Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

I want to add to Kabouik: the N900 keyboard was good. I'm not very familiar with hardware keyboards on phone, I had a detachable one for the Galaxy S3, which made very hard clicks. It wasn't perfect, because it worked on BT and switching it on/off took too long to have advantage concerning typing.

The strong point of the N900, and if I can remember it has been mentioned in one of the reviews was the keys weren't flat, but concave, so keys next to it weren't easily pressed. I also like soft keys (no CLICK, CLICK!, CLICK!!) and a very soft backlight, and even better: switchable. A hard backlight can be just as bad as no backlight, because I don't want to lit the bedroom when I'm typing in bed.

Concerning thickness I want to say:
I would try to make it thin and use metal. It's good to make it a bit heavy, so the keyboard/screen are balanced a bit. Using metal can also make it stiff. To make the design more easy, you could try to build it in two parts: a "drawer", where stiffness and a good sliding out is important (not angled), and the real keyboard part (screwed upon, thus repairable?)

Another simple yet effective design (I've made it once from plastic and glue) is making a room with four "walls" and making an "X" in the middle.
I've graduated for mechanical engineer, so if you want a good design regarding stiffness/size, maybe I can help. robnas at gmail.com (dutch).

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

I agree that the n900 KB was pretty much perfect, so something similar would be nice. The droid KB in the prototype OH is good enough in principle, only negative thing is that some keys (in my OH) require very hard presses, this means it's not possible to type really fast and almost blind like with the n900, because you have to constantly check if the keys registered. But it's still a very good, working prototype.
The thickness is a bit too much, I can carry it around when I have some kind of jacket on, but I don't like putting the Jolla with HWKB in my jeans back pocket, also the plastic is not exactly the most comfortable thing in the world. Some kind of thinner metal version sounds great. I don't have any problems with added weight, only bulk.

Looking forward to whatever new you will think of :)

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

OK, I know I am harping on an old song, but I still believe in the idea: A capacitive touch screen with silicon markers for where the keys are. A touch screen is really quite fast, as long as you look at the keys. The problem is that as soon as you take your eyes off the keys, you have no way of knowing where you are. By adding a thin silicon grid or other overlay, you will get enough feedback to keep your fingers in place.

You can easily test what I mean on the TOHKBD or any other mobile phone keyboard; just imagine that the key would react when you just touch the key, rather than having to push it down. Do some pretend typing. Isn't that fast? Even faster than having to push the keys?

And of course you can change between any keyboard layouts you like whenever you like. :-)

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

Added to first post.


(spoiler)

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

@stefanmohl, it just does not work that way sorry.
You cannot get "tactile feedback" that way, no way. There needs to be a definite action of a key being physically pressed to get that, if you just have a touchscreen with silicone lumps on it you will not achieve that; when your finger touches the lump it is already too late, you have already mistyped...

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

@stefanmohl: I've also got the problem of doubletapping on touchscreens. If a touchscreen with silicone cover would be that good, why isn't it already existing and/or widely used on pc's?

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

All good points, but since this feature will not be made by me, this is *kind of* cluttering this thread. Please do continue this discussion in this thread. You can discuss options and explore possibilities there!


In other news: the bottom-pcb for TOHKBD-rev2 has typed her first words! It has some new features that are under testing now. Waiting on some other pcb's that should arrive this week, then I can maybe do a short demo.

Other thing: kinda running low on dough -if you know what i mean- for developing keyboard stuff... Ordering stuff from FunkyOH is most practical for me, but if people are not interested in that I could open another donation account like in Rev1? With the donations turned into discount coupons if/when Rev2 goes into production?

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

I like the idea of using the N900 keyboard, because it's great. Being able to use the actual keyboard of my/our N900 for the Jolla OH would make it cheaper, although I would prefer to maintain my N900...

N900 keyboard size would let space for the camera, and something like an FM transmiter, infrared, and an maybe optic for the camera could be added in the space left.

Moreover, adding two "legs" to the cover, will let you put it tilted in your desk to see the screen easier.

This could be called the N900 OH :) Yes yes, I am asking for too much, but let me dream.

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

How about getting access to a cnc-mill and milling it out of aluminum? A bit old-tech, but very high quality for small production runs.

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

way too expensive.

you also need to make it way thicker.

you also need to cram some electrical insulation into it

>or do a workaround which adds more thickness.

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

Some experimental stuff arrived:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bp8Kg0LIcAAb7bh.jpg:large

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

Why two and not one?

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

i actually got ten, same price as ordering 1. this shows both sides ;)

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

I am proud owner of:
1. 2 x HTC Tytn - Hermes - full qwerty
2. HTC Blue Angel - horizontal qwerty - horrible
3. N97mini - bad...
4. 2x Nokia e7 - best one in this list
5. N900 - bad...
6. 2x Nokia n950 early proto qwerty is hard while pre black proto is very good, but not even close to E7

I still do not have Jolla but I have Nokia 1020 (shhhh!) to practice touch... :\

I do use GTalk so very much and with EQ Alt Tab on E7 it's fastest phone I ever used...

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

1020's a fine device, you should get the most out of it...

WP8.1's a huge improvement over 8x, still not as interesting as Android/Sailfish/Others, but certainly much closer to Android/iOS now in terms of OOTB utility/usability.

Alas WP's still very rigid (like iOS) in terms of hack-ability, anyway we digress!

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

any plans to make a special edition and sell it to the hingest bider lika a dave999 special edition made of gold?


dirkvl special edition with some extra cool feature?

EDIT: I'm trying to get the thread back on track and discussion about keyboard ;)

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

I can put of some early proto's from rev2 -when ready- to the highest bidder to boost development funding!

Rev2 will probably blow everyone away with awesome functionality, so no worries about that ;)

Will take the option of producing them out of gold into consideration.

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

WP8.1 hacked and uefi cracked ;)
--EoOT--

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

Can you guys discuss your win8 experience somewhere else?! #offtopic #pleaseremove

Had some issues with my printer, turned out to be faulty thermistor. Will be replaced this week and then I can demo some new stuff!

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

Some minor adjustments on Base board, for smaller eeprom mostly.

http://uploads.oshpark.com/uploads/p...Ad/large_i.png

Printer is fixed, hope to be able to make a mockup of rev2 soon!

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

Some progress on Bottom board

http://uploads.oshpark.com/uploads/p...PK/large_i.png

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

looks great, interessting how will you building a background light :)

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

Like this:

http://uploads.oshpark.com/uploads/p...TM/large_i.png

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

ah ok :)
there is 12 or 22 leds on board?
i see that the right buttons from top to bottom will have littlebit lower light. But your work look really nice.
hope you will find a solution to get a qwertz keyboard too :)

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

10 LEDs for the backlight, the area with 'LEDS' above it are all the supporting logic and resistors.

maybe.



by the way, where are these holes for???
http://oi61.tinypic.com/2r257yx.png

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

ok, make sense :P
and left is a switcher to turn light on/off ?

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

2 additional LEDs for CAPS-LOCK and FN-LOCK (or whatever)

Re: tohkbd2 #maybe
 

good luck with the project :)

let's see what the battery performance says :)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Any plans to solicit donations for tohkbd2? I'd be willing to participate.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I actually hoped to see the thumbstick in rev2.

Too bad I guess :(

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Donations for Rev1 was a lot of administration in the end. Currently ordering from FunkyOH is the way to both sponsor my development and get some nice stuff yourself!

always in consideration, just like a lot of other features.

however, currently some other stuff is in research. so i am focusing on other stuff, will look into keypad and other stuff later!

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Bit of a quite period due to my holiday, but I am back!

In other news, Andrew has joined the team and will do the keypad design. He already has some nice designs, but be sure to inspire him by posting your ideas in this thread.

I am very enthusiastic to see what comes out of this, should be good! :)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Hubba hubba!!
WARNING: NSFW!

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Looks like in this post, you may want to reference this post in the 1st sentence.
Not this thread... <--Perhaps time to lock it? If so, just report the last post to mods.

Cheers.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

very very early render. will probably change, but still: i like

http://oi60.tinypic.com/287exhl.jpg

bottom part thickness: 5mm
added thickness to phone part: between 2.2 and 0.6 mm (currently 2.2, theoretical max 0.6mm)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Looks ok, but is the flash covered? How will that be solved? I want a keyboard...so bad...

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

don't worry about the flash ;) all in due time

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

some more nightly work on the keyboard, ordered some test parts from shapeways, should be able to get a working rev2 proto in 2-3 weeks

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

With my current design -which is very very straightforward- it would be possible to make the keyboard in a kit form, with all parts separately available. Think lots of different colours, surface roughness, keypad layout, upgrade ability, etc

Pricing about 150, realistically. For a keyboard of around 100, there would be no options.

If you intend to buy one later or at least considering, please give your well funded opinion about this! Some suggestions to start your reply with:

- I am very much in favor of full custom keyboard and 150 sounds good
- I am in favor, but 150 is way too much
- I'll buy anything that is shiny and has a Jolla logo
- I am very much in favor of having it in kit form

- I want the ultimate compromise, please give me limited customization for a very in-between price

- I am not in favor, I only care about functionality
- I am not in favor, I only care about pricing
- I am not in favor, this is a terrible idea
- I am not in favor, I already have a hard time putting TOH on phone, let alone build a kit

Will maybe throw some other ideas out there if I get some useful replies. Like to do it demand-based, but that means I need to know what you want!