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Re: What's the best Handheld gnu/linux machine for 2017?
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Re: What's the best Handheld gnu/linux machine for 2017?
I do not want to go down the slippery slope of discussing guns. This is not the forum for that. The only reason I mentioned that was the striking similarity of the arguments. It could have been any number of other controversial topics, it just happened to be guns because it was so recent.
There is a great parallel between the two cases. With great freedom comes great responsibility. And in both cases it is the second part that is in short supply. |
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Who defines the "Common Good", is it you or me? Whose vision is the one that gets the love of all, yours or mine? The world does not work that way! We're in this each for our own reasons and not to be ordered around by bozos. Any one is free to do what she feels she loves best; hence there usually is a lot of buzz around projects that have the "something" which pulls people into participating. If there are separate projets aiming for same-ish goals but competing for attention and resources, well’ that's the world for you, dude. Just learn to live with it as there is bloody absolutely nuthin' you can do about it. Bitching about fragmentation is not a creative answer for anything. |
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I maintain that that cause is the small user base. With not enough potential users, no sane manufacturer will consider making it. By 'it' I mean not only the final product but also the components, down to the chips. It is tempting to come up with conspiacy theories to explain the lack of Linux drivers for modems, video cards etc, but the simple truth is that it is all down to nothing more than economy. Why should e.g. Qualcom bother with Linux drivers for maybe as many as 10k users, instead of focusing on the 500M using Windows? The only way to make the Qualcoms of this world produce Linux-compatible hardware is by turning Linux into a major buying force. Which means making Linux attractive to the likes of my sister. Forcing her to type pkcon and check the systemd logs three times a day is not the way to make that happen. Neither is confusing her with the multitude of forks of forks. |
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There are many reasons why someone may fork a project. Sometimes it's absolutely necessary. It's part and parcel of open source software development. There are countless cases where forks have superseded their original project and other cases where they have provided a credible alternative: LibreOffice, OpenBSD, LibreELEC, MariaDB, CyanogenMod, Replicant, WebKit, Jenkins, Devuan, LibreSSL... Some call it fragmentation, others call it progress. I hope you're not still using OpenOffice, MySQL, XFree86, etc. We're all here on this forum because we're interested in an alternative to the world of iOS and Android. That in itself is fragmentation. Those who don't don't like fragmentation tend to stick with iOS or Android. EDIT: Just to be clear, my above rant relates to nthn's comment, in particular, the 99% part. I don't agree with Jolla's decision to create a new app ecosystem by introducing the proprietary Silica Components meaning apps for Sailfish will not run anywhere else. That is a great example of bad fragmentation and is definitely not progress. |
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Fragmentation is a problem when it turns into noise. And that's what is exactly going on in the hardware portion of our wants/needs now. To support these fragmented wants/needs, the hardware has become fragmented as well, which dilutes the support. Being on the same page for a common something isn't all bad. Choices aren't all bad either. But lack of support and yet a device that delivers even 1/2 of what this thread proposes are needs has yet to happen anytime in 2016 or yet in 2017. In fact, the majority of the needs in this thread are satisfied in anachronistic hardware from 2008 or such. But good luck on finding any of that in pristine shape or affordable enough this year... or worse, with drivers that support our wants/needs. tl;dr No device released yet is ideal for more than a very small amount of people that want GNU/Linux handhelds and it is not going to change very soon unless a major manufacturer releases a platform with capable drivers and we show up in record numbers and buy the damn thing. |
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To bring some structural unity to this thread and since this is a thread about hand held linux machines, are there any hand held smart guns that use a linux operating system? Which OS might be best for such purposes? Tizen?
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Good enough, anyway, for me to chime in with stuff I don't know anything about, since the original purpose of this thread seems to be gone for good. While Samsung does have some experience with stuff like that, from what I've gathered, it's mostly things I would not consider hand held: Tanks, ships and stationary killing machines. Didn't find any info on those using Tizen, though. But why wouldn't they, really? ;) |
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Re: What's the best Handheld gnu/linux machine for 2017?
GPD announced new device - GPD Pocket, 7" UMPC with Ubuntu preinstalled https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=98091&page=4#32
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Re: What's the best Handheld gnu/linux machine for 2017?
Gemini announced the spiritual successor to the Psion Series 5MX with android or linux preinstalled:
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=99022 |
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Wonder what that 8000mAh battery will give in hours of use? It's removable - yay! |
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the GPD pocket is also doing well. nearly $2m after a week or so...
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These devices are borderline handheld-ish.
Way too big imo. |
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I stumbled onto this. It might not be the best handheld GNU/Linux machine for 2017 but it caught my attention. The Lichee Pi Zero is a $6 single-board computer with various add-ons available which can turn it into a "mini laptop" or a gaming handheld. It already has mainline Linux support since v4.11-rc1.
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Allwinner V3S runs Debian, has connections exposed for ease, not locked into SMT-only access and best of all, no 18month waiting for delivery (? we can hope?) Quote:
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One small gotcha I just noticed. It has only 512Mb RAM, that's only 64MB.
Still, I think it could be a fun little toy to play with. |
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to the extent that a fraction of people even understand the difference, that fraction uderstands Mb as throughput and MB as capacity. |
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Obviously a typo, I doubt there is a chipset still being made that ships with such little ram.
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No typo, it's a $6 board. That's even cheaper than the Raspberry Pi Zero and the C.H.I.P. The Indiegogo page states Mbit. This is further confirmed here where it states the Allwinner V3s has integrated 64MB DDR2. Linux is actually quite capable of many things with only 64MB. It doesn't seem like that long ago that I was using a PC with less memory than that.
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Re: What's the best Handheld gnu/linux machine for 2017?
Perfect for running Kolibri OS!
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Can't say that I'm as enthusiastic about 64MB than I was about 512MB. Not that Linux cannot scale down to that; just that the amount of bloat in modern code is now the norm unfortunately.
Perhaps as a hobbyist item, but not as a device I'd use often. |
Re: What's the best Handheld gnu/linux machine for 2017?
Coming soon! What do you think? (Windows versions is currently available)
http://www.geekbuying.com/item/GPD-P...GB-381288.html |
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noodle pie, not the best handheld but still..
https://liliputing.com/2017/07/noodl...wdfunding.html |
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This situation is pretty demoralizing. The neo900 is so late that it hardly matters whether it is ever completed or not at this point. And the Pyra folks seem to be seriously considering installing a fan...
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Re: What's the best Handheld gnu/linux machine for 2017?
I am glad for one thing...
That I am not the only person to have felt ...some feelings concerning the affordability of almost exactly what we need ...sans telephony service...and even that is only a matter of little time...before the neo900 becomes almost totally irrelevant.... when an ubuntu pocket 7 inch laptop.goes for under $500 ...and all the devel and production and sales surrounding everything from the c.h.i.p. to raspberry pi to pi phones to pi ...etc...for under $100 ...in some cases under $50.... with as much power as what the n900 has..or the neo will have...or more... I wish I could say that I am demoralized or depressed.... But I am not. The objective will be reached. Just not by the neo... that is obvious and plain now... We will have linux driven phones...and pocket pcs ... I feel no demoralization at all... we can throw a nice maemo skin over it ... tweak it the way it should be... and we soldier on. Neo is hardly the hope of the future for maemo...at one point it was...for a while. But there were some factors there... Three factors... 1- it is a hard struggle for start ups....most never make it... Neo had the stat. odds against it from day one. that helped slow it down...but not alone ...kill it's relevance... 2- There were ...naturally... unforeseen issues and situations which cropped up which helped stall and slow things down some more... but that alone didn't kill it's relevance... 3- and 3rd and lastly and most importantly..what did not only help additionally stall , slow down ...but also significantly help kill it's relevance today... was personality issues.... what started out as a team working on it...and progressing ...deteriorated ...to a couple of people ...one...possibly two who were with the project from the start...who now pump out white papers...on a project which frankly to be even remotely viable as a final product needed to be shipping 2 years ago... given enough time... the neo compared to a $50 convenience store disposable.. in specs. alone..will be the comparison of the "VIC 20" to "Deep Blue". I am not demoralized or depressed at all... the goal will be accomplished.. But not by the Neo... It is not relevant any longer in the greater scheme of things... I am simply becoming very angry... at the egos and personal politics ...which ultimately cost the project. the egos who have been paid...the few who still are with the project...who ARE being paid for their work... Their work...which compared to other comparable start ups who managed to be inventive, creative, and still work together...to produce products which are flexible expandable and up-gradable... For under $500... In most cases under $100... and for some...under $50... The neo team blew it. they have plenty of money... More than most of the other start ups got.. and they blew it. they blew their window of opportunity. they blew it fantastically. that is what makes me upset. I am hardly demoralized or depressed. We invested hefty money in the "Woody" , the "Edsel"...the freakin' exploding "Pinto"....of the smartphone world. I will be waiting for my refund. given enough patience... and I DO believe I and many others have been patient... EXCEEDINGLY patient and highly supportive in fact... FOR YEARS. my patience for my refund will run very thin... then I will have no recourse but to demand it ...instead of wait.... |
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Our only hope is Chenliangchen. Don't disappoint this depressed man, Chen. |
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but: the official GPD store https://www.aliexpress.com/store/pro...System-CPU-x7/ does not indicate Ubuntu yet, and nothing out there infers it is in the pipeline yet. It may still be too early, the promise as I read it had no firm date. |
Re: What's the best Handheld gnu/linux machine for 2017?
Any reason to think the hardware is really different between the W10 version and the Ubuntu version? I would guess you could just install any Linux distribution on the WIndows one, but then I have not been following the GPD and maybe they actually are different hardware?
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frankly chaps, if you want a modern device competently made that includes a keyboard and linux then you might be best off pinning your hopes and interest to the gemini PDA.
yes, it requires compromise on the stringent list of demands you have, but it is precisely that inability to compromise that has left you fruitlessly pining for a warmed over 600MHz Cortex A8 device with a flimsy jerry-rigged keyboard beneath its 3.5" svga screen. the n900 was great, i get it, mine still sits in the draw beside me. but the world moved on. |
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That said, if it helps keeping the OMAP5432 cooler during operation I am all for it. The fan suggested in the thread is very small and inaudible. I do want to see how easy it will be to replace it but if it is just a matter of unscrewing a few screws and plug in a new one I don't see a problem at all. https://pyra-handheld.com/boards/thr...l-white.80935/ |
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A one piece slider qwerty would be just south of the the border of amaizing. But I doubt anything will be the best handheld of 2017 :( |
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That reads so attractively that I had to chase this for links: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/g...device-phone#/ = looks they are fully funded ! http://planetcom.co.uk/ but then I began reading the fine print: Quote:
Linux hacked onto ARM device originally designed for crapware. (Almost the same plotline as Linux hacked onto *Trail device originally designed for crapware.) Been there, done that, Nexus 7 and several other Android junkmobiles. No chance in He11 everything will work: Options - pick 2 that will actually work (reliably) on linux after being abandoned inside the ARM buggery bag :
And don't even bother fantasizing about Bluetooth, camera, or accelerometers and their ilk. PostScript: Credibly incredible? Their development discussion is utter non-existium. At the least if you want to see what is going on with Pyra or GPD you can go visit their community discussions. Planet has top-secret need-to-know thank-you-for-funding-my-lovenest written all over the glossy fine graphic advertisements in the context of being not-a-single-word silent about development since the story about... ...their success in advertising 2017 April 20 . "Caveat Emptor" whispered inside the silent gloom of a deserted warehouse. (Not sure if they hired someone from Turing to help them find their way through the rough patches) I remembered reading about this before and filing for rainy days. Going back I found wicket's excellently concise post. |
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