Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Again, this is not an absolute at all but comes down to use case.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

The ones not taken by guber99.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

A very good idea...
The MeeGo site does not look like it was designed by committee and seems to work very well, IMHO. If it was done in house, there may be a couple of skilled individuals there that can be utilized.

BTW, never used drupal but I believe there is a fork of drupal called vbdrupal or somesuch that may offer another alternative.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

I fully agree with starting from scratch ,with single sign-on, and a structure similar to this. I am relatively new to this community and Maemo since the arrival of the N900. For me this community is my first stop when it comes to solving any issue I have had with my device. Granted there is a lot of "noise" that has to filtered through to find what you need at times. Imo this format is logical and easy to navigate for newcomers. Also, if the Moblin community does not have structured community such as ours then the migration to a Meego community will seem less obtrusive and more inviting if everyone is on the same playing field.

I am grateful for all who have contributed to make this community what it is today, and maybe the best way to honor that is to leave this forum for "legacy" devices.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

first of all bear my english from time to time sucks as im not native english speaker.

maemo.org should be left alone from meego, also moblin should be left alone for whatever they have, meego should have a community merging the best of the two OS which i think we have the most of the good things and the moblin community is more mail list type.

so we make a copy of this forum reorganize the talk structure keep the other thing as they are like garage brainstorm etc.

and we make a new community, why we make a new community from scratch because this wont be NOKIA alone, we will have more HW developers jumping in the meego wagon, so i feel we should make the community from scratch.

but hey im new here my first tablet is my N900 and i havent been long enough here in maemo.org, but i love the way things are here and i think we should have the same thing in MEEGO

Maemo should be left like it is and not moved, you can make a thread asking for people that wants to migrate in the future to Meego to register at meego and the guys developing for maemo that wants to jump to meego to move overthere and thats it.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Well, having talked to a few of the Intel people over there the conclusion seems to be that the current meego.com is a result of PR requirements from Intel and Nokia, and that now we can actually focus on making it something useful for the community now that the launch is passed.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

If all discussion of future versions of the OS (Meego) and the devices it runs on takes place elsewhere, how long will "here" be here? Is it logical to assume a long lifespan for maemo.org when "maemo" is a thing of the past that only runs on a few discontinued Nokia devices?

I'm asking questions because I don't know the answers. But I hope some thought will be given to the best strategy for maintaining community support for legacy devices and their OS versions. It seems to me that their might be some advantages in having Meego (and its community and forums) inherit some responsibilities toward its parent OSs.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Just a vaguely on-topic thought. If we start something new, it might be a good time to discuss the level and style of moderation. I see a number of requests for tighter moderation now this place is a large community. Might be worth discussing.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Fyi, I'm testing an add-on that I made that forces a user to register at meego.com first before registering on the vB forum (in sandbox) so usernames would always match. Hopefully this will make it easier for future integration.

It's working well but am open for any better solutions.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Keep in mind that (unlike Maemo) Meego OS does not include the UI, etc., on top of the OS. So Nokia devices will have differentiation in that way (the way that HTC etc puts their UI on WinMo and Android) and such devices and differentiation may not be discussed on MeeGo. Add to that the fact that people will try to put Meego on N900 and Maemo apps on MeeGo and that there will be more MeeGo devices (Nokia and otherwise) than there would have been Nokia Maemo devices. MeeGO does the heavy lifting on the low level stuff and so only discussions of that kind of stuff will need to move to MeeGo.

http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p...2&postcount=79

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Uh, where to start... Let me first express how important forums are - I absolutely hate mailing lists (even tho most of the projects I'm contributing to are handled that way) and I solemnly swear that I won't develop and contribute, heck I won't even shake a stick at anything that is handled by mailing lists ever again! Forums have much easier structure to follow, threading is much better and it doesn't depend on particular user's mail client, you can do more detailed searches, you can have far better data structure and you can easily ignore noise, and all that in a fairly easy and user friendly manner. And that's what puts forum systems ahead of any `social networking` system I have ever seen. Forums just work! Same goes for IRC, I left that type of communication in mid '90s and times of BBS, and I have no desire to go back to that. So, for me it's clear, no forums == no me on MeeGo.

Anyway, first about the forum system, Drupal is way too basic for the needs of an extensive community, it would be a PITA to use it even here, and it would exponentially grow to a major PITA on a community that should unite all MeeGo users. No matter how much more I prefer non-proprietary solutions, Drupal just doesn't cut it. Then again, vBulletin also lacks (to my knowledge, never installed it on my servers to look in the back of it) several crucial features - one of them being ability to mark several posts for quotation in response, I prefer to reply to several posts in one post (reduces clutter), and in current t.m.o I actually have to open several tabs using 'Quote & Reply' and then merge all the quotes into a single post. I guess my preferable option would be IPB, tho it also lacks some other things. Maybe a half-breed between vBulletin and IPB if that would be possible :D

Either way, besides the regular ones, it must have features such as ability to completely ignore complete sub-forums that are of no interest to you (even if it has to be done through group memberships), it must have a good search (good search == everything that better searches the forums than Google themselves), it must have thanks/rating/kudos/whatever system for rewarding productive members of the community (and for couple of other things I'll mention in that other thread about Karma) and ranking threads, and it would be very sweet if it could have multiple quotations (interface wise), tags, attachments and such.

On to the structure, I'm somewhat undecided should t.m.o be transferred there or left here. At one hand, all the current Maemo devices have nothing to do with MeeGo, so it's somewhat natural for Maemo discussion to remain here, but then we might be creating a huge community split - I for one will probably, with time, focus only on one of the forums. Also if we are to transfer all the data from here on meego.com in a possibly separate sub-forum, we'd have to transfer all the members as well, and some might don't want that, and others might not deserve that.

So, I'm for tabula rasa on meego.com, with a possibility to transfer members from here, but only optionally. One of the simplest way to do that is to reserve all the available active users on t.m.o there, but to set expiration date of a week with no login, and post an announcement here. That way only really active users (who wish that) will move there, and after a week anybody could take their nickname or whatever.

I'm perfectly aware that either way it's approached, it will probably mean slow death to t.m.o, but a community is not about a domain or some specific forum - it's about the people.

And in the end, I actually think that the most difficult thing would be to create an useful structure on the new forums as it will no longer be about several devices, nor about Nokia, it will be far broader and it's hard to integrate discussions about some future car multimedia system, a handheld device, a TV and a microwave (why not? :D). Maybe it should be something like:

I wouldn't split development per device type (at least when it comes to Applications), but rather encourage users to either use tags, or even better to integrate in their title what device/platform are they targeting in the title name (e.g. [N900] App Name, or [Maemo 5] App Name... ). That way people that explore the future development might get an idea for application for a platform that might not be available or provided by the original developer, or people using devices not supported might encourage that person to develop a version for that platform...

Also, I think that Moblin guys should be included in this discussion, after all, we are merging communities. If they don't want to come here, let us set up a neutral ground somewhere and address both sides of the MeeGo coin.

That would be my somewhat lengthy 2¢...

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Actually, it does, it just has a number of options for that slot. The Moblin netbook UI and the Maemo UI are the two that are there at the moment (other manufacturers are apparently welcome to bring their own if it suits them).

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

It provides a reference UX as per the MeeGo architecture. People can, of course, forego it for their own solution, but that is another question. I know I'm totally boring with this, but the this is the same problem as with the 'first MeeGo device is an LG phone' branding problem, now everything is called Meego, regardless of how much it actually has in common with a 'full' implementation of MeeGo (if there is such a thing).

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Hi from rushman
after reading forum comments regards to Maemo,Moblin coming together
I decided to have a look.

I downloaded an img file to a pen drive so I could test on all my family computers.
Computers are.

AMD quad 965 clocked 4 gig. 8Gig memory
Lenover laptop 3000 v200 2gig intel duo 4 gig ram.
Samsung N10 netbook intel.

I will only comment on the netbook. No problems with the other 2 computer.
Other than to unbelievable fast to load and use.

The netbook triple boots, XP, mint Linux, and opensuse 11.1.
My wife thought it was the easiest OS she has used and now wants installed.
My sister did not like the icons across the top of the desktop,but my wife and sister
after 1 hour were both at one with it.

My brother in-law thinks if this comes to cell phones it will be the bee's knees??.

For me I was impressed it boots up in under 10 seconds,once you get used to the icons at
the top. Using it becomes very easy, very fast, an logical. No 3 g internally.

There has been no mention of novell or KDE in meego but there is a connection somewhere
I use both rpm's and deb I do not have any problems with either.

I believe the marriagee ofMeemoo and moblin could give one of the best mobile experiencess

if not the best available in the very near future.
With regard to forums they do not seem to use them on the meego site . Why not leave things as they are with a separate section for joint use.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

So, there is a decision now to:
1. have a forum for meego (good)
2. use vBulletin (good)
if I understand correctly?

Would it be possible to implement single sign-on already at the start? I mean the "future" in future integration should be in about 2-3 weeks, when the 2nd wave hits meego.com.

(Sorry for commenting on the one person who actually does something...)

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Just to say that vBulletin is perfectly capable of mult-quote. I'm not sure why we don't use that feature here.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

The UI and UX are indeed on top of the OS:
http://meego.com/developers/meego-architecture

Not what is part of MeeGo brand, but what is the MeeGo OS.

And the point of distinction against Maemo, MeeGo has reference (in other words, "voluntary") UX and UIs, which are not part of the OS. Has Maemo 5 ever offered the choice of voluntary UX and UI? - As far as I know you had no choice so some people referred (perhaps improperly so) to the UX and UI as part of the Maemo 5 OS or inextricably hooked into the OS.

This is important thing. It can lead to Android-like ecosystem which is quite different in this respect from Maemo.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

There is a scheduled IRC meeting on Wednesday (or maybe Tuesday) to discuss the services needed on the meego.com website. One of the topics will be the forums.

Here's the email from Tero about it:
http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/mae...ry/003956.html

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

That's a slippery argument. It can equally be said that Maemo 5 never prevented you to employ a different UI/UX. While certain components were closed and welded, there is quite a bit that could be replaced. We even had a Diablo clone a while back with different UI/UX (Optima something ?).

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Yes, I agree it's not cut and dry, but my understanding is that the Diablo clone could not be done despite significant efforts of very talented people (was it timeless?). And, it would probably be easier to put Diablo on top of Meego than Harmatton (because Meego intends to have different UI and supports GTK+), which is not an argument, but an assumption I am thinking out loud.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

I suggest creating appropriate MeeGo-related subforums at talk.maemo.org, then making talk.meego.com point to talk.maemo.org. To make a branding distinction, use two different default themes for people coming from maemo.org and meego.com domains.

PS: The existing t.m.o subforums will have to be reorganized, with historic stuff pushed down the main page, to make space for the new MeeGo subforums.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

I have some ideas about this... but a question first...

Wouldn't this be a good thing to post as a brainstorm? We have a collection of suggestions both in the OP, and in some of the replies --- seems to me like it'd be useful to be able to directly vote on each of the suggestions.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

As someone who has yet to see anything useful come out of Brainstorm. I'm going to say, "No".

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Based on some kid's repetitive banning/rejoining/trolling tonight, I'd like MeeGo community signup to have a fairly high bar. Email confirmations, a few hurdles to leap, etc.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

This isn't going to be as controversial as the ITT switchover unless you have a lowturnout election on some other site asking the people from this site whether they want to move to that site, first requiring them to join that site and go there to vote.

I would say that this site should be left more or less as it is until most of the users have voted with their feet. Then forums that are becoming deserted here should be shut down but forums that remain popular (legacy forums, off topic) should be left for those who want to use them.

It is amazing to me that I haven't seen one identifiable user from the Moblin community here. Are they really that scarce or is something else going on? It is almost spooky.

Those who want to have stricter moderation -- please be aware that some really wonderful threads have developed here, and some developers who understand how to use them aren't having big problems with whiners, etc. This is a vigorous environment. Even all the Brits complaining about their updates are our friends. Even almost all of the malcontents are interested members of the community. Don't kill that.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

I only want very specific and extremely rare strict moderation. My issue is with a very, very tiny number of people and posts.

I do agree with allowing malcontents to have their say. I would not be comfortable in some sort of cheerleading forum at all (especially since I can be a malcontent on occasion). ;)

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

You're my new hero. :)

Lurking on itT is what attracted me to Maemo in the first place. The community that developed there is what helped me through the love/hate relationship that comes with anything new. In that one paragraph you accurately describe my motivation and what I tried to express back then.
(Mailing lists will always remind me of the 1/2 inch thick, fan fold, "catch-up" print outs I would take as reading material on long plane rides in the days before laptops. :eek: )
Thank you. :)


I'm thinkin' that^ would be the best preventative medicine as well. I can't think of better way to start. Things like >> this << would be easier to implement too.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

No doubt there will be folks registering multiple accounts at meego.com as time goes by. That add-on might help report them. I hope it makes its way to vB 4.0.

Anyway, that looks like a great add-on here at TMO. ;)

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Sure, it is sooo convenient to have to hunt down one hundreds forums in 10 thousands threads to find something interesting, instead of having messages coming to you, neatly filed in their own folder, sorted as you like, with unread messages clearly marked and where you can skip a whole thread with the press of a button.
:rolleyes:

And we all know that all kinds of forums have the same interface, so it's easier to adapt, while the same email program you use will change every day surprising you
:rolleyes:

BTW, the only email programs that royally screws up threading (as well as anything else) are those from microshaft, so there are plenty of alternatives.
Even so, mostly only users that decide to use those inferior options are affected, while all the users of a forum are affected by a change/cock-up in the forum's software and/or configuration.

Sure, we all know that searching in a forum is sooo effective that you never see the same question repeated over and over
:rolleyes:

OTOH my mail program only allows me to sort the messages by thread, date, sender, subject and search based on any of them as well as on the content. Clearly inferior
:rolleyes:

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Another random thought: there are ceops procedures and protocols for sites that allow input from minors. I don't suppose it's been an issue before but I noticed in the 'How old are you?' thread in Off Topic that we do have minors here. Since we're setting up something new, it would probably be worth checking we're compliant (I don't think MeeGo.com is at present). If this technology turns out to be as wizzy as promised, we may have more teens turn up. (Like it or not) Might as well cover our backs.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Random:

How about putting a nice karma bounty for someone who takes up one of the brainstorm's suggestion and implements it to fulfill the brainstorm's query...

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

This violates years old forum rule: no age discrimination. It should not matter how old you are. Only how you behave matters.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

I think you're missing my point. There are certain basic principles which websites sign up to and incorporate in their treatment of all members which are required under the voluntary code for sites which welcome minors. It doesn't discriminate at all: merely ensures that if there are young people here (which there are) we are in line with the standards for a place they're considered 'safe'. Not to do so would be discriminatory should there come a point where ceops blocked non-compliant sites through children's safety systems and some members are then excluded.

My point is tht this place is perfectly fine for people of al ages, we lose nothing by complying with standards set down to ensure it.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

This is now scheduled for 20:00 UTC:

http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/mee...ry/000408.html

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Nothing useful? While some of the ideas take a long time to implement, at least a couple of things have come out of it already... And even better, most of these have been implemented by the community, not by Nokia.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

In my paranoid moments, I think that Brainstorm represents a conspiracy of slowness, because of some secret reason I haven't been told. It's like, when there is a run on banks, clerks start counting money really, really slowly to give the system time to recover.

So I'd like to strongly endorse the opinion of GA, someone I have long admired and agreed with on almost every issue...

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Well.... Out of the 12 "implemented" ones:

• 3 are meta-ideas about brainstorm itself.
• 4 point to already existing official functionality (PIM, SMS, Send email keyboard shortcut, kernel address space randomisation), ie would be WORKSFORME in bugzilla.
• 2 point to community projects (Mauku, Hermes) developed independently of brainstorm.

That leaves:

Call recording
Support subtitles in Media Player
Make it easier to switch to the Desktop/App Menu

for which I have no info (it would be nice to have a pointer to the implementation)

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Apologies for going OT, but when filtering Brainstorm by Status = "In Development", why are brainstorms with status "Implemented" and "Under Consideration" being listed?

I tend to agree Brainstorm hasn't turned out to be as useful as we might have hoped - many good ideas will probably never be implemented (by Nokia/Maemo) due to the shifting sands that Maemo has become. Hopefully if/when MeeGo becomes a stable and long-term platform it will make more sense to invest time implementing good ideas raised through Brainstorm.

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Bug. There is a fix for that waiting for deployment. Thanks!

Re: MeeGo forum? (maemo.org round)
 

Hmmmm --- I guess I haven't been around long enough to be as cynical about it... I like the fact that you can have a bunch of different 'solutions', and then have people vote on it...

As I was reading this thread, and all of the different suggestions, I found myself thinking "oh, that's a good idea", or "don't like that one", and I'd have liked to be able to give each of the ideas a thumbs up or thumbs down...

Even if brainstorm hasn't produced a lot of other useful improvements, it seems to me like a good tool for this kinda thing...