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maemo.org - Talk (https://talk.maemo.org/index.php)
-   SailfishOS (https://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=52)
-   -   Good bye Sailfish (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=96258)

itdoesntmatt 2016-01-10 18:12
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nieldk (Post 1494355)
He still need a PC. So any offer besides my N9 is still in question.
This is not a competition. This is to keep the best devs working. Nothing more, nothing less. Its my way of appreciation on how many of you helped me.
i was joking, dude :P

pagis 2016-01-10 18:21
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
ok do we have a plan then?

peterleinchen 2016-01-10 18:24
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
@nieldk
Great offer.
But I have no idea whether cepiperez is interested. I would like him to be a bit more verbose. And ofc he needs to accept!

Technically your offer is quite difficult to reach cepiperez. The last time a N9 was sent to Argentina it got lost in customs as import taxes are absurd high. So only chance would be to get it to.Argentina personally (any person,.there are some offers already) and have havet sent within Argentina.

mosen 2016-01-10 19:21
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
regarding a new "pc" i would like to remind that it may come cheaper to buy a 5 year old i5 2,4ghz 4Gb Thinkpad (x201) than to trace individual components.

I had one of those as christmas present to my business partner for only 169€

He may even have an advantage to be able to use his old display as a secondary!

mosen 2016-01-11 20:07
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
This thread gets colder than it should!
Quote:
Originally Posted by rigow (Post 1492770)
Current free import is $ 300 only.
EDIT: Answered by Kinggo further down, shipment makes no sense. And @noobismall was lucky with selling his Jolla as it seems. Plan b in further post.
Quote:
What speeks against sending two insured shipments then?
I never have problems sending stuff to La Paz / Bolivia twice a year where my wifes sister is living via UPS, DHL and FedEx.
Ok, its only books and records but in my experience insured parcel makes a huge difference.

We would have one Laptop 170-250€ shipment and a phone shipment with n9 and Jolla worth 190€.

@noobismall already answered and his jolla is still available for 100€ plus shipping. He would be ok with more than one buyer and pay processes to his paypal account at a given time and than send the phone to our "middleman".

Buying noobismalls jolla only makes sense if we start planning towards a deadline of either shipment or middleman delivery.

If a plan is fixed i would even put the whole 100e plus shipment forward to save the phone from other buyers and wait for some other donations to push the rest 60€ back to me. no problem with faith on my side.
Could you guys with personal contacts traveling to Argentina try to find out rough dates. I think we need some sort of binding dates to tighten up commitments and make this happen!

meow 2016-01-12 11:41
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mosen (Post 1494481)
This thread gets colder than it should!

What speeks against sending two insured shipments then?
I never have problems sending stuff to La Paz / Bolivia twice a year where my wifes sister is living via UPS, DHL and FedEx.
Ok, its only books and records but in my experience insured parcel makes a huge difference.

We would have one Laptop 170-250€ shipment and a phone shipment with n9 and Jolla worth 190€.

@noobismall already answered and his jolla is still available for 100€ plus shipping. He would be ok with more than one buyer and pay processes to his paypal account at a given time and than send the phone to our "middleman".

Buying noobismalls jolla only makes sense if we start planning towards a deadline of either shipment or middleman delivery.

If a plan is fixed i would even put the whole 100e plus shipment forward to save the phone from other buyers and wait for some other donations to push the rest 60€ back to me. no problem with faith on my side.

Could you guys with personal contacts traveling to Argentina try to find out rough dates. I think we need some sort of binding dates to tighten up commitments and make this happen!
An excellent initiative! I suggest we move with this plan, as soon as Cepi confirms it is acceptable.

A request - I don't have paypal, etc., so would appreciate it if I could send my contribution to someone in the EU via direct bank transfer and they forward it ot Cepi. Of course, I could also use Western Union and send it directly to Argentina, but that would be a pity for the fees.

kinggo 2016-01-12 11:55
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
trust me, you don't want to send anything in Argentina unless you are 200% sure that it will reach its destination. And with them, you never are. :(
The girl that now lives in UK is married for my friend (he is Spaniard), but while she was still living there we were sending her some documents that she needed to get married in the first place. With those documents we also sent some socks or something like that (worthless crap, not much than 30€ in value) with DHL and things got so complicated that she was never able to pick that up and at the end she had to get the documents in Spain where they got married and we get the package back some 8 months later.
And that is the short version of the story. And that is why you don't want to send anything there.

mosen 2016-01-12 12:02
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by meow (Post 1494555)
I could also use Western Union and send it directly to Argentina, but that would be a pity for the fees.
I think its better to collect "intentions" first, then find ways for non paypalers and then everybody transfer money on a fixed date alltogether, either to middleman or to the ones organizing and sending the hardware to the travellers/middleman.

@noobismalls jolla seems to be sold, but no problem, we will find another one for ~100€, else i sell one of my 3 jollas in wage off possible intex devices coming ;)

I guess from cepi giving thanks to all the latest post it can be interpretet safely as approval?.
As he has voiced, he is shy about asking again.
And thats totally ok with me. I know times where you have to even sell beloved hardware just to get some food. I can imagine its hard to not get wicked over losing it for nothing under much harder living conditions than we are blessed with :/

But as @peterleinchen voiced, a "ok" from cepis side would be awesome as confirmation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kinggo (Post 1494556)
trust me, you don't want to send anything in Argentina unless you are 200% sure that it will reach its destination. And with them, you never are. :(
Maybe cepi could even tell if he could commute/travel to meet with our middleman in person to even avoid shipment within argentina? How much would it cost you to get a train ticket to get to BsAs/Cordoba?
We could donate the money to you directly so you can pick up the stuff in person!

kinggo 2016-01-12 12:35
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
In case that a friends wife will be the "one" then someone from UK should handle everything since she lives in Bristol.
In that case, we should see if it is easier/better/more secure that she somehow handles delivery from Cordoba to BsAs or if Cepi has someone in Cordoba or a way to get it.

HtheB 2016-01-12 12:35
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Fundraising campain for CepiPerez:
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1494558

velox 2016-01-12 13:39
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
As soon as my PayPal is up and running again, I'll chip in a few euros as well, because I'd really like the thread title to change to something like "Hello again, Sailfish" rather sooner than later.
Also, CepiPerez is such a nice and helpful guy.

ste-phan 2016-01-12 15:03
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Computers that can be used for this kind of programming have been around since USB 2.0 , or about a good decade and a half.

Unless there is a particular reason why they are rarely found on the Argentinian secundo mano market they should be had locally more efficient and for much cheaper than can be sent in from abroad.

2nd, if CepiPerez lacks the means to replace his computer then he needs more urgently to build up some resilience.
Suppose he trying hard to do that, the last thing on his need list would be a new computer that makes him feel indebted and pressured to develop for Sailfish.
Unless Jolla and Intex would be paying him a a stable half time salary for example that PC does not look like a good idea unless it would offer that primary income.

You need reliable housing, food, electricity paid, etc..eventually a primary job that pays for all that Sailfish hobby time.

I'm betting that if and when all that is in order and Sailfish is still around he will hello again Sailfish.

Offering help with sourcing exotic hardware such as Sailfish OS phone is another thing of course.

nieldk 2016-01-12 15:39
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Iam sure getting food and housing is #1.
But that shouldnt keep us from helping.
Btw. Dont forget to continue donations for his work. That, will help him getting stable situation.

endsormeans 2016-01-12 16:03
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
It will be a bit before I can throw funds at cepi or anyone new unfortunately..
I'm already donating to a number of people and considering my own current precarious sitch I just don't have the the fiscal fluidity to give more.

The very moment I can...
I'll be setting up recurring monthly to help...

itdoesntmatt 2016-01-12 16:10
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
ste-phan sorry but i am missing the point.
This is not a way to bind cepi to a heavy chain and pretend he spend 24/7 of his time being slave of a donation received.
Is just a way to thank him and possibly make time for his coming back shorter that it would be without it.
I want to state that NO ONE could neither now nor in future, accuse cepi to not being working enough hard for our desire being satified.
On the other hand i trust him, lets see what he did in past, and i know he is linked at the community like everyone else here with good will, so i don't think he will run far away from us.

mosen 2016-01-12 16:49
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by itdoesntmatt (Post 1494588)
ste-phan sorry but i am missing the point.
I don't think thats what ste-phan wanted to say ;)
Giving money instead of hardware is making sure he can decide how to use it. He knows best by himself. i second that and am sorry for not having realized this when blabbling about buying hardware and sending it in my earlier posts.

itdoesntmatt 2016-01-12 16:53
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mosen (Post 1494596)
I don't think thats what ste-phan wanted to say ;)
Giving money instead of hardware is making sure he can decide how to use it. He knows best by himself. i second that and am sorry for not having realized this when blabbling about buying hardware and sending it in my earlier posts.
ok, i was misunderstanding..
So at this point, i agree with you and ste-phan

marxian 2016-01-12 17:07
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mosen (Post 1494596)
I don't think thats what ste-phan wanted to say ;)
Giving money instead of hardware is making sure he can decide how to use it. He knows best by himself. i second that and am sorry for not having realized this when blabbling about buying hardware and sending it in my earlier posts.
My interpretation of the post is that ste-phan is suggesting that donations (at least those that imply a commitment in return) are potentially a poverty trap. I happen to agree with that.

When it comes to money, you have two kinds of people: those who have enough of it, and those who don't. If you don't have enough money, the best way to get more is to increase your stable income. Donations likely mean you will be working for peanuts when you can't afford to do that. If you do have enough money, then the chances are that the donations are a form of economic rent, because you will likely already be doing whatever the donations are paying for.

mosen 2016-01-12 17:49
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by marxian (Post 1494602)
My interpretation of the post is that ste-phan is suggesting that donations (at least those that imply a commitment in return) are potentially a poverty trap.
Ok, granted.
But wouldn't that apply only if he had asked for donations?
Also i have the impression we are helping him with his productive hobby and not keep him from finding proper work.

Or did i misunderstand your argument?

marxian 2016-01-12 18:13
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mosen (Post 1494609)
Ok, granted.
But wouldn't that apply only if he had asked for donations?
Also i have the impression we are helping him with his productive hobby and not keep him from finding proper work.

Or did i misunderstand your argument?
Most people who receive donations will feel some pressure to provide something in return. After all, you are not donating the money for no reason. You are donating because you value their work, which implies that you want/expect them to continue that work.

There's a reason you won't find donation links in my signature or on my website/github. ;)

stefanmohl 2016-01-12 18:32
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ste-phan (Post 1494579)
2nd, if CepiPerez lacks the means to replace his computer then he needs more urgently to build up some resilience.
Suppose he trying hard to do that, the last thing on his need list would be a new computer that makes him feel indebted and pressured to develop for Sailfish.
I am not sure about the financials in Argentina, but it might very well be that housing, food and basics are a tenth or less of what it is in EU/US, whereas imported tech like the Jolla or a PC costs the same as it costs in the EU/US. So even today, it is not uncommon for people to be completely safe and stable with the basics but far, far away from affording a smartphone or a PC. Let Cepi tell us what he wants, that is the only way of knowing what _his_ situation is!

mosen 2016-01-12 18:34
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by marxian (Post 1494614)
There's a reason you won't find donation links in my signature or on my website/github. ;)
Ahhh, know i got it.
I do not think like this.
If i "give away" money, it is to pay/honor things that have already been done.
No further obligations attached.
Else i make contracts or hire and obviously take responsebility in development process of a person or a project.
The world could be so easy... :rolleyes:
Thx for the hint @marxian

Edit. Waaait a minute. Is this why Flattr and Patrone are not working? Creators don't use it because they feel pressured by the ones that actually only want to say thank you??

chilango 2016-01-12 19:37
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Dont now if its solved the transport. In 4 weeks a friend of my came from asia to Mexico (here) to travel day later to cordoba Argentina.
The problem will be. How the Jolla came to mexico.
I am looking for guys that travel next weeks from germany to mexico

NobodyInPerson 2016-01-12 22:44
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Donated as well! Good luck, cepi!

snowman74 2016-01-12 23:35
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Guys,
I apparently live nearby I have sent a PM to CEPI offering my Jolla since I will try to get a nexus 5 and run SFOS on it. I cannot afford to donate the phone but I have offered to sell it at cost so it is not as hard to replace it will keep you folks posted.

HtheB 2016-01-13 00:00
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by snowman74 (Post 1494670)
Guys,
I apparently live nearby I have sent a PM to CEPI offering my Jolla since I will try to get a nexus 5 and run SFOS on it. I cannot afford to donate the phone but I have offered to sell it at cost so it is not as hard to replace it will keep you folks posted.
Awesome!
That would be very nice :D

mosen 2016-01-13 00:41
Re: Good bye Sailfish
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by snowman74 (Post 1494670)
Guys,
I apparently live nearby I have sent a PM to CEPI offering my Jolla since I will try to get a nexus 5 and run SFOS on it. I cannot afford to donate the phone but I have offered to sell it at cost so it is not as hard to replace it will keep you folks posted.
da intanet strikes yet again :D
That is so cool to hear. No import tax waste, no long wait.
Please send a photo if you should meet!


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