Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

There was a page listing most sold combinations, where is it?

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Here is at least one post:
http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p...&postcount=922

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

or, just search twitter for the tweet...
https://twitter.com/dirkvanleersum/s...87791808483328

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

domesheet are done, shipped tomorrow to me, keypad demo pieces should be sent the 8th. when they are checked we can order all keypads..

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

So somewhere between the 8th and, say 15th, you can (if all is ok) order the keypads? How long will it take and what has to be done after that?

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

yes, ordering before the 15th. they do not give estimations of how long it woll take and i cannot make a guess of that either.

but when they are here we can go straight to final assembly and shipping. all other parts will be ready tested waiting

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

i'll do a rough guesstimate that all units will be out sometime end of May. :P ok ok, i'm jumping the gun.

we've waited so long........muuusstttttt.....wwwaaiiiitttt....a.a. ...bbiiit...mooooreeee......arrrgh! :)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

eagle files now also in github

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Which means the original ETA of mid April, which was supposed to be generous, is not holding. Did not expect that... :(
Man, it's just all about waiting, with the Jolla apparatuses these days, isn't it?

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Waiting makes it worthwhile, right? :D:D

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

What, you haven't got used to Jolla's definition of "soon" yet? ;)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I think context is important here... the mid April statement was made before over reaching the goal of the project and adding more colours/options, so things obviously take longer.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

well no, keypad production is the bottleneck.. which is also the only component that we had no idea how long it would take.

now at workshop soldering keyboard pcbs

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Thanks for clarifying :) Although I would have thought that with more units requested, this task would take longer :)

Nice, I can't wait! :)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Currently 48 TOHKBDs left in the shop.

When the time comes to assemble I will go in priority order mentioned before, funkyoh orders last. Like every other project, this is a batch process. So after the batch, no more.

I will have lot of spares left though, which means I will be offering TOHKBD in kit form, casings not included, some soldering and assembling.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Do not forget about special developer and signature editions ;)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I never forget devs and signature edition looks awesome.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I just had a look at the eagle schematics and board files and some questions arose:

• "TOH Technical Specifications" from Jolla define some antenna keep out areas. The document says: "avoid anything else than pure cover plastic on those areas to keep antenna performance intact." If I understand the board layout correctly there are two ground layers covering these areas. Don't these shield the antennas?
• VDD, SDA, SCL, INT and GND are directly routed from the phone to the contact surfaces. What happens when I have my Jolla with some metal (e.g. my keys) in a bag without the keyboard attached? These contacts are quite exposed and could easily be shorted. 3.3V output is switchable but I suspect it is turned on as soon as the back cover is in place and the corresponding software is installed and executed. SDA, SCL and INT use 1.8V level. Wouldn't 3.3V on that pins damage the phone? At least the EEPROM used on the TOHKBD can only manage VCC+0.5V resulting in 2.3V applied to its input pins according to a data sheet I found. Wouldn't this be damaged if SDA or SCL were shorted with 3.3V? I could not find any reference to a protection circuit inside the phone.

@dirkvl: If you plan on drilling the pad holes manually into your self made PCBs you should use 'drill-aid.ulp' to have small holes in the center of the pads. The thickness of the copper layer helps to keep the drill centered while drilling.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Yes this is something I realized after ordering and soldering all the pcbs.. But in my use here I have noticed no issues whatsoever in signal strength, so hopefully in the less signal-generous areas this will not cause issues. But again, no signal issues on this side.

Check the connection detector sequence on the github, power is cut off when the keyboard is not connected. Should be fine!

Yeah I am just getting started, but there is already some drilling stuff in the gerbers. :)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Damn! Well, you can't think of everything. I hope I too won't see any less signal strength.

Did that now. Only thing I can imagine to lead to a hardware fault would be to short GND to INT pad and also 3,3V to one of SDA/SCL at the same time. This could possibly damage your EEPROM and phone because 3,3V would be switched on for a short time when pulling INT to ground.

BTW: What PNP transistor do you use? I'd like to check the collector-emitter-voltage ;) (I ended up making a small "simulation" using falstads electronic circuit simulator. The attached file can be opened with it.)

The drills/holes in Gerber files do contain the diameter that fits the THT device's pins. For manual drilling (without CNC) it's handy to etch a 0,1-0,3 mm hole in the copper layer so the drill centers itself. See drill-aid.ulp ;)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

This remains a big concern for me, as I've noticed severe malfunction of the antennas with the diptoh and the solartoh, and so did Clovis, while we have absolutely no network issues with Jolla OHs or toholed. Same observation for me in several different cities. This is something I've reported in the diptoh's thread (or solartoh's or tohkbd2's, can't remember) a few months ago, but got no real answer or testing on the matter, except another TMO member who said he didn't notice such severe network losses.

As posted in the aforementioned message, I admit I'm worrying a bit if tohkbd2 is designed the same way/covers antenna areas. It seems that not all Jolla units and/or connection providers among countries are equal (Clovis and me are French, both couldn't use phone with diptoh and/or solartoh, and there are not many other active French members here who use these OHs, so we lack additional feedback). :[

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I am in France (using Free) and have not seen bad signal with solartoh. I live in a dense area so signal is always quite strong anyway so not sure that this is a good place to test.
Next time I am going to some place where signal is weak, I will try to think about testing with that toh...

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I hope that you realize that the compass will also not be usable anymore because of the magnets :p

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

We have tested it and it works fine! #surprise

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Great news!!!
Now I can find my way and never get lost...!! :p

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I tried to fool the compass once with magnets but found out it does not affect the device at all. From this I concluded that it is not a magnetic (hall device) compass at all, but rather some inertial dingbat...

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

That would not work - not on any reasonable time frame, when you turn the device off, etc. But it could indeed be combining magnetic field data with data from other sensors (gyroscope, accelerometer, etc.) to get a better reading and filter out interference (such as juicemes magnets ;-) ).

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Could be. Or else it is just GPS+inertial without anything magnetic...
(If it is something to do with GPS then it would require the device to move a little in order for the GPS to record the diretion it is going... then inertial/acceleration fix to determine which way is the north-pointing edge... fairly complex operation.)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I just HAD to try it. My Jolla's compass did not react to the magnet at all. And I tried VERY hard, from all sorts of angles and positions. The compass in a colleague's smart watch went completely berserk from about 50cm distance.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

The Blackphone resets when TOHKBD is near :p

No problemo for Jolla

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Report that as a vulnerability :D

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Thanks for your input. I'm using Free too. I tried from Orléans to Brittany (and the places in between, including large cities like Rennes) as well as several smaller cities where the signal is usually very good. I also tried areas with data signal from EDGE to 4G. The connection loss was dramatic: note that I did not "try" it, I just noticed that, with solaroh or diptoh, I couldn't get any signal most of the time. At all, not just poor signal. It was quite obvious. Reboot with another OH, signal. Reboot with solaroh or diptoh, no signal. I noticed it after I realized that I couldn't call anyone or be called when I needed to, and had to reboot to try to solve it. Everytime I could get signal again (by removing the diptoh and keeping the Jolla uncovered in my jean's), I received a bunch of SMS that accumulated during the day. To be honest, sometimes it was working properly, but it seems it was getting worse over time (no scientific test on that).

Clovis observed the same with his solaroh, before he had to send it back. I think he's using Free as well. I never sent back my diptoh and solaroh, but I am still very concerned if I have the same issues with the tohkbd2. It's just that this toh is so much anticipated, I would be so disappointed if it ended up being unusable on my Jolla.

Let me stress again that I never have network issues with other toh (toholed prototype, toholed, Jolla OHs), hence my worries.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Indeed - GPS only gives you you current coordinates and that's it. To get direction of travel (and you can infer where is north from that) you need to move at some speed - from my experience it needs to be at least regular walking speed.

But that would still not work - you can turn Jolla off, turn it back on and even with disabled GPS it will still show you where is north, even when being rotated repeatedly. So the compass in the Jolla is definitely using the Earth magnetic field for reference, with possible help from other sensors to get better results.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Since I don't have a credit card, I'm depending on my friend's help on this.
I hope I'm not too late for preordering tomorrow, a TOHKB to Indonesia.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I take it back. I definitely fooled my Jolla when I tried calibrating the compass with a (small and not very strong) magnet attached. So much so that it took another two calibration attempts to get it back to normal. So it looks like it does use a magnetic sensor but may do something like a long-time average to compensate for fluctuations. This may be a bad news for TOHKBD with magnets permanently attached.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Yes, unless, they have more antennas, which would highly increase the time needed for calculating direction (still, GPS needs to be available)

I believe this is what is going on. It is using both a mangnetic sensor, together with the gyro sensor to give you direction. Perhaps even functionality of A-GPS/GPS if available.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I think it should still work - the magnetometers (the solid state magnetic compasses used in smartphones are apparently made from 3 differently oriented magnetometers and the result compued by trigonometry according to Wikipedia)) probably measure changes in the magnetic field, not absolute values. So as long as the magnets are not moving in regards to the magnetometers & as long as the magnetic field changes caused by the device moving in the Earths magnetic field can be measured, then even a couple of strong magnets in a close proximity might not be an issue.

So maybe try to tape the magnets to you Jolla next time to see if they also influence the compass accuracy or not ? :)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

New keypads are here!!!

Keypress is glorious!!! Feels like heaven

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

That's good PR but not good for managing expectations ;)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

> I take it back. I definitely fooled my Jolla when I tried calibrating the compass with a (small and not very strong) magnet attached.

I could not reproduce this. Position of Compass is very stabel even exposed to quite a strong magnet.
> New keypads are here!!!

> Keypress is glorious!!! Feels like heaven

I'm so excited. Thank you for keeping us updated Dirk.