Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

The sample videos on the phone look awesome but I cant get videos I transfer to play smoothly at all. I've converted an AVI movie to MP4 (854x480, 29.97 fps). Output is jerky. It's surprising as Media is king these days, I would have though the Nokia Suite would convert itself or at least advise how to convert to achieve best results. As I have said, the sample videos looks amazing and I would like for my movies to end up like this also!



any suggestions welcome. I'm using Freemake Video converter as suggested above (which is v nice btw).

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

I already mentioned it in this very thread how I do it I think.

1. I use xvid4psp 6 daily build from www.winnydows.com
2. Set it to MP4, set resolution to 854x480 maximum, AVC level to 3.1 (can save this as a new profile)
3. Set video to H264, then baseline profile in its settings.
4. I prefer constant bitrate. I use 2000 for high quality source. 1500 for lower quality source. (then can save this as a new video profile)
5. AAC-LC for audio. 192kbps stereo. (I like my audio fairly high quality or at least not too lossy)
- I don't really touch anything else. But you can experiment to your hearts content if you like to.

My encoded videos look perfect and plays butter smooth with default video player or OVP. =)

Edit: Updated with more info...

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

Thanks V much, I'll give this a bash when I get home this evening. Apologies if you had mentioned this before in the thread, I got pages deep and it just appeared to be a technobabble bun fight!!

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

There are ways to improve decoding/encoding capabilities on TI OMAP 3. You might want to read this: http://www.ittiam.com/en/Embedded/IP...0P-Bundle.aspx

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

Ah, that would be because it is a technobabble bun fight! :) Everyone has their own favorite converter (mine's handbrake) and their own favorite settings. Pretty much, though, if you can get your video into the H.264 codec with a "baseline" profile and keep from going wild on the bitrate, any of the converters should work fine for you.

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

This worked like a charm :D thanks again.

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

GUYS GUYS you're missing the point, i'm pissed off cuz i can't easily watch any video without convert encoding, i hate that for two reasons:
A-it's annoying to re-encode each video.
B-it take too long to re-encode a video.

they should make PR1.2 at least plays 720p

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

I understand your pain, but I still gotta disagree. Here are my arguments:

A - You can easily watch any video that actually fits within the screen size of your n9.
B - Those phones which do play HD video have to resize the video in real time. No matter how much video hardware they have, this places a demand on power, memory, and computing ability that simply doesn't exist for a properly re-encoded video.
C - This also means that those phones actually are doing the equivalent of re-encoding the video, only without giving you any say in the quality of the result.

Back when I first started reencoding my videos, I thought it a hassle as well. Once I got a system going, though, it's really easy as pie...

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

There are ways to improve decoding capabilities of TI OMAP3630 in software for H.264 720p up to MP/HP. Check this out: http://www.ittiam.com/en/Embedded/IP-Portfolio/Video-Components/OMAP3-720P-Bundle.aspx

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

Another shocker for me....

The 720p videos taken using my N8 camera cannot be played back smoothly on my N9.

Seriously?

With all this limitations, the N9 is feeling...like a f%(*&*@& iphone!!! ARGGHHH!!

Disappointment with Nokia is an understatement.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

How is that possible? The N8 videos have such a high bitrate?

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

Read through the *entire* thread, it's worthwhile for a bit more perspective.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

For the "tl;dr" crowd, I'll just give a summary of the problem, rather than force them to read the whole thread. :)

No, the N9 does not play HD resolution video very well, if at all. Those phones which do play HD resolution video are using specialized hardware specifically designed to deal with HD data.

However, please note that the N8 has a screen resolution of 640 x 360 pixels. You may be able to play HD resolution videos on the thing, but you sure as heck ain't going to be seeing the higher resolution.

Almost no phone exists that has a native HD resolution screen. (I have been informed that the HTC Rezound has a full 720p screen, so there are some phones that do...) Most phones that can display HD video are simply "throwing away" the extra bits of resolution in order to fit the video onto the screen.

You can, of course, reduce the resolution of a video yourself, using a wide variety of tools. (And these tools will almost always produce a higher quality result than a phone trying to do the same thing in real time.) Many of the posts above in this thread describe how to do this.

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

Update: the OMAP3630 use the PowerVR SGX530 GPU, not the Mali400 GPU. Sorry for the mistake.

You only need to decode at the resolution of the file. The picture resize at the decoding output is usually assisted by the hardware. On the OMAP3 SoC, you can use the PowerVR SGX530, the DSP, or the picture processing subsystem to do picture resize. The PowerVR SGX530 should be the best choice. You can see how smooth the transitions are on the N9 by using it. A number of transitions includes a resize if the application image buffer in real time. You can use the same for the video output picture buffer.

So the only real limitation is how fast is the decoder to fill the video output picture buffer depending on the resolution of the file.

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

I'm no expert, but I'm fairly certain that the entire decoding process is in fact hardware-assisted. The CPUs in these phones just can't manage the decode fast enough to supply the video data in real time, even for fairly low resolution video, unless perhaps the bitrate is miserably low. (The VLC guys completely gave up trying to port their software-based decoder onto the N900, and I think it was pretty much for that reason.)

I don't know much of anything about the N9's innards. But, unless the "Mali400" is already a part of the N9's video decoding subsystem, you're not going to be able to use it for videos. The silicon tasked with that job can't be changed.

But yeah, I was kinda glossing over the actual process these phones run by saying that it was the "equivalent of re-encoding" the video. :)

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

Not sure where he's getting MALI400 from, 3630 most certainly doesn't use that.
There's some decent insights (not full) into the hw (& it's limitations) just a few pages back peeps.

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

Oops, I made a mistake, the OMAP 3630 (N9 processor) integrate the PowerVR SGX530 GPU, not the Mali400. Sorry for the mistake. Indeed, this is just an other GPU well capable to do picture resize in real time.

Decoding and resizing are different parts of the process of displaying a movie file. Don't mix the two.

Decoding can be done by the CPU or by the DSP. The DSP is probably the best choice, but the community (or company) willing to code it is very limited compared to the CPU community.

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

Yes, you are right. The OMAP3630 integrate the PowerVR SGX530 GPU, not the Mali400 GPU

And I am pretty certain that the GPU is heavy used on the N9.

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

n8 records at 720p AVC baseline profile, 15 mbps!, thats thanks to a dedicated brodcom(as i recall) hw accellarator, no neither my n900 could play it smoothly due to the avc high bit rate, though it now has 720p support.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

Tks for the reply. I did go through the whole thread though my lack of technical knowhow on mobile processors and GPU etc may not allow me to appreciate everything here. I do understand that I am not looking at 720p but a smaller resolution when I watch videos on a screen of a phone. However, I also do know that the actual quality of the video is better than the one I'm seeing on the phone's screen and thus I am satisfied.

But here's my take (and I assume other 'common users') on the issue....

The N8 is a phone released in Oct 2010. It has a 680 Mhz CPU. It runs on the 'legacy' Symbian OS. As of right now, the telcos in my country has stopped selling it.

1 year later, the N9 is released. It has a 1 Ghz CPU (similiar or even faster than iPhone 4 as I recall). It carries the tagline 'fluidity'. I think as a consumer, it would not be unreasonable to assume that the N9 have the same if not better media capabilities than the N8. For example, the N9's photo gallery is definitely much faster than the N8.

Sure, we can re-encode ('recode'?) the videos to ensure smooth playback on the N9. But aren't we losing details and getting a more compressed video? In other words, we COMPROMISE. Maybe readers may wonder why am I so hardup over the videos, I can just store them on my pc and watch them there. Yes, true, but for me when I transit between phones, I bring over ALL my photos and videos (my N8 has all the photos and videos from my N95). It is a very interesting 'blog', as it captures all my happy and most treasured memories, on a device that I bring along everywhere I go and it will continue to capture the memories in years to come.

Will update on what's the bitrate/resolution of the '720p' video taken by the N9 camera and how much difference is that compared to the N8.

I really do hope this is just a software optimisation issue and not really a hardware limitation.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

I haven't ready and of the thread except a couple posts, but:
You compromise just as much if not more anyway, because almost no phone actually has 720p, let alone 1080p, resolution. The quality is lost when viewed on the device either way. Re-encoding lets you consciously choose how much of the quality you are able to retain, up to the maximum possible for the screen it's being played on, while a device that plays 1080p video on a 480p screen, for example, will probably gut the quality of the video as it's displayed on-device more so than manually re-encoding would.

Not that I personally disagree with allowing such a feature anyway, and as far as I'm concerned there's no reason not to have such a feature.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

N9 has a much weaker GPU than last year's iPhone4 or SGS1. Basically, N900 and N9 has nearly the same SoC except the CPU frequency and power efficiency. (which can also be equalled by overclocking the N900 to 1GHz or faster) This was done to speed up the production of the N9 as Maemo/Harmattan was built on OMAP3.

It's a hardware limitation and not something software can improve. N9 won't be able to decode high profile 720p x264 videos due to its weak DSP while N8 can do some of it. N8 is actually more capable than the N9 in terms of media consumption. (better DSP, FM TX, HDMI out, stronger bluetooth signal, louder speaker, better music player etc) So yeah, N9 doesn't deserve the N8 successor "N" series badget IMO. It should have been called the M9 or something. =P

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

Why would one stick to the phone display and built in display resolution? It is not like the N8 appears to play said HD video's better because of its lower native resolution.

Both phones N8 and N9 have TV out.

My N9 can't play a random DivX smoothly enough on a low res non HD TV (where the TV out on the N9 is aimed at).

The N8 plays those smoothly and even HD is within reach.


Yes. Exactly that hardware decoding thing shines on the N8.
We were watching a random DivX on a HD Plasma connected Macbook so called Pro, 2.8Ghz with Latest VLC software version.
Stutter and frame skips.

Instead of wasting time tweaking VLC on OSX, while in fact just wanting to watch an old technology video smoothly and now, I took a random N8 laying on the table, copied the random DivX to the N8, connected it to the HDMI and it not only saved the day but we learned the colour rendition and rendering was richer and sharper on our plasma.
Hardware decoding.

Conclusion: the N8 delivers out of the box.

And I can't pull the same trick with my N9. Tried it.

Both phones may be able to play the same HD originated video material on their low res built in display with satisfactory results after tweaking.
But seriously, re-encoding,converting: are you guys having year 200X nostalgia? :)

The N9 screen is inviting for watching movies on it. And the video's look beautiful on it.
Too bad the black spots are in the way during dark scenes and you can't ask it to play more than a random low res video.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

AFAIK, SGX530 and 535 are equally powerful. The only difference is the DirectX 9.0c support on the 535. Geometry performance is the same.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

In what world is 854x480 considered low res on mobile phones? The current standard is 800x480 and N9 is higher than that. Get a clue. 720p on a phone is a serious battery eater. If you wanna watch HD movies on a phone, you better have a secondary phone that actually serves as a "phone" and will be capable of answering calls.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

This is, in fact, exactly what the hardware on other phones is doing: no matter how powerful their video hardware is, they've still gotta crunch the resolution down into the native screen size of the phone, and normally will end up dropping some details anyway because there's just too much data in a HD video for even high-end silicon to deal with in real time. You have to compromise (in many ways) to watch video on such tiny devices.

The advantage in re-encoding videos to match the native screen size of your phone is that you can actually increase the quality of the reduced-sized picture (as the software is not forced to do its resizing work in real-time), and because there are literally less bits being stored, you can support a higher bitrate (i.e., less compression) than you could with an HD resolution video.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

Perhaps because you want to watch the video on the phone itself? :) The N8's HDMI output is really nice, but honestly, I rarely find myself wanting to play a video from my phone onto a TV. Most of the time, I just want to play the thing directly on my phone so that I can watch it wherever I happen to be.

VLC is a software based video decoder. Uses no dedicated hardware. For the Mac, your best bets for decoding video are:

(a) MplayerX: most up-to-date video player at the moment, supports Hi10P video and uses the Mac's hardware decoders.

(b) Mplayer2: still just a beta release right now, but does support chaptered MKV video files and also uses hardware decoding.

(c) Quicktime: doesn't support many video codecs or containers (although plugins exist to remedy this somewhat), but still does the best job of displaying what video formats it supports. And yes, uses hardware decoding.

(d) VLC: The last resort. A ways behind the times compared to other players (although a major update is supposedly in the works), the software-based decoding system means that it places a much larger load on your CPU, but it also means that the thing is infinitely tweakable. Video that is corrupted or just won't run any other way can often be made to work in VLC if you play with the settings just right...

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

Yes, I do understand this point. And it seems I have no other choice...

My assumption before getting N9: simply copy and paste all my videos/phots, sync my contact/note/calenders (from N8) and I'm good to go!

Reality after getting N9: er...I can only sync contacts and notes. And now I have to re-encode few gb of videos so that it can play on my new phone.

Actually I'm okay if the N9 is able to lower (hardware? software?) the quality/resolution/bitrate/whatever such that video playback will be smooth but albeit not at the native 854x480 resolution or at an acceptable quality. Maybe later an app/video player is able to do that.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

ust get an iphone. It works

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

Unfortunately, such an app/video player is unlikely to appear. The truth is, the N8 just has more powerful video encoding/decoding hardware than the N9 does.

I do believe that the N9 is a great phone, but it is not anywhere near top-of-the-line as a media server. If this is what you need, you can find home-theater-quality "phones" from companies like Apple, Motorola, Samsung, HTC, and LG; Nokia just isn't competing in this arena right now...

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

As much as I want to rebutt you, I have to agree iPhone does work well cos idiots like me don't have to worry or learn how to use it.

But no thanks.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

I've got an iPhone4 and it doesn't work any better than the N9.
Paired that with a smaller screen and it sure isn't any better either.
Hence why I just ordered a Galaxy Note. Nothing comes close.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

This is tha shiznit.

I would like to put a blackboard in front of every Nokia employee and force them to write this 1000 times. Apple understands this simple point and ensures that iPhone 4 > iPhone 3GS > iPhone 3G, whereas Nokia prefer to pigeonhole their customers as 'business guy', 'camera guy', or 'music guy', and gimp each device depending on which particular customer they are targeting. KISS.

Re: Video playback epic fail: My N8 plays 1080p My N9 couldn't even play 720p
 

N8 also has better camera.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

So, I really wonder what Nokia thinks 'Business guy' does when he is not working. Or how 'video guy' or 'camera guy' can afford to buy a premium-price phone without having a job that requires him to read email.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

:confused:
The talk you comment on was about random low res video's performance.
Low res as opposed to HD in the thread's title.

Not about the N9's screen being low resolution. It is not.

It has a too low PPI count to please some eyes, but that is a different story and surely not relevant in video's.

The resolution of the N9's display is fine for video's displayed on that surface size.

If only the hardware could keep up in playing anything non-HD you throw at that would be great.

And if it would be capable of real time down-sampling 720 and 1080p content that would be even greater.

But that is not the case.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

Just get a brain. It thinks!

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

My N900 plays anything non-HD that I've thrown at it. How's the N9 any different? Doesn't it have the same codecs as the N900? Btw, ppi on the N9 is much higher compared to the well praised SA+ on the GS2. It's really sharp, not N900 sharp, but it's close.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

I've had trouble with some FLV files (resolution lower than native display resolution) on both the N900 and the N950. I was genuinely surprised to find that the N9(50) would not play these. I expected an improvement over the capabilities of the N900. Epic fail.

Re: My N9 CANNOT smoothly playback the videos taken using my N8 camera
 

Yeah, Flash is a pain, and is only going to get worse, since Adobe itself seems to be pulling away from the mobile market. (And, of course, the iPhone famously doesn't support Flash either.)

Again, the solution here seems to be converting Flash Video to something compatible before loading it on the phone. Hey, if millions of Apple customers do it, it can't be that bad, right? :)