maemo.org - Talk - Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Nope, that has not been disclosed.

Only the fact that the first year costs 50 euros.
Whether the next years cost anything or something, that remains to be seen.

That intrigues me.

juiceme

2017-08-28 10:57

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1533424)

That intrigues me.

You and me both. :D

---------- edit ----------

I'm fairly sure we'll get to know the answer in next Mer Meeting, though.

MINKIN2

2017-08-28 11:57

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by mosen (Post 1533392)

50€ is obviously calculated to vaguely pay the costs of maintaining and improving this device specific port for 12 month.
They do not want to make loss from the community device.
Thats all.

It is a nice gesture concidering they focus business on corporate and governmental solutions. Take it or leave it.

There are probably driver licenses to pay for too. Not sure if sony would want to give away their camera secrets, and a few other board drivers too, possibly?

Thoke

2017-08-28 12:08

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by maximilian1st (Post 1533417)

Second that. It's 2017, bluetooth handfree should be the first thing working on a phone! A phone! To make phonecalls in a car, handfree.

There was this one study in the news in Finland (don't know if this study was in the news elsewhere too) that actually showed that talking to a phone hands-free was equally dangerous than talking without hands-free, the study concluded it was due the loss of concentration being equally high.

So I wouldn't talk to a phone while driving.

nieldk

2017-08-28 12:14

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by MINKIN2 (Post 1533433)

There are probably driver licenses to pay for too. Not sure if sony would want to give away their camera secrets, and a few other board drivers too, possibly?

Which is absolutely correct.

Sony released some devices to their open devices program, but, certain features are not available without DRM keys in place.
If you keep those safe, there is a good chance all features will (can) be available.

Secondly, the drivers, or blobs, for Qualcomm bootloaders.

So, in short, yes, Iam sure that is correct. By only releasing/selling OS, Jolla doesn’t need to pay license fees . SOny already did.

acrux

2017-08-28 12:15

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

A little bit coverage at GSMArena: http://www.gsmarena.com/sailfish_os_...news-26952.php

juiceme

2017-08-28 12:37

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thoke (Post 1533435)

So I wouldn't talk to a phone while driving.

I don't drive, it's so boring. I ride a bicycle instead.
And yes. BT is essential in that situation.

juiceme

2017-08-28 12:38

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by MINKIN2 (Post 1533433)

There are probably driver licenses to pay for too. Not sure if sony would want to give away their camera secrets, and a few other board drivers too, possibly?

That should not matter as you already paid for those when you purchased the device HW.

NokiaFanatic

2017-08-28 13:09

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by acrux (Post 1533437)

A little bit coverage at GSMArena: http://www.gsmarena.com/sailfish_os_...news-26952.php

Lack of Bluetooth the deal breaker for me, but if we get it, I am definitely inclined towards this.

Is anyone here going to be involved in beta testing?

mosen

2017-08-28 13:40

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by juiceme (Post 1533427)

You and me both. :D

I'm fairly sure we'll get to know the answer in next Mer Meeting, though.

Sadly, we will not to our satisfaction.
James does a good job in communication, that is what i am sure of.
It must be another case of not beeing able to tell more because it is not decided yet. I can not repeat often enough, jolla changed focus and this device is not ment to be a gamechanger in public recocnition but another small stepstone to not let the community break away more and have a decent demo device to catch corporate fish.

So him giving exactly the sentence we got, means not more and not less than stated.
Full Support for one year, mainly to pay 3rd party licenses.
Given intex put out a whole device for 69$ including those licenses, 50€ hopefully has some overhead to pay for past or future jolla developement on removing beta state of sailfishx.
Those licenses could also be the reason if the continuation program will cost additional money to continue to use Alien Dalvik and M$ stuff after 12 month.

This all smells like jolla will introduce some kind of paid feature to the store to manage subscriptions or sell single 3rd party features, doesn't it?

meloferz

2017-08-28 14:21

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by NokiaFanatic (Post 1533445)

Lack of Bluetooth the deal breaker for me, but if we get it, I am definitely inclined towards this.

Is anyone here going to be involved in beta testing?

I will buy once is available, contacted someone from Germany that will buy for me... I can deal with the lack of Bluetooth, but I hope that community helps to fix it soon with Jolla

Enviado desde mi F5121 mediante Tapatalk

Thoke

2017-08-28 15:51

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by juiceme (Post 1533440)

I don't drive, it's so boring. I ride a bicycle instead.
And yes. BT is essential in that situation.

Oh, I'm sure bluetooth has it's uses. I haven't switched over to bluetooth earphones myself because I don't want to charge yet another battery (and they're more expensive anyways), but I can definitely see the benefits of it while doing sports.

Also, I don't drive either, but that's because I object to spending so much money to pay car insurance when there's perfectly good public transport working out there ;) And that's only intercity, a bike's my best bet in all other cases.

By the way, found the news of the bluetooth study I ḿentioned earlier here: https://www.wired.com/2003/06/hands-...phones-unsafe/

But back to on-topic, I'm sure bluetooth gets fixed in a timeframe I'm happy with :) Just let me buy the OS already!

sbock

2017-08-28 16:32

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

OK, this all sounds good enough to me to buy a new Xperia X black from Amazon Germany for 314€. Not really a steal but I don't like used units or Ebay that much.
I'm not really a big Sony fan any more but I must say the phone is really good hardware. Nice build quality, very good screen and not too slow under Android 7.0.
The only downside I found it's a little bit too big for me.
I hope they get Bluetooth fixed. I don't use it very often but I also must admit it's a very important base feature for a modern phone...

ajalkane

2017-08-28 18:54

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by mosen (Post 1533449)

Given intex put out a whole device for 69$ including those licenses, 50€ hopefully has some overhead to pay for past or future jolla developement on removing beta state of sailfishx.
Those licenses could also be the reason if the continuation program will cost additional money to continue to use Alien Dalvik and M$ stuff after 12 month.

This all smells like jolla will introduce some kind of paid feature to the store to manage subscriptions or sell single 3rd party features, doesn't it?

I'm not sure it's about 3rd party features, judging by past releases they may be more once-per-device kind of deals instead of yearly payments per sold device.

I do read that sentence as in 50€ for first year of support, and then a continuance program for future updates. Say if it was something like 10€ yearly to get further updates, I'd be totally fine with that. And Jolla would get continued revenue. Supporting all different devices for future updates must bring overhead so it's also fair IMO. Also consider common Android devices, they're usually receiving updates for year or year and a half if I've understood correctly. And you can't just buy more support, it's over when they decide it's over.

one_with_linux

2017-08-28 19:15

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Community is of course welcome to contribute on the missing features! We will open the hardware adaptation source code repositories for Xperia X device in the coming week, and we will provide instructions on how community can build their own Sailfish images from the sources.

Based on previous deliveries "coming week" means Saturday 11:59 pm.
Even so. We are only a week or so from getting a community image!:D

catbus

2017-08-28 21:20

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

So I can hold my breath? Or is this coming soon (tm)?

one_with_linux

2017-08-28 22:07

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by catbus (Post 1533479)

So I can hold my breath? Or is this coming soon (tm)?

Well I'm holding my breath... But note: I'm blue in the face :eek:

rfa	2017-08-29 07:48

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

We're all focusing on the updates for a year for €50

What I think we should be doing is looking at customer care (support).

1000 sales @ €50 = €50 000, this is enough for two people's wages for a year...

If Jolla are placing themselves as corporate providers then this what corporate support do - where I work our in house tech support charge $200/year per (company) email address.

I see this as a retail version of the same business model

herdem09

2017-08-29 08:32

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

So James Noori seems to have replied to the comments on the blog post yesterday. I am paraphrasing his comments (and adding my inferences) for those who does not want to go through all:

- After 1 year the updates for the X will continue (So hopefully they will not force X users to move to another Sony phone). But will they ask us to pay 50 Euros again or is it going to be solved in another way is not clear (I think the licenses for dalvik and exchange etc. do not require yearly payment either)

- Double tap to wake is not supported currently (and probably it is not on their agenda either)

- To fix the issues with Bluetooth Jolla mostly relies on the community

- For US and Canada payment system is the hindrance (Seems like it will be solved). For other regions he does not make any comments (So we can assume they will not be supported ever).

I think it would be much better if they made it clear in advance that they are changing their business model for individual users/developers as well. They definitely do not want to use (or waste as it seems they think) workforce on this side if they are not going to make money at once.

pagis

2017-08-29 08:48

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by rfa (Post 1533496)

1000 sales @ €50 = €50 000, this is enough for two people's wages for a year...

So €50k funding is enough to pay for 2 people wages for a whole year?

lantern

2017-08-29 09:04

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Remember €50 is with VAT.

Pity, that there's no double-tap-to-wake support. Hopefully somebody will implement it and it will be faster than Jolla C's.

Dave999

2017-08-29 09:06

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by pagis (Post 1533499)

So €50k funding is enough to pay for 2 people wages for a whole year?

Actually, I think its more like one.

Plus, I doubt Jolla will sell 1000 subscriptions without a fully working Experience.

jakibaki

2017-08-29 09:20

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by herdem09 (Post 1533498)

For other regions he does not make any comments (So we can assume they will not be supported ever)..

He actually did, not directly talking about one country but it's at least something:

Quote:

Our target is to make t available to as many countries as possible. Please stay tuned until we get back at you with updated information regarding that.

Mohjive

2017-08-29 09:32

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfmar (Post 1533297)

The "dual SIM" use case is somewhat rare:
- people willing to have both personal and work phone numbers in a single device
- people willing to use two different carriers (example: one for voice and the other for data)

It would have to deal with a number of extra issues:
- temporarily disabling one SIM (probably you don't want "work" calls/texts outside work hours)
- selecting SIM to use to send next SMS
- allowing/disallowing data traffic from the other carrier when the selected one is unavailable
- maybe also managing Contacts to avoid mixing work and family ones...

I use two SIM in my Jolla C and it works great, so most of these issues are already solved in the application layer. It "just" need a hardware adaption for the F5122.

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfmar (Post 1533297)

The only other reason to choose the F5122 over the F5121 is the internal memory (64 Gb vs 32 Gb). But if you use a cheap 64 Gb microSD to store all of your "large" (i.e. multimedia) data, you'll probably won't consider an issue having only 32Gb (Jolla1 was 16) inside...

The secondary SIM slot is shared with the SD-card holder, so you can only have either SIM or SD-card, not both.

I'd really like to have dual SIM support. Perhaps I should buy F5122, as reports show that at least the Android image for F5121 is compatible, and look at it.

pagis

2017-08-29 10:03

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mohjive (Post 1533505)

I'd really like to have dual SIM support. Perhaps I should buy F5122, as reports show that at least the Android image for F5121 is compatible, and look at it.

I do agree, the JollaC in that respect is perfect 2 sim cards plus SD. The F5122 is a bit restrictive as you can use the extra slot for a sim OR sd card but not both.

I have some serious doubts if Jolla is going to release an image for F5122, for sure they are not going to focus on F5122 as the porting of F5121 still needs more attention. So unless porting on F5122 is very simple it might not happen.

Bear in mind there is a race against time as both F5121 and F5122 are getting obsolete and their availability will be scarce.

ljo	2017-08-29 10:09

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1533502)

Actually, I think its more like one.

Or rather just a halftime dev since it would in best case mean € 28000 in wages.

jpel	2017-08-29 10:19

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

OK, decided to went for it today and ordered mine.... :p
https://www.verkkokauppa.com/
Sony Xperia X -Android-puhelin, musta
15954 1 × 299,90 € / kpl 299,90 €

Wave BookCase -suojakotelo, Sony Xperia X
20500 1 × 19,90 € / kpl 19,90 €

Now it's getting the phone by end of week and then waiting for September 27th to get the image released by Jolla... :rolleyes:

rcolistete

2017-08-29 10:24

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

20% Discount for community device program members, email list to follow updates about Sailfish X :

Quote:

Sailfish X - special offer for our community program members
http://mailchi.mp/jolla/sailfish-x-s...s?e=62b34d2a36
...
For all of you former Community Device Program members we offer a 20% discount,i.e. the price for you is 39.90€ (including VAT). We’ll let you know how you can claim this discount closer to the sales start.
...
Please sign up to our Sailfish X email and we’ll keep you updated about everything. Closer to the sales start we’ll inform you about more details, as well provide some instructional material for the software installation process.

We also have a Together.Jolla.com thread for Sailfish X, and would love to see lively discussion there.

Dave999

2017-08-29 10:30

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

What about tablet community backers? 70% off atleast...

Scamed again :D

pycage

2017-08-29 14:33

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by lantern (Post 1533500)

Remember €50 is with VAT.

Pity, that there's no double-tap-to-wake support. Hopefully somebody will implement it and it will be faster than Jolla C's.

Double-tap-to-wake is at least supported by the hardware and Sony supports this feature on Android, however compared to the Jolla, it works very unreliably. I sometimes have to tap up to six or eight times until something happens...

pagis

2017-08-29 14:56

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Along with double-tap-to-wake there is another gesture, swipe from one side towards the other side, maybe that one works better?

elastic

2017-08-29 16:52

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by pycage (Post 1533534)

It works most times if you triple-tap or if you flip the device - seems the digitizer is in a kind of sleep mode and recognises the double tap only after a 'wake-up' - might be a energy saving feature (or just a bug ;-) )

Bundyo

2017-08-29 19:16

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by elastic (Post 1533544)

Yep, triple does it always for me. Double tap almost never :)

taixzo

2017-08-29 19:37

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Sounds like how the tap wake works on OnePlus X. I usually have to triple tap for the screen to wake.

santeira

2017-08-30 01:48

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

That's strange, for me double tap is working quite well on Xperia.

And with Android it's also possible to double tap to sleep/close the screen. I find it very intriguing to maybe have both functions also with Sailfish X. But i fear this will unfortunately not happen, if Jolla is not sure if double tap to wake will be present on Sailfish X. :(

Also swiping from the sides to wake up the device, as already mentioned, would be great.

mariusmssj

2017-08-30 11:10

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Normal Xperia X under android does suport double tap to wake up and the turn the screen off.

If Sailfish X doesn't then I will be very sad.

gaelic

2017-08-30 11:16

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by pycage (Post 1533534)

Haha. This is also the case for me with the JollaC

meloferz

2017-08-30 13:22

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

Quote:

Originally Posted by mariusmssj (Post 1533604)

Normal Xperia X under android does suport double tap to wake up and the turn the screen off.

If Sailfish X doesn't then I will be very sad.

Why do you want that feature? When fingerprint will be available, you will have to use your power button for unlock your device, (assuming that you will use fingerprint), so that feature will be unnecessary, at least for me as happens right now with Android

Enviado desde mi F5121 mediante Tapatalk

nh1402

2017-08-30 13:22

Re: Sailfish OS (officially) on Sony Xperia devices

XZ1 rumours If true, looks like I'll take my money elsewhere.

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