Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Maybe... >.> :D

How so? And if that's your main rationale for immediately changing back, then I'm glad you're not calling the shots for Jolla ;)

Dave there's a world outside these epic threads, this has been common knowledge for a very long time, it's Android 2.3.
Although there's been rumours for quite some time that they'll have a player for Android 4.x this year or early next, nothing in upcoming builds though.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

I found him to be quite good

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

I've seen most part of this world both from the earth and from above but nothing about old android. However, nothing is better than these jolla threads becouse now I know about it.

I don't said the new CEO is bad, it's just that I don't find him particular fun.

Carry on, I have some work to do.

EDIT: that part of old android must have passed under my radar. Not sure where this was discussed?

I've been digging into the Android compatibility angle to see how it may impact Sailfish OS and BB.

Some relatively recent numbers show that 83.5% of Android devices do NOT run the latest/greatest version of Android (Jellybean), which means Jellybean only has a 16.5% share of all Android devices. Ice Cream Sandwich is running on 28.6% of Android devices.

I think BlackBerry selected Gingerbread because it runs on 44.1% of Android devices and is still by far the most common version of Android operating today.

The practical result of this is that key features of major applications are, in fact, available at the Gingerbread level, because this is the predominant Android version and developers don't want to abandon such a large group of users. The bad news is that the most recent software versions and features, as well as performance optimizations, etc. can be missing on older version apps. Also, new software can be introduced that has no Gingerbread version at all.

So having Gingerbread level compatibility gives you a lot of core functionality (Instagram, Netflix, many many others) and that's unlikely to change, given the number of Android devices stuck on this version.

But my real question is whether Sailfish OS and BB 10 can set up a Nexus-like compatibility that can be updated with minimal delay following Google's official updates? How feasible is this? Is Google an ally, neutral, or an enemy when it comes to this sort of compatibility?

Btw, here are the numbers on Android:
http://visual.ly/android-fragmentati...35-outdated-os

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Maybe folks from Myriad will be forthcoming in clearing much of that up*, OHA is a major partner & they're apparently a founding member:
http://www.myriadgroup.com/about/industry-partners.aspx

I was just refreshing my memory on what Alien Dalvik's all about & offers etc:
http://www.myriadgroup.com/device-so...-software.aspx

What I found odd, is that there's no reference on that site anywhere about their relationship with Jolla/Sailfish.
Not in Partners, Customers, or even in their 2012 & 2013 News sections, I guess it doesn't necessarily mean much.

*doubtful though

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

This concept posted on Jolla Pioneer Fans page looks quite cool :D

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.n...27797363_o.jpg

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

If that's all screen (including the jolla word), it looks pretty good.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

No disc phone? :D

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

this is key point. Many on the BB forums are complaining about functionality in even core OS apps, (RIM's/Blackberry's inhouse FB and Twitter applications as an example) let alone android builds.

The other point of consideration is the means of installation.
whilst sideloading applications isn't particularly difficult, for the average consumer, even this is too technical to be a viable justification for not having native application builds.

g00gle aren't particularly enamoured of others piggybacking on their playstore or the developer framework (both devs and g00gle loose money from this process, without a clear path for non g00gle devices to access the store) and thus android applications would require a suitable repo and access capability.

@ jalyst, I for one don;t have any faith in or support for the OHA. They very much do their own thing and only if it suits the big players in that group. IMO it's just a nother bunch of punters who have ridden on the back of the word "Open" in the broader OSS community when in fact, there's very little that's actually open about their work, their governance or the way in which they make decisions.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Those numbers change rapidly, your stats are already outdated. ICS+JB are way over 50% together already, GB down to 38%.

Source: http://developer.android.com/about/d...rds/index.html

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

It appears that in China the Google Play store isn't big and many app developers just allow for the download of the apk file. That might work to Jolla's advantage because even with Android compatibility it will take time to get developers to add their files to the store. With the Chinese market it won't be like they are fighting the Goliath Google at the start.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

This is a good point and one I completely overlooked in my previous comment.
On this note, we have no idea exactly what Jolla is planning wrt an app/market store of their own.
We have been told to focus on development of apps using the SDK and wait for further instruction when it comes to uploading to any specific repo or store-front, so I can only assume that something is obviously in the pipe.
to this end, there wouldn't be much difficulty in setting up an "android" section in any application store/repo to accomodate ease of searching for apk's

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

The thing that BB did wrong about android compatibility is that they went for the numbers. Going for large app numbers and making sideloading not-so-easy has the sideffect of attracting low quality apps from developers that don't want to make the effort to create a native app. On the other hand it doesn't solve the "killer app" problem (as manifested with the N9/whatsapp craze) as a serious company wouldn't want to provide inferior quality, ported app, so they probably won't bother at all. (Even skype, which they clearly took the pains to integrate the apk very well with the blackberry hub, is buggy and feels out-of-place).

It doesn't appeal to the masses who won't switch because of one killer app they use every day (be it instagram, skype, viber, whatsapp, angrybirds or whatever) as sideloading is a bit tedious and there's no legit way to transfer paid apps to your BB unless you already have an android device.

In my book android compatibility must be there for people to sideload things easily (and even be able to run the actual play store) so that they fill the gaps of native apps missing, not as a way to boost app numbers.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Help me find the video
http://beijing.thegmic.com/
https://twitter.com/theGMIC
https://www.facebook.com/thegmic

Found so far:
http://www.mobisights.com/2013/05/07...g-android/9106

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

That is not entirely true. Try googling usual 'jolla site:myriadgroup.com' and you will find this:
http://www.myriadgroup.com/press/new...2-results.aspx

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Why I haven't bothered sideloading anything on my Z10.
Can't say I've missed anything either but then I've never missed any "killer" apps with my N9!
If they can manage to bugfix and restore some of the BBOS lost functionality with BB10, this will be a greater saviour for RIM than the Android player.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Embedded in a news post relating to their finances, well, at least it's very briefly mentioned somewhere.

Alien Dalvik solution seems to accommodate for much of this, amongst several (potentially crucial) features to help Jolla's Dalvik implementation outdo BB's.

From what I can garner from the AlienDalvik implementation, it doesn't allow this, sadly...
I hope it does, but no one's done it yet, so there must be something about OHA/PlayStore legalities that prevents it from happening :(

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

To me, sideloading on BB10 isn't that bad. There is a thread on crackberry forum keeping track of the working bar files for Android apps. Just install DDPB or Chrome extension and you are ready to go.

I have sideloaded a few apps and found ACL to be valuabe. I even feel that I might get a Jolla phone if ACL on Jolla supports decent amount of big name apps.

However, I hope Jolla's ACL has a better interface and gesture than BB10's. Sometimes the back gesture triggers a peek instead of going back....

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

The vast majority of Android phone are not on the latest version of Android, like 95%. Actual more than half are more than one version behind. So it is no big deal if you're just one version behind, is still better than most Android phones.

Edit: My numbers are way off, still had the figures in my head of a few months ago. My point still stands though.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

I don't need no crappy Android
Jolla leave them droids alone

Hey! Jolla! Leave them droids alone!

I just want another GNU/Linux phone

From 'Another Ad on the Droid' by Pink Droid

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

It's a nice romantic tune, but we live in a smartphone world that's utterly dominated by that platform...
If Sailfish is to become truly competitive/viable, it needs to draw interest from that crowd, a GNU/Linux phone only won't cut it any more unfortunately.
Comparing HTML5-centric platforms that aren't relying on Android is different....
Ubuntu's not HTML5-centric & isn't relying on a ACL, but it has other tricks up it's sleeve, some which Jolla can't replicate.
Actually I may be mistaken, but IIRC Tizen's using OpenACL for Android compatibility, either that or there's a BIG porting effort.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

People who want Android will buy an Android device. There are plenty to choose from, and they deliver a better Android experience that these sub-par alternatives. Enabling use of Android applications will simply discourage developers from making the effort to write applications using the native APIs. Why bother to target only $NICHE_PLATFORM when you can target Android, plus the others as a bonus.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Disagree, they won't bother at all if they're not at least initially lead down the garden path...
The way AD works (as I understand it), is that it attempts to make the Android app "native" as much as possible, the dev can be as actively involved (or not) in that process as they want.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

We'll see, as the Zen Master said. The problem is that they don't need to bother, if they are going to use Android as the main target. The applications will still work 'as is' on these other platforms. The eyes of a Sailfish/BB10 user are just as valuable as the eyes of an Android user. It doesn't matter who sees or clicks on the ad.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

All I know is that not taking that approach definitely hasn't worked so far...
It has to be done well or not all, if it's shite then they may as well have focused on Necessitas or porting like Canonical (supposedly) is, at which point they could be in lots of trouble.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Who cares about "dominating Android" for got sake people should get over it. If people want Android apps get an Samsung device. Android will not work good on SailfishOS anyway. SailfishOS == SwipeOS and no buttons.

Second, I dont beleive a **** that Android support will help Jolla in any way et all.

Instead it may hurt them. Because developers will port even less apps to Silica and instead saying "hey, you can install our Android version on your device" and then the endusers wonder why on earth he bought this jolladevice when none of the apps is using the swipeUI etc...


Personally I will not install ANY android apps on my device.

Its like the beginning of 2000 when many sites said: "You must have IE if you want to enter this site". Or MSN. Did I install IE or MSN chat? No I Din't I just f***cke them and I will do the same with Instagram and similar sites if they don't have native support for sailfish.

Third if you are a person who is "with the steam" I just wonder why on earth you even bother to go for small platform like Salfish? Its not for you. Atleast not until we know if the new platform success. But if we only see Android apps the platform is doomed thats for sure...

Btw. I reply Jatalyst now. But this is a reply to all Android related posts :)

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

It'll hurt them way more when "user Johnny" demographic realises he can't get XYZ apps or content because;

(a) the community still hasn't provided decent alternatives
(b) the developers/content_providers still aren't interested in getting involved in that community

He'll just stick to his big collection in iOS, Android, Other, he'd be mad not to, Or...
If he's a total n00b he'll be constantly referred to iOS/Android/Other because; "there's way more good apps/content, the OS is pretty good (if not better), & still somewhat hack-able, if one is so inclined."

It's a recipe for remaining forever niche, always quite a few steps behind in many respects, & eventually (possibly) totally redundant, all just to cater to a certain hard-core user demographic.
Do Android ACL well & that may not be the case longer-term, else don't do it & a have a fcking massive porting program in place, which I haven't seen them doing much of at all.
Do both but the latter on a more conservative scale & over a longer period of time, get much better & more efficient at it over time, + get more resources for it etc, is a better approach.
Another better approach may have been to start aggressively porting much sooner than they have, & not bother w/a ACL at all, but that's not a option any more.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

So what? Send a message to the lazy coders at those companys who does not provide support. Or realize facts that Sailfish small platform means less apps == not for those who want 100% support of all apps.

Btw. edited my post to make my point a bit more clear.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

There are so many android apps out there that it is not feasible to expect all the developers to write them for Sailfish. At least with being able to sideload then the apps that might be useful will still be available. I am thinking of banking apps and more local apps where sometimes just being able to use it even if it isn't the best is still useful. Some people may never need to use any android apps. Some people will never need to use developer mode. But it's nice to have that option should one desire it.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Talk about "bank apps" makes me pissed. Thats a mess even on desktop computers mostly because of the stupid decisions made by the stupid *****s at the banks!

Bank apps SHALL NOT depend on any platform! They MUST use webbrowser and HTML no freaking apps should be needed for such stuff!

Its just plain stupidness both for the banks and for the users!
In sweden we have a clientapplication (yes on desktop computer :mad: to authenticate to the bank. And its a real MESS on the desktop and it took YEARS to even get support for MacOSX and Linux and still its make me pissed every time I use that ridiculous piece of junk!

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

...when are you NOT pissed/ranting? (while i agree on the accessibility issue)

Simply calling up lazy devs and asking them to port apps to Sailfish OS will not work. That much has been shown time and time again. The goal should be to make the first Sailfish device as useful and as satisfying as possible. THIS MEANS QUALITY APP SUPPORT.

Gaining access to Android apps provides the results of millions of man-hours of development work and all the utility that comes with it. Can Sailfish afford to turn its back on that kind of value? Plus, motivated devs can still code in native Sailfish, should they choose.

What would be nice is if Jolla could figure a way to let the device owner configure the active cover's functions for those non-native apps. That, plus solid performance and custom swipe gestures to navigate and interact with apps, and I'd be very interested.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

You are all looking at this the wrong way. Focus on how YOU would like to use the device, with or without android.

Take what you want and ignore the rest please.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

So now we are arguing about whether or not having android apps is good for sailfish.
Well I can tell you that there are quite a few apps I need that are not on my N9, but they are on android.

Bankofamerica app would be great because right now it takes me more than 5 minutes to log on and find my balance using firefox.
Firefox is my only option because it has flash and many of the interactive elements of websites use flash and I can't sit there and run around making a list of all the websites that do and don't use flash I just need it to work. If someone is asking me if I can afford something I would very very much want to have a BofA app so I can answer in less than 2 minutes not almost 10 minutes like it is now using FF on my N9.

Those "turn your car into a cab" apps. Now that my car is broke I may need a quick way to find a ride.
Gigwalk
Train and bus scheduling apps

Firefox on N9 is super slow, almost everything that can replace having to go to the website and use firefox is a good app for me.
I imagine a sailfish phone will be similar. Unless they can get flash plus qt browser together on the sailfish phone without lots of funny bugs then I will be wanting to install the android browser dolphin and flash for android.

I'm so tired of people saying we don't need flash and then 90+% of websites I go to on my phone because I NEED TO use flash.
Logging into my previous employment agency website to see my last paycheck BECAUSE I HAVE TO so I can fill out some form, ordering a pizza, CNN, HULU, youtube, every other video and animation, everything uses flash so you can't tell me "no I can't have it" because that means I won't buy the sailfish phone.

I'm not a developer, I don't care if you think flash is sh**ty, I need stuff to work. Someone asks me a question, I need some info from a previous employer, I need to look something up, I don't have 10 minutes and the patience for the N9 that takes 6 seconds to rotate respond and minutes to load a page on 3 bars of 2.5g on FF.

I need to know quickly is Ironman playing tonight down the street, is this girls favorite coffee drink at the starbucks around the corner, can I apply for a job at this companies website using my phone, does this shop have the type of wood I need, can I quickly log on to my vons account and load the shopping specials and coupons before I go into the store because I just realized I forgot to, I DON'T HAVE 3 MINUTES TO WAIT FOR EACH PAGE TO LOAD I CAN'T GET ANYTHING DONE LIKE THAT WHO CAN LIVE LIKE THAT?

Sailfish with no flash=no buy for me
The only chance you have is if there are lots of android apps that I know can take the place of the website or I can see that I can install flash for android and something like dolphin browser.

The only times I use the N9 stock browser is for websites like this, forums where I know for sure don't need flash but even then someone posts a link to a video that I want to see that is in flash I have to copy and paste into firefox, super annoying.

My phone is supposed to be a tool that works. Not something that is so low performance that it constantly defies my expecatations of when it will load a page and then springs the surprise on me of putting something else right under my finger the millisecond before it hits the screen because my patience has ran out sending me off to somewhere else adding even more time to what I was trying to do making me want to crush my N9 in a vice.

The more apps available for me on this sailfish phone the better. If there is no flash natively then I will have to be able to load lots of android apps that replace the websites that I HAVE TO visit.
If the sailfish phone has a qt browser with flash then I am less concerned about the android apps but still there are lots of consumption based apps on android like netflix that I know I will want to have.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

...finally someone with real-world requirements telling. Good! The part following "My phone is supposed to..." kept me smiling, because i can tell how that feeling/suffering was from the last 2,5 years i truly needed something to work, And work as in right NOW.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

have you tried an iphone or an android device? cause those will fulfil all your wishes above.
but sailfish won't fulfill all of them at the moment.

edit: there is still a possibility for flash with QmlMozBrowser.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Well..... some might be.
It seems as valid a topic of conversation around Jolla/Sailfish as any other, given that android application useability has been raised as existent on the platform.

I for one don't care, and as I stated earlier, there were no "killer" apps that I truly missed on my N9. the only one I would have enjoyed having would have been Skype, and that only for being able to say hi to my two small kids, face to face when away.

That and the crippled wifi hotspot were (and still are) the only two major issues for me.

I can, however feel your pain with slow load/render times on the browser.

With only several days to go before #jollaloveday I guess we'll have most of the answers soon enough.

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!
 

Upcoming (september) Oppo Find would be great as Jolla Device :)
http://news.mydrivers.com/1/262/262892.htm

• No front buttons
• Snapdragon 800
• 2GB RAM
• 5" Display
• 1920x1080 resolution
• 13 Megapixel cam
• Bluetooth 4.0
• Wi-Fi b/g/n
• NFC

http://news.mydrivers.com/img/201305...aa2240280b.jpg

Re: Jolla Sailfish Is stunning! Now on video!