Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Oh, I know (insert Fawlty Towers reference here :D), I should've used quotation marks to emphasize the vague reference to the `burning platforms` memo, signed by `yours truly, Stephen Elop`, which was the equivalent of a head shot behind the barn of the Qt-on-mobile along with Symbian and Maemo/MeeGo.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Qt already is being leveraged by RIM for their new platform. I saw a post somewhere about being able to do Python + Qt applications for Blackberry 10. That sounds like a very enticing proposition for me. I wish RIM success with that. How ironic would it be that RIM overtakes Nokia using Qt. Of course the patent war is not goingb tgo be preatty. It feels like we are on the verge of an all out MAD patent war.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

True dat. Plus after checking out Blackbery10 it seems like my next smartphone after my N9 dies or is killed(not that it hasn't been shot at enough by i's own maker)unless cannocal comes up with a reall good ubuntu phone(whishful thinking FTW).

And I don't think there's gonna be a patent war because in case you want to enter one you need to have money to spend on it and failop made sure that there wont be any of those left LOL

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

http://press.nokia.com/2012/05/02/no...tual-property/

Long are gone the times when Nokia used patents only to defend itself against patent trolls. Now Nokia has become patent troll itself, Microsoft's own (not even) bottom *****, lumia.

There is very little to like about Nokia nowadays. Bully attitude and bad karma from Microsoft has infected Nokia.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Qt is alive even without nokia. So please dont spread FUD about stuff you dont have a clue about!!

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

this is the time to appoint the community of maemo.org as nokia new ceo.... thousand of brains is always good than just one elop brain.. hehehe :D

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

When does a stock officially become a penny stock?

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

My first point of order would be to appoint Lumiaman as the janitor

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

I meant in a mobile world, Qt is pretty much dead. In desktop world, Qt is OK alive and I'd rather see Qt applications in Linux-desktops in the future than GTK-applications. (But maybe most likely Python/Qt applications and I hope Python-JIT-interpreter keeps developing and starts to use modern run-time optimizing compiler techniques.)

But if you are in a business of making applications to a mobile end users, I think Qt is dead. You should not ignore Java/Android, because IMO more and more in the future the markets will be there for both in low-end and high-end smartphones. Only total catastrophe from the Oracle vs Google legal fight over Java can stop Android now anymore.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

You might want to give a read over here--they explain delisting and penny stocks: http://www.investopedia.com/articles...#axzz1tz0cAnXF

http://allthingsd.com/files/2012/04/Nokia_sink_hole.jpg

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Well lets se whats happens there. QT is ported to android and BlackBerry 10 supports it.

If the FOSS push it as hell it MAY be on mobile too even on android.

Java just sucks IMHO. Developers want alternatives. You can make every developer go Java.

If only Java will be the future I have to change job, cause then I am not intrested. Its as bad as in the 90:s when everyone developed for Microsoft only on desktop market.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

That whole is not even 1/10 as deep as it should be to describe Nokias position.

Just sayin :P

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

You're right, but I couldn't find an appropriate illustration of a big enough hole. ...but then there's THIS huuuuuuge ***hole...
http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/.../Nokia-004.jpg
I'd like to think that he's practicing for his new career as a street mime.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Not correct. What you are talking about is an idea. You cannot get a patent on an idea. You can only get a patent on a explicitly described and working device or invention that use your idea (or anyones idea for that matter). Someone else can get a patent for another device as long as none of the claims are violated.

Besides, you are as per definition, not violating any patents whatsoever unless the patent owner can prove that you have made economical profit based on violating some claim(s) in his invention. Then the owner of the patent is entitled to some compensation.

Patents and copyrights are two very different beasts. Confusing those two makes great headlines in the tech news, but nothing more than that.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

He is describing Electrostatic spray painting which was patented by Harold Ransburg in the 40's. I think you are right about it being safe to use legally though.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

I think his boss will probably send him to work for some other company Windows phone will disperatrly need after Nokia has kicked the can. So who's next to join the winning team :D

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Good news of the day: Nokia's shares stabilized today, the stocks did not decline any further.

(Rumors say that the fact that the stock exchanges were closed today, Saturday, were a major contributing factor)

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Funny guy.. fuuunny guuuy!
http://quantumhead.files.wordpress.c...t20deniro6.jpg

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

The mantra of dumbed down OS...

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

I agree, but then you wouldn't mount automatic transmission on a MC even though many people feel it is a necessity on a car.

It is user experience of the end product that counts, not some features of the OS.

IMO the user experience is much better with multitasking, but having a fluent and dead easy user experience is obviously more important for most people. Just knowing that you can push the "home" button and the phone is back to the same state as if just rebooted, is a revelation for most people. That way they know they can't "mess up". That is about as much complication they can handle.

For some people multitasking is second nature. I don't think you will get more than 5% market share if your focus is on those people though. The optimum is to make multitasking invisible for everyday use, yet enable some control for those who want it. ICS seems to at least try to do it correct.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

I used to think "real" multitasking is a necessary feature for me, but when I think it deeper, the Android has as good multitasking as Maemo/Meego.

1)
In Android, if you want your application to do something also when in the background, you should code a separate service thread which has the code which can be run also in the background. For example, you won't put any GUI-drawing or refreshing code in that thread.

2)
In Maemo/Meego when application goes to the background, it gets a signal and should react to it, so for example the process would not do any GUI-drawing or refreshing while in the background.

When coding with Java, there is nothing to it to code this kind of service-thread which is needed for 1).

Android method (1) doing background running is like "enforcing" mode and Maemo/Meego (2) style of doing it is "permissive" mode.

The permissive style (2) will lead to unefficient and battery wasting applications if the developer is lazy or novice; where enforcing (1) style will better automatically do quality control, so bad behaving applications do not get spread.

When prototyping, then permissive style may be helpful to make developing faster, but it can lead to lazyness and to inefficient code also to be distributed.

When porting non-GUI applications from the desktop-world to a mobile-device, having "permissive" (2) style may seem better. But those are CLI-applications and terminal application can be made that way it always runs in a service mode. (I do not know if there is a such a POSIX/bash compatible terminal application in Android phones.)

And then, there is also "real" (permissive) multitasking possible in the Android with the OverSkreen application.

So getting closer to the topic of this discussion-chain, I think Nokia should break the contract with Microsoft, pay the penalties (can be couple of billion euros/dollars) and start to make both Android and WP8 devices as Samsung does, but Nokia would have PureView. Or join the Tizen-workgroup and buy Alien Dalvik from Myriad to go with Nokia Tizen-phones.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

multitasking is nice to have , but much more important is the overall optimization of the OS, and how seamless transitions are. N9 multi~tasking is no different from iphone. Little happens in the background except for the ability to open multiple windows. N9 fails with regards to smoothness and overall transitions

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Ohh yeah kill Qt and go Dalvik would help Nokia alot NOT!

Second Tizen? Do you really beleive that will ever happen!? Its even worse mess than Meego was. Take a look at the latest API documentation. Its only copy paste of everything that is HTML5 related from jquery mobile to W3C HTML5 documentations. Some stuff here some stuff there. For that reason N9 already IS "Tizen compliant" cause Webkit is already HTML5.

If Tizen has a chance atleast they should add QML to the portfolio. Or else its just another geekos that is worse than WebOS/Harmattan thats for sure.

There is too many people here who thinks Android would save Nokia. Hell no it would not. How serious would that be to add Android to the portfolio when they already has this mess?

FIrst dump Symbian, Meego and say "next billion is QT" and then in a year come say "Hey lets add Android to the list and kill Qt too"

What they should have done is:

* lobbying as hell for Qt
* Get the damn next billion devices released with fully Qt/Linux and make it open
* Port Qt to WP
* Officially support Qt on Android/Iphone
* stop patenttroll RIM for multitasking and similar when they actually already support Qt
* Stop pissig samsung of and make some kind of deal to add Qt to Tizen.

But this will not happen. But thinking Android would help is just plain ridicilous.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

OMG.. i thought this might be a serious business kinda thread.. bt its one of the best threads @TMO ;) :)

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Qt can't save anything. Qt is not important in the future, nokia don't want Qt when they going down the Windows road. I'm sorry to see that and sorry to say that.

Tizen is not ready yet so noone knows. Me atleast, always welcome new OSes and not like some of you are constantly angry with all OSes except one ;)

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

@zimon

Looks like ICS can do "real" multi-tasking to me. Thanks to a danramos suggestion, I downloaded an Android app called "Terminal IDE," and here's what I ran on my Galaxy Nexus:

Attachment 26190

Immediately after starting this loop I left this app to run other apps. Coming back to the terminal after a minute I found this:

Attachment 26191

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Tizen OS hits version 1.0

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Maybe it will go on tomorrow:
"ROBBINS GELLER RUDMAN & DOWD LLP FILES CLASS
ACTION SUIT AGAINST NOKIA CORPORATION
...
The complaint alleges that during the Class Period, defendants told investors that Nokia’s conversion to a Windows platform would halt its deteriorating position in the smartphone market. It did not. This became apparent on April 11, 2012, when Nokia disclosed that its first quarter performance would be worse than expected. Nokia expected its first quarter 2012 non-IFRS Devices & Services operating margin to fall by 3%, and projected first quarter 2012 Devices & Services net sales of €4.2 billion. It also disclosed a glitch in its newest Windows offering – the Lumia 900. Nokia had to immediately offer customers an automatic $100, making the phone essentially free.

As a result of this disclosure, the price of Nokia’s American Depositary Shares (“ADRs”) dropped over 16% in a single day.
..."
http://www.rgrdlaw.com/cases-nokiacorp.html

Let's see how big this lawsuit will get.

Btw. look at what Failop blames this time:
"Nokia's CEO Says Carriers Hate Skype, And Its Affecting Windows Phone Sales"
http://www.businessinsider.com/nokia...e-sales-2012-5

ROTFL

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Android-"ecosystem" is too big to fight against anymore. Too many fans, too many users, too many good applications. So to be succesfull, IMO Nokia should join it some way; either by doing Android-devices or then Tizen-devices with Dalvik VM; Tizen+Android-hybrid.

Yes, if there is a Dalvik VM also and both Java-based and native-code based Android applications can be used and they have all needed Android API:s and interprocess interfaces available. I don't believe so much anymore pure Tizen-system, but hybrid Tizen+Android, where real OS underneath is Tizen, which provides Cyanogen-type interface to upper layers.

Having Samsung Galaxy S3 type of Android device with Nokia PureView camera, would steal SGS3 customers to Nokia. And there will be millions. Samsung has sold SGS2 over 20 millions.

I agree on those. I'd also like to see official or at least semi-official support for Qt in Android, Tizen, iOS and WP. But I do not believe Qt only device will be succesfull anymore, it is too late for that.

Qt and Qt-support and Navteqq would maybe be the valuable things Nokia brings in the soup, when it would join Tizen work group and join somehow Android-system either with Android-devices or Tizen+Android-hybrid-devices.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

The hole just keep getting deeper and deeper for each day. Kind of fascinating to see that it's actually possible to drive a company further and further into the mud like this.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Did the smarter OS sell well enough to make the dumber OS not an option?

Here's a hint: no

In a day and age where the most mediocre of mediocre products is still in use by a majority of people, you have to wonder if being the smartest and best is even worth it. Bimbos get all of the attention. Windows still has majority share.

Idiocy in tech is not new.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

There is no return from windows. Nokia will live or die with it, unless something revolutionary pops up. Sadly the have nothing revolutionary

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

You would not believe how many people I know who have said "Nokia make great hardware and would buy their phones if they released them with Android".

I personally would not want to see it happen but android would cause a sharp rise in shares right now. Although I can't see it being a good idea for the long haul.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Just buy more stock . Shares will triple in 2 years

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

This picture is priceless

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

As I have cited many times from my weekly experience on Android 3.2 or 4.0 (@ Asus Transformer TF-101) :
- open many web pages in default web browser or Opera, do anything else and come back, in some cases the open web pages are reloaded, open Youtube video is restarted, etc;
- open a PDF document with the many PDF readers (Adobe Acrobat, etc), do anything else and come back, then you have a chance of loosing your document state, starting again from page 1.

There are other cases (involving programming tools, etc), but I cite the 2 above because every typical user can experience them and be aware that THERE IS NO PROPER MULTITASKING IN ANDROID ! That's it. Simple. It is silly to the have dual/quad-core processors using a so limited mobile OS.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

In reality, many softwares for Android aren't coded as you cited (using a separated service thread).

So Android doesn't have as good multitasking as Maemo/MeeGo.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

Sorry, iOS doesn't have real multitasking either. Multitasking of Android, iOS and WP7 isn't proper multitasking.

Re: Let's talk Nokia stock!
 

what is new OS? Tizen? No. Wp? No...