Re: Harmattan?
 

I expected more. Oh well... back to your cave.

Re: Harmattan?
 

The finger-pointing game is fun but it goes quickly circular. The FCC is to blame for allowing the carrier anticompetiveness to continue. The federal leadership is to blame for allowing the FCC to do so. The American voters are to blame for voting in that leadership. Etc etc etc.

Personally I blame LG, Samsung and Motorola. Nokia made a big, serious effort to turn the US market on its head and those 3, rather than recognizing the longterm benefit and joining in, chose to go for the quick bucks and take the market share Nokia "gave up".

We see where that got Moto.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Not really. The blaming game stops at the consumers getting crippled subsidized handsets (a committing themselves to contracts) instead of just buying hardware onl their own. The subsidized model works relatively well with generic phones used "just to call people" but it utterly fails smartphone users, narrowing their choice of options to 2-3 [crippled] models offered by their network operator.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Unfortunately the American markets are not as densely populated as European or Asian markets. On top of that we use 3 totally different network technologies that don't always overlap. Add to that equation the fact that two of the network technologies are proprietary and the usage rights to one of these technologies is controlled by a single handset manufacturer.

In many instances geography determines what handset is used and customer choice is rather limited.

...besides, the horse is out of the barn already.

The change to an un-subsidized phone for some would require an additional $400 up front...

A $200 Early Termination Fee plus a $200 dollar premium for the equipment itself.

Re: Harmattan?
 

I stand by my assessment. Nokia tried to change the game and other manufacturers torpedoed the effort... despite the fact that they would have benefitted in the long run. Nokia's move was the last best chance to change the model unless US lawmakers finally do their jobs.

As long as the subsidized model dominates in the US, many buyers will opt for the "free" or cheap phone. It's seen as buying on credit with no apparent interest-- although we all know the cost is ultimately higher.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Really? Check this table:

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0933563.html

It indicates that approximately 86% (262,700,000) of the US population had cell phones in 2008. Remove a few people having more than one phone, and you still get a sizable number.

You have got GSM in several bands (usually covered by a multi-band GSM phone) and CDMA (that can be largely ignored).

The standard answer here is "screw them". You have got several nationwide GSM networks, use them, ignore proprietary stuff, and it will eventually die off.

Well, what can I say? Either wait until the end of your contract or use any loophole you can find with Google.

Re: Harmattan?
 

I think he meant that there is a lot more room/space between the people in the US versus other countries. We're not as tightly packed together in the US as say... Britain or Hong Kong.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Largely ignored???

The largest provider, Verizon, runs on CDMA.

Sounds great in theory, but ignores far too many inertial factors. If it was that simple it would have happened long ago... and Nokia would not have needed cooperation from Moto and the rest when the big US provider-cracking attempt was made.

Re: Harmattan?
 

... even more OT: i wasn't aware of these figures. in austria (pop.: 8,316,487), there are ~10 million SIM cards in active use, which means a rate of over 120%.

i hadn't expected the gap to be so significant between the USA and a small european country.

Re: Harmattan?
 

There are even odder cases if look at smaller countries - Montenegro (pop: 650,000) boasts a 185% rate.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Yup... and if you find a chart that shows the mean distance between subscriber and cell tower, you may see that the number is quite large in these parts as well.

***

You may be right fms, let the millions of iDEN and proprietary CDMA customers eat cake. :rolleyes:

For the record... it doesn't bother me a dang bit. My employer/client has provided me with unlimited service and new handsets whenever I need them for the past 8 years. Any future employment contracts I sign will have the same provisions.

...but many millions of subscribers live pay check to pay check.

BTW, fms I find your "screw them" philosophy hard to relate to. Can you provide any examples of how this attitude has worked out for you or others in the past. :)

Re: Harmattan?
 

Russia. All GSM. No subsidies, no contracts, 18% VAT. Mostly pay-as-you-go calling. And it still ends up cheaper than in US.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Wouldn't read too much into me not responding. In general, I don't comment on speculation of future devices.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Attitude worked beautifully for me over the past years. I do not have to deal with the Phone Company, because I have no DSL. I do not have to deal with the Cable Company, because I have no cable. I do not have to pay monthly fees to my Cell Service Provider, because I only pay for minutes/megabytes used and that comes to <$20/month. My web browser shows clean web pages (AdBlock+) and I avoid watching TV if I can (not making a cult of this though). If I do watch TV, there is a Chinese-made recorder letting me skip through ads.

Believe me, locking all these things out of your life makes perfect sense.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Well good for you...:)

To many, you live a life of luxury that few can realistically afford...

It is kind of like that age old dilemma; What came first, the liquor store or the run down neighborhood?

...and sort of back on topic. How come all that seems to be advertised in rundown neighborhoods is liquor?

Re: Harmattan?
 

Which of the above things can't you afford, aside maybe from having to have at least some Net connection (DSL or cable)?

Re: Harmattan?
 

OK... you win. This thread is now all about you and your point of view. Have fun. :)

Re: Harmattan?
 

I know this is a dated thread but. part of the problem is also just general concepts and ideas of how to run a country and how much influence the government should have.

I suspect for countries that are more socialist, it's more acceptable for the government to push telcos around. While if the same is done in the USA (if not carefully) tons of lawsuits are filed and advocacy groups are created. And the US being half foot in socialist, half foot in capitalist gets screwed on both halfs without the benefits of both.

Re: Harmattan?
 

This has nothing to do with how country is run. And, believe me, there is nothing "socialist" about Russia nowadays...

Re: Harmattan?
 

Halves?? The US economy is more corporatist capitalist than any other country. Who were you comparing to? Historical fascist states?

/politics.. sorry.

Re: Harmattan?
 

What I find striking is the illogic in lack of 3G standard in USA. Always different frequencies, and then the loud complaints about one or more not supported. Geez, get your standards straight!

Mabe it makes sense to read into different definitions of socialism. The compare chart here I found pretty useful.

Furthermore, Lord Raiden's thread "One likely reason why our cell rates will never improve." bears a similar discussion as the one held in the last couple of posts in this thread.

Re: Harmattan?
 

When I say socialist I don't mean like Italy during WW2. I mean modern socialist like how some countries in Europe are socialist. Maybe my use of the term was to broad. But the link allnameswereout pointed out will explain for me. As you can see while indeed the US is still more corporatist capitalist than any other country, it's also socialist. Hence my it's half foot in one, half foot in the other.

Thank you allnameswereout.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Does anybody have any news concerning whether the N900 wil be able to upgrade to Harmattan??

Re: Harmattan?
 

No. I doubt whether Nokia's even sure about that at this point.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Is the next device multi-touch enabled?

The n900 can never have that support, how would Nokia deal with this?

Multi-touch brings in new ways of handling the content on the screen, and such ways cannot be backported to the N900.

I believe the N900 won't be able to run Harmattan.
But I strongly believe the community will be asked to step in again.

Anidel

Re: Harmattan?
 

This is a rumor I keep seeing pop up based on multitouch capability in Qt 4.6. Nobody outside of Nokia can answer this question, though. :)

Look at the iPhone or the G1, is multitouch really a make-or-break proposition there?

I disagree, but we'll just have to wait and see.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Troll^WQt Software guys have working implementation of multitouch for Qt. Problem at the moment lies not in Qt but in underlying platform. AFAIU implementation worked on Windows but not on Linux and they were cooperating with kernel people on that.

General Qt philosophy is to publish cross-platform-working features. If they will be able to push working multitouch feature on all platforms it will be in 4.6. If not - we will wait for 4.7. Just my opinion.

Re: Harmattan?
 

Well, computers aren´t "O.S. locked" for quite a long time now. O.S. upgrading ability is something very important, at least for me, to consider the N900 a real mobile computer.

Re: Harmattan?
 

I would tend to agree. I don't think Nokia is where it wants to be with regard to high-end phones and tablets. I think multi-touch is a likely direction to better compete with other phones and enhanced multimedia is another possible direction to better compete with MIDs and PMPs. Then there's 4G, USB3, not to mention advances in CPUs, GPUs, RAM, SSD, etc.

I suspect that the N9x0 will parallel the N8x0. We will see an enhanced N910 sometime next year that still runs Maemo 5. We will then see a new N1000 in 2011 that runs Maemo 6. Maemo 6 will require the hardware enhancements of the N1000 and will not be usable on the N9x0.

The community will then begin work on an open source version code named Merkin. :rolleyes:

Re: Harmattan?
 

That sounds like a realistic move, if you ask me. I think the changes in Maemo 6 can be substantial if Nokia takes enough time to make it right. That would allow for an optimised version of Maemo5, while still allowing N900 users to feel like their devices are supported for a bit longer.

My hope is that once the first solid device with Maemo6 is out, that should mark the first step in a more stable direction. In other words, I think the N900 and Maemo5 are not where Nokia wants to be (certain important features missing, it still uses GTK+, etc).

However, Maemo 6 should then be the real foundation, one that really sets the stage for evolution in these devices more like PCs evolve, with perhaps no fundamental changes for years. That would allow for OS upgrades to be used for years.

In such environment, an old device would just suffer from less powerful hardware and perhaps some non-critical features missing. Just like PCs do.

Of course, that would not make buying another device such an important thing, and perhaps device sales would decrease, but then again, that´s where the industry is going. PC manufactures realised that selling devices is no longer a business that can bring them income as it used to, and the same will apply to mobile phones quickly.

Like some other posters already mentioned, Nokia should focus on the application store and things like that as their future strategy, not about the device sales, specially considering that in a close future I see the posibility of installing Maemo on any device, just like Linux can be installed on most PCs.

Re: Harmattan UI framework development is opened
 

http://phonewebz.com/wp-content/uplo...-harmattan.jpg

http://phonewebz.com/maemo-harmattan...-mobile-os.htm

interesting quote
"Another interesting widget is the ad widgets. This widgets is special and cannot be remove or customize by user. Nokia’s plan with this widget is make it context sensitive based on environment and behavioral data. GPS place you near a car shop? Well, enjoy your Ford ads."

Re: Harmattan UI framework development is opened
 

I'll go out on an optimistic, naive limb here and say that this will only be true for locked and/or subsidized phones. If so, this could be the US carrier compliance Nokia needs to establish a better presence in places like America. It would sadden me if I'm wrong.