Re: Ask the Council!
 

i'll refer you to my signature...
i guess you want the information lying nicely on your desk, next to your morning coffee?
maybe doughnuts, bacon hash and broiled eggs with that?

if you can't be bothered coming regularly on TMO (or visiting the Communities' wiki...) what do you care?


keep 'em :rolleyes:

Re: Ask the Council!
 

You, Sir, are a real disgrace for maemo community. Esp since you think you're in a position to define what's the true meaning of "maemo community" as well as imposing an assumed appropriate behaviour for each community member. There's nothing wrong with not checking tmo on a daily basis, and your post delivers best evidence why a lot of proper maemo community members don't particularly like to touch tmo at all.

*plonk*
jOERG

[edit] and yes, I actually expect this mail with my token for vote to sit next my ham&eggs on my laptop, several weeks before voting starts. Anything else would actually violate the rules for council election procedure.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Would agree, if not a small glitch - it would be entirely true, if Council would actually *have* any technical possibilities (access to infrastructure) to keep it going.

Now, what you're saying is like "every member of HEN team is obliged to release new version, because improved booston was released ages ago". Sure, in principle, it's true, but You don't have technical means to "force" MAG into updating GUI to current state and releasing new version.
---

I think that lesson from this is - in contacts with our technical staff, we must be as bureaucratic as possible/required (sadly, as I would prefer to start from "people mean well" [at least here] position ). It was clearly stated, that X-Fade will check on dates and get election going.

The only thing I may admit, is that quick reaction should be took no latter than on 10th's May end, but it apply to everyone interested (me included). SD69 is only one active Council member currently, and it's somehow understandable, that he didn't managed to react as swiftly as we would like. Fortunately, number of council volunteers is going to get back into normal, right?
---

As for Your ideas - election banner is sitting on any maemo.org infrastructure page (not only TMO) for quite a long time. Voting was covered extensively on Maemo mailing list. Every registered member with enough karma will get e-mail baloon about voting, with a week time to participate. IMo, it's more than enough. IRC Announce could be nice addition, but honestly, it could be done by any willing member - same apply for blogs (BTW, election was covered in Maemo Weekly News many times, including candidate's declarations) and other less formal ways of communication.

Honestly - again - I'm not very sympathetic about baloon idea. Instead, I would like banner/info posted month before election, announce on mailing list, etc - it would ensure, that any active Maemo participant will have 110% chance of knowing about votes. Sending baloon to everyone with Karma of 10 - even if he doesn't have anything to do with Maemo for months or years - isn't going to bring us reasonable voters, actively interested in Maemo's grown. I would rather say, that many voters will just pick "almost random" basing on Candidates declarations, without even knowing what they (declarations) are referring to - but,, if You have vote, it's a loss to not use it, yep? ;)

/Estel

// Edit

Of course I understand, that current rules require such e-mail baloon. I think that - amongst other, more important things - a referendum should be held during next council's period, about improving voting procedure.

I'm quite certain, that proper announcement on infrastructure many weeks before (month or more) + mailing list + IRC + TMO + Council's official blog would be enough, and there is no gain from bringing "dead souls" (at least, those having 10+ karma) via mail.

BTW, hoerg_rw, don't waste time and nerves for mrtroll. Personally, I've added him into blacklist many months ago, and it's proper place for him, amongst other TMO "stars".

Re: Ask the Council!
 

what mostly makes TMO unpleasant is

• trolls that post personal attacks (e.g. to current Council members) for the sole sake of starting a flame war
  (i'm not going to waste anymore gasoline on you... :cool:)
• so called users who haven't posted (on a thread) for ages or ever) and complain...
  those ppl actually don't deserve an answer and the only reason i wasted two posts on you was because of above *...

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Unrelated. Read my post again, I covered delegation, verbosely.
So you're free to redefine maemo council statutes in the future, by any defined process to do that the right way. For now we're acting according to recent statutes and those don't say anything about mandatory reading of tmo, nor about any other prerequisite except that karma threshold, which afaik was best metrics the authors of the statutes could come up with to tell apart active community members from occasional lurkers.
Excluding parts of your eligible voters by not informing them about election is rather evil an approach for a basically democratic community. I guess you'll agree if you think twice. (Are you living in Russia, or Italy, by any chance?)

/j

[edit] I guess by baloon you mean ballot

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Thank you for the insults pointed at me. If a man takes money for something- he does it, if he can't he shouldn't take the money.

Someone who is responsible for cooperation with a community just cant act and work like this because the results are as we can see it. Pure nonsens.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Hey, in Russia, not only election time was presented many weeks ago, but also election winner was well known before! :) (I hope that this little pun doesn't offend any Russian here)

Here we agree 100%, that's why I'm talking about upgrading process in future. Now, we have kind of a mess, so best we can do is fix it as much as we can.

Could You please change topic in #maemo IRC channel to one referring Election and pointing to Candidates Declaration wiki page? I know that You have technical privileges sufficient to do it.

/Estel

Re: Ask the Council!
 

take it as an insult if you have to...
it is a solution to your predicament

i'm not aware of all the technical background of Maemo, but from reading this thread for 1½ year i think NOKIA only pays for hosting services.
they do not actually pay anyone to "coach" the community;
again. that's what the Council is for (too)

the ppl from NOKIA who liaise with the Council do so as an added service to their normal (Maemo related?) tasks, my understanding.

from a Council meeting or two i attended, i had the impression the "contacts" (i.e. those «esponsible for cooperation») are very available as long as

• the activity can be handled in the spare time they can muster
• they don't have to go look for the work but the work "is forwarded to them" (see previous point)

Re: Ask the Council!
 

sure thing, I'm happy to help whenever I can :-) Just ask!
/j

oops, could you please provide proper URLs (maybe even shorties, this particular time, as it's for topic which is length-limited)

Re: Ask the Council!
 

@estel: see last post. Could you provide the links you want to get placed into IRC topic?
/j

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Declarations/candidates:
http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Coun...e_declarations

Short version: http://bit.ly/Jmc6OM

Election:
http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Coun...tion_Q1/2_2012

short: http://bit.ly/JmchJM

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Sorry, I just logged in, so I haven't had a chance to respond. Thanks fw190 for posting links.

BTW, all required links were easily available via clicking on Election banner (if You're reading this, see top-right part of screen ;) )

/Estel

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Definitely nothing on top right of my screen (theme -classic light- at bottom left of my screen though)

the linked page http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Coun...tion_timetable is more confusing than helpful, I don't feel like putting that into /topic of IRC channels

Let me know when that page got actually useful info regarding election, and I'll put it into /topic immediately

/j

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Could you please link this instead?

Re: Ask the Council!
 

*sigh*
OK, though I feel silly doing so, and really dunno what to write to explain to users in two words why that link is there. And believe me I'll remove that link when first user starts asking me questions about it I can't answer, like "when's all that happening?" or "why is that already obsolete link in topic, I read elections finished May 13th"
I honestly think it's contra-productive to spam users with inaccurate annoying "info".
/j

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Don't panic, I'm already fixing it in Wiki. I just don't know what to write in election date - "It will be held when it will be held"? "beginning of may"? "Soon"? "ASAP"?

// Edit

Done. Election page hold link to candidate's declarations, describe voting process etc, so I think it's still worth to post it in IRC topic (if we make bold assumption, that anyone is reading those topics at all, but that's different thing).

As for dates, they'll be put as soon as we will know any details.

/Estel

Re: Ask the Council!
 

never bothered clicking on the future logo after it came up because i felt all the relevant information where available from the link in my signature.
still, it's there, readily available to anyone who browses along without even logging in :eek:

doubt ppl who can't be bothered visiting TMO even only occasionally will get interested in generic mail channel messages :rolleyes:

then again, from a couple of joerg_rw posts (from link in his own signature!) only one word comes to mind... what an unhelpful jerk :cool:

Re: Ask the Council!
 

and that's the user you want to entrust the future of your (software) community to ?!?

( from...)

good luck :confused::rolleyes:

Re: Ask the Council!
 

misterc I do not understand why you do what you do but to be ohnest I disagree with your attitude. From my point of view it has nothing to do with Maemo and FOSS, which a while ago was something strange for me but people here opened my eyes. You instead act just the oposite to the thing I got used to last 2 yeras wisting TMO everyday. What is your goal?

Re: Ask the Council!
 

i assume you posted in anger or at least in bereavement making your post's wording and syntax difficult to understand.
(you are unhappy with me and anything i post, i appreciate that, even without reading your post, but otherwise...)

what i am up to:

• information is a necessary though no sufficient condition to rationality...
  if ppl (readers of TMO) see what ppl post they can make themselves a better idea of what ppl really think, no?
  or...
• enabling the information age is mostly... giving ppl the information
  something mr. enterprise edition most likely will not agree with :D

again, your ideas & vision on Maemo are difficult to grasp from your post, so i'll cut thru the chase & give you my ideas...

• Maemo as NOKIA's development platform (for disruptive technology) lives on; there'll be more releases, not only of RM-680 2011... (PR1.4 for N9 / N950) but also a RM-xxx 2013, that is a new version of Maemo; most likely with a new device as well; or vice-et-versa :cool:
• believing this community has the slightest chance without NOKIA (like our Polish hardware (not to say redneck) friend does) is delusional.
  Maemo exists thru and by NOKIA.
  don't like it? leave it.

just to make this completely clear...
the only reason i'm here (PL friend will fret, no doubt ¦-)))) is because i have a couple N900s; have had NOKIAs ever since i had a mobiles and everytime i was handed a dev from another manufactuere (iPotato from my provider as a fidelity gift) or vm from my work) it took me a couple day to either go back to my two year old N95 (iPotato) or get myself a 1208 :rolleyes:)

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Thanks freak!
We got May meanwhile, if you haven't noticed. Suggesting such a crappy link was all anybody ever needs for getting to know about council election, well, that tells a lot about your own "rationality"

btw also thanks for absolutely confirming what I said about you in my prev post. Of course you can consider maemo and its community whatever you like, but honestly don't expect anybody taking you and your weird notion (and yes, your trolling) any serious

I just idly wonder how high on mods' pending-ban-list you rank.

/j

Re: Ask the Council!
 

give it you best shot

Re: Ask the Council!
 

@ misterc

I do not like the situation that you offend Estel the way you did. He is doing something, and as I can see soem people like his idea on new casing for N900. You don't have to like his vision of TMO but that is the place where voting comes in and where people can decide what vison they support. Offending Estel isn't welcommed here. I think that the majority will agree with me on this.

I do understand that my English isn't perfect and as I write from N900 I do not have spell checking and my writing may sound strange so sorry for that. But again. Not everyone is a native spekaer and not everyone can have great language skills.

One way or the other I hope that you stop the things you do.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

then follow his advice...
or do you post on his behalf?

he put me on ignore and quite a few posters (on a different thread) disagreed with him treating me as a troll and putting ppl on one's ignore list as a general rule.
my disagreement with Estel was from a few weeks ago when he was one of the two or three candidates to the council and wouldn't have needed to be elected neither.
meanwhile there are seven candidates and honestly? he amuses me. disdains abill_uk but isn't much different and, in a way, much more dangerous to the Maemo Community then Bill ever could have been with his ranting about the USB port :mad:

English isn't my native language neither.
if i had applied the same logic you do about 15 years ago when i started browsing the I-Net and posting on forums (i.e. it isn't my language excuses all and any mistake i make...) i would still be making posts like someone who isn't speaking English (fluently).
it's called Netiquette
look it up, you might learn a thing or two...

after all, the N900 is a NIT ¦-)))))))))))

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Please stop these offensive posts they aren't helping anyone. Misterc, I was the first to defend you when you were attacked, but making things personal never helps. On the other hand guys, if someone attacks you, don't bother, there are plenty of people wrong on the internet, and any intelligent person will understand what is a pointless attack and what is useful disagreement by just reading the thread. Spiralling to flamewars and personal attacks makes both parties lose any credibility.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

+ we got quite effective ignoring system, which I really encourage everyone to use. Unfed troll is dead troll.

/Estel

Re: Ask the Council!
 

thank you for stepping in / being a voice of reason
discussion is pointless, indeed.
Estel has his (their?) ideas and will have to defend / sell them to the other members of the Council, once it is in function.
this in itself is all that matters now (that there are enough candidates)

apologies for "upsetting" the thread.
tried to keep it "cool" (n.b. not :cool:)

EDIT: one can't help wondering if "ignore list" is the only answer he knows to criticism (except, maybe (?), using a 2nd ID to defend himself...) how Estel is going to fare in the Council...

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Greetings,
how can i get an invitation to "The Extras Assistant"? I have requested invite via web form (https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assi...tation_request) but got an automatic reply that Stefano Mosconi left nokia at 30th April, and i cant get approved.

I would like to queue new package versions of "nelisquare" to Fremantle extras-devel, as i have released a huge update to it, and continue developing requested features ( http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php...44#post1204544 and new project place at github: https://github.com/custodian/nelisquare ).

I have already become a package maintainer - http://maemo.org/packages/view/nelisquare/

Thank you,
Basil

Re: Ask the Council!
 

If you already are a maintainer you should already have upload rights? I thought that anyone with a garage account can use the autobuilder and upload stuff into extras-devel. If that isn't the case who currently can grant the permission? That surely isn't something that should be done by Nokia personnel. Something doesn't sound right here.

Anyway. I'd urge you to bring this up in the community mailing list. You are more likely to draw the attention of the correct people there.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Thank you, my question solved - i got an invitation.

Permission required to use web assistant - it's easy to use wizard :) less possibility of making mistakes during dput or scp.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

as the topic suggests Ask the Council i hope i am asking this at right place.. and wont be considered as spam in this thread..

my Question is
CAN WE ADD A FUNCTION TO TMO AS "SUBSCRIBE TO THIS THREAD FOR NEXT 5/10/20 POSTS"

in case someone doesn't want to subscribe to a thread for life-time

its would be very helpful for the people who ask Question(Query) in some thread(just like i am asking question in this thread)..

since what we generally do is track that thread for next 5/10 comments, since there's a high probability of your query getting answered within next 20 comments and if it doesn't its forgotten
& probably it won't get answered (until you ask it again)


please do consider about it :)

Re: Ask the Council!
 

The same "thread tools" link that allows you to subscribe to a thread also will unsubscribe you from the same thread.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

election is now!

if you are entitled to vote, you should have received an e-mail to {e-mail}
(check your SPAM?)

Re: Ask the Council!
 

thats not what i am talking about my friend... but thanks for answer.. :)

Re: Ask the Council!
 

We can try to ask Reggie about that, although, honestly, I don't think it's feasible (unless there is such fool-proof, already baked, plug-and-play solution for vBuiletin).

/Estel

Re: Ask the Council!
 

such a feature is unlikely to exist, neither as a standard feature (it would already by available in the settings) nor as a plug-in.
reason being that the "number of posts" on a thread is very irregular.
one day you may have dozens of posts and then no more posts for weeks at ends.
afraid unless you are willing to develop a plug-in for vbulletin jcharpak's solution is all that's available

Re: Ask the Council!
 

thanks @Estel,@misterc :)

imho it would be a good functionality to TMO..
since it would be useful for Queries, suppose i am a new user then i would be having a lot of questions about N900,CSSU,apt-get,Easy-debian,Nitdroid.. etc
in this way i can ask my queries in each and every thread i feel might solve my problem.. without the concern of Flooding my mailbox

another reason maybe.. sometimes in a particular thread(even when that thread is not your favorite one), the current topic twists in the field of your interest so you would like to monitor and be active in that thread for a few days/hours & and then the you will Hibernate from that thread since the topic changed again..
a limited[time(1day 2days week) limited or postcount(next 5/10/20 posts) limited] subscription might come handy in this situation too

i said the same thing again, didn't i.. :(

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Sure, it sounds like a nice option for certain occasions, although personally I would just manually unsubscribe from a thread once I no longer needed it. However, it would depend on there existing a way to do this in vbulletin. Also, I don't think this is really a matter for the council - the forum is Reggie's thing.

Re: Ask the Council!
 

Personally, i don't use sending mails by forum at all. If You have thread subscribed, and you log in, then proceed to Control Panel, first thing You see is list of Your subscribed threads with new posts (don't confuse it with "Subscribed Threads" list, that show every subscribed thread, no matter of new posts being posted or not). You also got Your PM's there - if any new - so, basically, it's Your custom view for any new content that You might feel interested in.

If You add to this "Active Topics" panel, that could be enhanced to allow setting up categories You're interested in (or tags), I think everything needed to properly manage Your threads of interest should be available.

/Estel

Re: Ask the Council!
 

even without subscribing to a thread, you can simply go to your list of posts
(click on your ID => find all posts by immi.shk
beside the thread title above each of your posts is an orange envelop; the envelop is sealed if there are no new posts in the thread and open with pages sticking out if there are new posts...