them.

BB made more mistakes. They did allow development in a multitude of platforms and frameworks, they even provided a compatibility layer for android, but they forgot to provide a BB7 compatibility layer. Many corporations do not want to re-invest in building their corporate apps, and possibly that is the reason they still sell more BB7 than BB10 devices.

BlackBerry has 12700 employees they gotta feed. Jolla has 80. What is breadcrumbs for a big corporation, might be food for a small one. Going after that demographic might have been disastrous for BB but it might well be the right choice for jolla. See the old reader just after google reader was shuttered. More people than they ever expected to have, or could handle.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

And by the way, I would likely buy a Jolla device, as I am a sucker for smartphone innovation and can afford it. However, it is very important to critically examine every venture and Jolla will be unique, no doubt, but I wouldn't call their software premium, given the unfinished OS they produced in maemo 5 and Harmattan. I am very afraid that they are just too lazy to code to perfection. When you are used to iPhone and WP smoothness and delivery, anything else has a very high hurdle to overcome.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Now you are just trolling. Please try to remove background color from a cell in Mobile Office Excel and come back and tell me about unfinished software.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

No trolling. Masses agree. Lazy coders is what made n9 lag, freeze, reboot and SMS threads get mixed....not to even start about the worst email client in the history of phones

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Lazy coders is what makes the latest iteration of iOS randomly reboot or freeze or show the blue screen of death. Lazy coders is what made Apple maps create a new airport in Dublin and navigate Alaskans across active runways... the worst maps in the history of phones.

The fact anyone would consider such ineptitude as 'premium' software just shows how pitifully low standards must be. Surely Jolla will have no problems jumping over such a low hurdle.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Wasn't there a conversion process before an Android app could be run on BB10?

Is that what Jolla are proposing?

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

I dont think anyone knows much about what Jolla proposes. Has anyone had a chance to play and test all the basic functions on this device? YOu can propose a lot, but proposing and putting it in practice are two different things.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Surely, with 80 people they will outdo 100X many better paid and smarter coders at iOS, surely they will sell 1 billion devices and surely they will be a household name. Wow, Jolla is magical. Wait a second....didnt they screw up Maemo and harmattan....surely they can change.....

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Love that image. Who has built that masterpiece?

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

I don't see much evidence of iOS coders being smarter - a basic OS that can't even do the basics right, not exactly a 'premium' experience in my opinion.

How do Apple make a single-tasking feature phone OS crash, freeze and randomly reboot? That's a whole new level of ineptitude.

But nevermind, iPhone users will hardly notice - they're too busy puking up their breakfast, a condition induced by the iPhone's new UI.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Great image.....hope the boat doesn't get squashed.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

IOS does many things right. No wonder its a bestseller and has been for the past 7 years. Couldn't say that about previous Jolla flops, n900 and N9.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

OK Lumiaman, we get it. You don't like Jolla, even though you haven't seen it yet. So don't buy it then. It's as easy as that.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Lumiadumbphuck: He hates us for our freedom.

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

Freedom....such a relative term

Re: Jolla difrerentiation
 

My cats like fish.