Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Sorry that's partly my fault... Yikes, there's quite a few more viewers here than the other thread now.
The purpose of this thread's explained here, & in subsequent posts...
We can still have lots of posts, but they should be centred around what's in the docs, what's not, & how they're structured/formatted.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Which wiki is that?

Got it (https://sailfishos.org/wiki/QA)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

this is running on a N950, isn't it? :D

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

You know the eyes in the video? I reckon it's the motion sensor ;)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Youtube version of the UI demo (silverlight-free):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHn3qp_E3_A

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

For me it's still a little too early to get terribly excited, I want to hear more about the overall strategy, they glossed over it quite bit, made me nervous.
Plus I want to see their Sailfish device(s) with the native UX/apps running, hear about their services/cloud integration plans etc, & the compatibility layers (if any) for BBX/Android/iOS.
Just realised 15:00GMT's 1am here, too buy lately, might go to bed soon & wake-up about 4hrs after the presentation's finished, man it blows being at the ***-end of the world >.>

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

"Jolla's Senior Designer Jaakko Roppola gave http://bit.ly/KickNetwork a personal hands-on first look on the user interface of their Sailfish OS. The video was shot November 21st at Slush 2012 in Helsinki."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=_c_BqnR_vAM

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

One thing wasn't clear to me at all. Is Sailfish a generic layer of OS+UI built for more vendors to share and extend? Kind of Mer idea, but on a higher level. And is it fully open? If so, then Jolla's OS will be an extension of Sailifish, not Sailfish itself. And the extended part will contain the closed UI.

Or Sailfish is referring to the Jolla's only release, with that very closed UI? I didn't really understand it from the presentation, and it's not clear from the QA on their wiki.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

My understanding is:

Sailfish OS is built on top of Mer core (with HW adaptation etc). The Jolla devices will have a closed UX on top of Sailfish. Other vendors may use alternative UXs with Sailfish.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

They better explain it on their wiki, since it's not an obvious deduction. Also, if it's fully open, where is the source?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

According to Stskeeps, Sailfish is intended to be a shared base for vendors, but the status of the UI licensing is still under discussion and not finalized. So it's not yet decided whether it'll be open or not.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I noticed that they do not have standardize icon pack across platform. I wonder if its too late to put this sense to them, since the icon shown looks so android-ish.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Deja vu all over again, and again. Just saying.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

What about all the wild claims that there's going to be a full-blown, built-in, ACL, there's been zero solid evidence for that, aside from a Myriad logo on one of the slides.
I haven't watched the SDK reveal/presentation yet (has it even started?), that may have since revealed more...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

The SDK presentation will be held at 10AM (Finnish time) which is just one hour away.

On Sailfish wiki QA it is stated that

"What do the Android app developers need to do get their apps run on Jolla devices / devices based on the Sailfish OS?

Many Android(TM) applications will run on Jolla devices unchanged (Android is a trademark of Google Inc.). If you want to take advantage of all UI and other features of Sailfish OS and make yourapplications fast, you can port your applications to native QT/QML. There are extensive guides available on how to do that. "

https://sailfishos.org/wiki/QA

So no mention of Myriad there.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Can this be related to that Google owns the rights to android? Mybee they are not allowed to use for commercial purposes like promoting an competitive OS.

EDIT:There was also android logo in one of the movies from yesterday... If you noticed :)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

That's what has been communicated previously, other Vendors/OEM's (inc. Jolla) can have their closed bits on top of Sailfish...
But Sailfish as the Base_OS remains open (as is possible) at the lower levels (ALA MeR), & open too at the UX layers (ALA MeR).

Hmmm, not sure me likey....

So how would their licensing model work effectively with a completely open (uppermost & lowest layers) UX?
Unlike the giants of the industry, they don't have a huge stable of proprietary & licensed technologies.
Their entire UX/native_apps is one of their few "trump cards"...
Also, I doubt very much their 1st device(s) is going to use the most cutting edge SoC/Hw.
If they have moderate success with the 1st one(s), then they might be able to cut a better deal.*
Which is why they've been strongly hinting at excellent performance on cheap "$100 hardware".
They ofc still have libhyris up their sleeve, but they don't seem to be relying on it strongly just yet.
Besides as shmerl highlighted, it sounds like they haven't yet settled on completely closed, partially closed, or completely open.

*having more & more vendors/oems on-board would rapidly change this equation in their favour too

Yeah seen that, hopefully the presentation reveals much more about it all, wont be happy chappy if it doesn't.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

From Jolla's Twitter:

"Our friend there is Myriad."

https://twitter.com/JollaMobile/stat...24818908008449

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Oh goody, yet another hint, I responded to them there
https://twitter.com/JollaMobile/stat...24818908008449

(I responded to your last post, see my updated post above yours)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Sooo... Anyone been able to watch the presentation? Findings? O_o
Also, any ideas/thoughts relating specifically to the content/formatting of the two Google docs?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

In the Jolla UI video, I think the eyes at the start and end is the motion sensor (I've said a couple of times).

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Riiiight... the silence lately has been rather perplexing, not sure what to make of it.

Lot of chatter on Twitter that I'm only just catching up on now.
(side-note: I hate browsing Twitter, so damn tedious)
The presentation's here, go right back to the beginning, don't watch what's on now:
http://slush.fi/stream/?view=event-stage#a
I'm not sure it that's all of it though, seems there was another bit before it.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Personally seeing the amount of threads on TMO for the same thing have made me want to stay away from it all...I reported every thread to the mods to merge with the large jolla thread but no action from them hence you see a jolla/sailfish thread in applications, general, nokia n9/50 section...

The noise is too much; the same thing is usually amplified many times and idiots galore...Basically Jolla showed they will be using swipe, showed their phone app, people app, gallery app, music app, lockscreen and today the SDK yet for so little the hysteria is on another planet...[Edit]They also in the beginning linked their wiki which more than sufficiently answers I think all the questions those spin-off threads have yet the lack of level-headedness is amazing[/Edit]

I mean how many different ways can you dissect what they showed? Oh and they demoed it on a n950 and explicitly said that a competent hacker would be able to port their OS to the n9; how many times do people need to ask the same thing with such an obvious statement...Honestly, the hysteria is something like of a iDon't product and that's disappointing...

I had some questions to post into the doc but then with the commotion around here just lost the will to compose them down...

Will give it another go later and add them to the google doc if successful in composing them...

I wouldn't be surprised others finding themselves in the same situation maybe that's why the silence...


Edit: I'm sorry if I've let out some steam; I just find a growing number of people being post first think later kind of variety these days...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Can totally relate/understand, was just hoping this would be the thread for less crap & more substance.
I guess folks need more time to digest things though, maybe I'm being way too impatient... ;)
There's been lots of new stuff added to the docs in the past 48hr, & a fair bit of reorganizing, so maybe folks just dont feel the need to discus further here.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Wtf: Bug! two posts above!

The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to thedead1440 For This Useful Post:
Dave999

EDIT: thedead1440 thank himself :) for real this time :D

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Oh goodness me; I'm classified as "self-thanker" just like you Dave :eek: :p

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Bergie has now published his article from the Slush event:
http://bergie.iki.fi/blog/jolla-sailfish/

There is also a (short) interview with a couple of Jolla guys in the midle of the article.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I'm still watching the SDK presentation. After that I'll mark the answered questions again (if there are any).

However I thought a bit more about the list. Looks like Jolla aren't ready to answer detailed questions about hardware. I suspect if we send the list as is - all questions about SoC, GPU and keyboard and etc. will be just dismissed. Any thoughts on this?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I just had the craziest though. The UI at it's state doesn't have landscape, so we won't have landscape keyboard! Horizontal.... Erghhh.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Not much from the list was really answered in the SDK presentation. Let's decide what to do with it now.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

But it was clearly highlighted,that everything is open source, so that everyone can build to fit his needs... wasn't it?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

nope the ui is still under discussion internally whether to make it open source or not...

Sailfish OS may be open source but the product that ends up on Jolla phones will have closed bits...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Hm ok, this is what is discussed in this forum atm, but did you watch the SDK presentation this morning? This british guy emphasized that as good as everything is open source...

OS = DO
CS = REDO

/* or something like that */ :)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

It's under discussion according to Stskeeps. We'll have to wait until they'll announce how exactly UI will be licensed.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

yes i watched all the presentations as well as was on #jollamobile for the last 2 days. what i posted is what i gathered from the presentations and irc.

i really want them to do well but i have a few questions which i will add later today to the doc which fill me with doubt on their proclaimations...

even the jolla binaries for qt creator have not been decided to be open source or not; they say mer and nemo are but for jolla binaries they are having internal discussions...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I have a question. Weren't they making another OS during the summer or something? Like one OS for the enthusiasts and another for like everyone else (AKA Sailfish). Anyone can recall? Or maybe I might be wrong.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

That other OS would be Nemo, both are based on Mer.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Nemo isn't theirs though, I thought it was another OS made by them (maybe based on nemo).

PS: I'm just wondering because Sailfish didn't give me the hype. I just hope the other OS will be like hildon.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I can't remember anything about 2 OS from Jolla... maybe you mix this up with Nokia:
- Meego / Maemo / Harmattan for High-End
- Meltemi for Low-End

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I am sure I didn't mix it up with Nokia but I might be wrong. I just wanted to know and thoughts from TMO.