maemo.org - Talk - Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

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- - Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=52163)

Re: Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

Quote:

Originally Posted by cashclientel (Post 664412)

Off Topic

You're correct to say that PUSH was a total failure. Did you see any of the results? They were lame and barely covered in the technical press. Apologies for using the word lame.

I have to disagree somewhat as, being a bit of a tinkerer, I enjoyed the PUSH contest and it was something that got me more interested in the N900 and helped get my purchase. Im disappointed what has happened since then though, there's no real legacy to it from what I can see. It was there, it happened, it's largely forgotten. There is a lot of cross over potential with the current rise in the MAKE scene but I don't see it being pursued.

Re: Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konceptz (Post 664399)

Now that's where I think we disagree.

At least in that we agree. :-)

Re: Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

I think the topic should be changed to "Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Overdue"

Re: Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

Quote:

Originally Posted by ysss (Post 664433)

I'm not sure I'm getting your message here. What I was pointing out was Nokia's message to the mass of potential customers out there, not to their (potential) developers... because those two channels are usually separated. They rarely cross each other.

Of course the messages to the developers community will always be more technical in nature, they will share more of their mid/long term strategies and sometimes more frank. Usually the message to the customers are more seductive in nature, and they don't tell the whole story.

I think the message is/was, Nokia wanted the N900 hacked to death because:

its neat to to geeks and enthusiasts and potentially show some use cases that would make the N900 attractive to that demographic to buy it.
This would make said demographic pick one up and potentially develop for the N900 or poke any holes/find & plug any possible holes/bugs in the OS and or create apps that are missing from the core system (i.e. fMMS, Conversations Plugins, etc...)

What they didn't obviously think was that important was to get developers on board to push out any type of consumer-grade apps (witness the sad state of the Ovi store). The message is pretty clear that the N900 more of an enthusiasts toy/tool rather than a polished mass-consumer device.

If that's the case, they need to embrace the fact that most users that bought the N900 knew what they were getting into, and release early & release often to patch/fix bugs and push out enhancements as needed.

Palm released their new OS and while their target was much more for the consumer masses, their OS is just as complex as maemo, and even maybe just as open (both Nokia & Palm have proprietary bits in their OS). They have someone actively listening AND responding on Twitter. Their hacker community is just as active & passionate about the OS. And they released quite a few fixes and enhancements in the last 11 months since the OS has been introduced. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WebOS#Version_History

If we're going on the assumption that the N900 is a consumer device, Nokia is still failing compared to how Palm is handling the situation.

Re: Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rocketman (Post 663351)

Well, to me the lack of a significant firmware update to date shows a lack of commitment to THIS DEVICE that is worrisome given the pattern of releases on previous Maemo devices. Nokia has tended to release a couple minor firmware updates for each device with a significant drop in the level of support once the next device is on the market. Many major, significant bugs get the "Won't Fix" or "Fixed in next version" treatment, with the end result being that no device ever reaches maturity.

I believe this pattern is one of the reasons there has been little large scale or commercial application development for the Maemo platform ---- because it isn't treated as a platform. Each device is a one-off with a limited window of exploitability before the next product cycle.

I really think that Nokia has to stop thinking in terms of individual retail products and start thinking in terms of a platform that is supported over multiple devices over a MUCH longer time horizon. In the desktop application space, I have applications that were created over a decade ago that I still run on a regular basis, despite having upgraded Windows three or four times. I have been able to run three or more versions of Windows on the same underlying hardware, as well. This sort of experience has become a major expectation of users in the Smart-phone space, with Apple releasing significant new OS releases for older hardware, while maintaining application compatibility, with newer hardware simply being faster and having support for additional new hardware features. Android seems to be adopting this as well, with older devices receiving upgrades to newer versions of the OS (1.6-2.1). The expectation for business applications compatibility on Windows is on the order of a DECADE. I don't claim we need that level for a phone, given how rapidly the mobile space is developing, but I would really like to see Maemo/Meego be a stable, consistent environment that doesn't throw its user & developer base under the bus every 1.5 years to implement some new menu transition effects.

I think Nokia does realize this.

Maemo: they saw that
a) they keep restarting from scratch which ruins tons of developmental effort
b) they would never get the userbase needed to attract commercial developers

So their solution was to combine their efforts with Intel and open Meego to everyone. This gives them the potential userbase needed when combined with QT compatibility across devices and netbooks. And it prevents them from restarting again and again.

Re: Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

Quote:

Originally Posted by puiradu (Post 657431)

I know the reason why PR 1.2 is late. Nokia want to test their customers fidelity. If we pass the test they will reward us with a firmware who has all the symbian features plus all the best that maemo brings. Then the OVI store will fill with a lot of cool applications and games, even NGAGE.
That's why we have to be patient. The problem is that the guys didn't tell us how long the test will be.
Cheers!

LOL. I like your style.
"Reward" us with symbian features, like MMS? Those features that every other Nokia phone ever since the invention of the camera phone has been able to do??? Reward us for paying £486 and 6 months wait to reward us with basic phone functionality. You should write for the 'comedy channel' or the labour party.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BN900 (Post 654218)

It has always been my opinion that we are not looking beyond a PR 1.4 (as in two more PRs after 1.2). PR 1.3 will come to fix a few things and add more features, and 1.4 will be the customary update after Meego (probably minor) to make Maemo users feel unabandoned.

Somebody else who actually thinks rationally. I doubt features will be added to 1.3, if they run this late on 1.2, 1.3 will be a FW to get N900 OVI store links (6 months & OVI suite isn't compatibile for Maemo 5) Ready for Meego and will be fixes for compatibilty, not new features. I also doubt a 1.4 release will exist. Once Meego is live it will be some very minor 1.3.1 releases to get compatible, cutting support but not admitting they are cutting support.

Looking at Ubuntu and Mandriva release notes and technical logs, you know when releases are coming, what they contain and most of the time who all the development teams are from blogs and forums. That is how to run an open OS. Not to mention a realistic method of feeding back requests and technical issues.

Re: Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

As a rule I try to stay away from these pointless bickering threads, but here's something you might want to read. It looks as though we have about a month to go.

Re: Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tomaszd (Post 666172)

As a rule I try to stay away from these pointless bickering threads, but here's something you might want to read. It looks as though we have about a month to go.

I heard 2x days ago that the firmware was going to be released in May 26. Now they say that we need to wait some weeks (most likely 3 weeks and some days). The firmware must be the holy grail.

Re: Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

it is late because that huge company really does not care that much what n900 owners think/want. and they know all you can do is gripe bout it here with no tangible repercussions to them. that's the reason. right?

Re: Here Is Why The PR 1.2 Firmware For The Nokia N900 Is Late

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tomaszd (Post 666172)

As a rule I try to stay away from these pointless bickering threads, but here's something you might want to read. It looks as though we have about a month to go.

Thanks, Thomaszd.

I really try to keep out of this PR1.2 discussion, but I don't get it anymore. Of course I know that there is no official release date and so there is no 'official' problem here. But that is not, what I am talking about here.

Nokia is really burning part of its credibility with this :(