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maemo.org - Talk (https://talk.maemo.org/index.php)
-   Jolla1 & TOH (https://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=56)
-   -   Jolla User Experience Thread (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=91875)

ggabriel 2013-12-07 14:54
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane (Post 1393379)
Good for you, but you can't expect normal people to go into dev mode and use the terminal for file management.
Are you suggesting I am not normal?! :-) And no, I haven't got dev mode on, I had to enable it once and then I just copied the terminal somewhere to keep it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane (Post 1393379)
If the N9 (I don't have one) doesn't come with a file manager, how do normal people manage files on it? I mean I'd just file (or feel) deprived of essential control over my device.
"Normal people" actually don't need to manage files with the N9 - the best you can do is connect it as mass storage and manage from there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane (Post 1393379)
Are there good file managers for N9 in existence now? Any ports to Sailfish in the works? Anyone announced a new one for SF?
Pretty much from day 1, yeah, you could get it from the store [for free in most cases]. It just didn't come out of the box. Not sure whether even Nokia made one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane (Post 1393379)
Man I still can't believe it, that's like treating the user worse than Apple does.
I think you may be over reacting - Apple doesn't ship a file manager, nor lets you access the ithingy file system unless you root it. Android doesn't even come with a terminal, and I don't recall playing with vanilla Android phones that have a file manager.

I think you got my message wrong to be honest :-) Jolla probably has a file manager in the making, it's in their video, probably not released yet due to the OS being at a beta stage.

RX-51 2013-12-07 15:21
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Norris (Post 1393369)
Too many bugs, too many issues with SDK and nowhere to report to. This should not be released to public as user product but under Dev-category. (I know they are trying to save it by adding a beta tag)

I'm disappointed. Good luck to you all. I'm waiting at least another year to give sailfish a go as a developer or user. It's way to immature for an unreal price tag.

Chuck
It's not Chuck Norris failing on Sailfish - it's Sailfish failing on Chuck Norris :D

Fuzzillogic 2013-12-07 17:29
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by w00t (Post 1393382)
No. Such a thing is a large can of worms (hard to do, hard to do performantly). If you ever experienced smartsearch sucking up your battery on the N9, that's why.
I never had issues with smartsearch (but that might be just luck), nor had I with performance. But I actually fail to see the problem of such search in general. It has been on desktops for years now, and I use it often. And as said, I'm quite content with the capabilities of the N9 in this regard.

Sure, it might be depending on your usage pattern. If you dump lots of crappy .docx files or pdf's on your phone, one can expect issues with tracker.
Quote:
This doesn't mean it won't ever happen, but it isn't there now.
I know I'm far from the usual user, but I'd rather have global search and indexing than support for yet another advertising company like facebook/twitter/google...

bockersjv 2013-12-07 20:28
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
THnak all for the commenst on video stuff. I will use handbrake to convert in the future. My main concern was video content turning up in the media/music app.

One issue I have had twice now is that my stock ambiences have gone missing. I have the two OH ambiences but the others have gone.

I fixed it first time by a full reset, so they are still there but why are they not showing up anymore? (have reported it too).

I am liking the built in browser now, took some time to get used to it, but so need the landscape mode as my eyes aren't what they once were :(

mikecomputing 2013-12-07 20:51
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzillogic (Post 1393416)
I never had issues with smartsearch (but that might be just luck), nor had I with performance. But I actually fail to see the problem of such search in general. It has been on desktops for years now, and I use it often. And as said, I'm quite content with the capabilities of the N9 in this regard.
A mobile is not a desktop! Indexing often eating CPU even on desktop OS so its definitivly a batterydrainer.

ARJWright 2013-12-07 21:23
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Things have evolved since I last went thru the thread. What can I say, I'm more interested in a mobile that instigates me to live more than I am it to give me a convo. Perhaps I'm evolving to something else.

That said, I'd like to add UX questions to the list I made before. Here we go:

- open the clock; set an alarm; are you asked for the snooze time after you set the alarm; is it easy to create preset alarms which are deactivated until you activate them. Can you set a sleep timer; can the sleep/alarm sound be set to music you've loaded
- create an appointment, in the location field put an address in your city, save the appointment. Go back to view the appointmnet. Can you click on the location and it open the maps. When you close the map view, does it take you back to the calendar, or to the event feed. Does it cache the map view you looked at.
- create an appointment. In the location field, put a phone number. Save the appointment. Go back to the appointment view. Can you click on the phone number and it dial? Can you add pauses and additional numbers (call-in codes) to that number - for conference calls.
- enable location/GPS for pictures; take a picture; save it to your gallery. Is the gallery able to show you pictures by location? Is there a view in the calendar to show you pictures on the day you've taken them w/o showing you anything else on the calendar?
- navigate via the web browser to a page with a downloadable PDF; download and save the PDF. when you zoom in on the PDF, does the text reflow; do images reflow too. Can you click on links. How much a delay to load a large/heavy PDF than a small one. Can you attach that PDF easily to an email - can you share/attach to an email that PDF right from the PDF - not starting first with an email. Can you attach that PDF to a calendar entry. Can you attach it to a contact?
- can you alter the browser configuration (about:config, extensions, etc.); are you able to change the DNS or proxy settings from the browser not just from the settings app.
- can you unmerge contacts you've merged; what's the process of bulk deleting, editing, or merging/unmerging

I'll have more questions as I think about them. But, its clear that I could have had a lot of fun with Jolla as a product tester - there is a minimum viable product state that was met with this release that I think was too low given some of the comments so far. That said, what's been shipped is quite impressive. Its the updates which add polish that should make for a very interesting product going forward - especially as it relates to Jolla being a device/platform designer for other companies going forward.

Fuzzillogic 2013-12-07 21:33
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikecomputing (Post 1393458)
A mobile is not a desktop! Indexing often eating CPU even on desktop OS so its definitivly a batterydrainer.
Indexing a file needs to be done only once, and when it changes.

Yeah, after dumping my music collection on the N9, it was busy for a few minutes indexing. And indeed, after syncing all my e-mail to my desktop even its 3.4GHz core i7 had its work cut out for quite some minutes. (on the N9 no such problem, as only the last month or so is synced) That would suck if that sucks the last bit of juice out of the battery. But indexing lots of files can be done when charging, e.g. when high power drain is much less of an issue if any at all.

To me the upsides are well worth the downsides.

att 2013-12-07 21:43
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARJWright (Post 1393463)
- can you unmerge contacts you've merged; what's the process of bulk deleting, editing, or merging/unmerging
Yes, you can unlink contacts: Select person. From top pulley menu select Link. Tap person/contact to be unlinked.

I don't think there is bulk deleting, editing or link/unlink.

att 2013-12-07 21:51
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARJWright (Post 1393463)
- can you alter the browser configuration (about:config, extensions, etc.); are you able to change the DNS or proxy settings from the browser not just from the settings app.
There is about: config but the UI doesn't work properly so for now I recommend using Terminal app and text editor to edit /home/nemo/.mozilla/mozembed/prefs.js fiel when browser has been shutdown.

You can install extensions but I'm not sure if they actually work or some work. The about: addons UI for extensions doesn't work properly.

On browser's or general settings there aren't currently possibility of setting DNS or proxy, at least through UI.

att 2013-12-07 21:58
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARJWright (Post 1393463)
- open the clock; set an alarm; are you asked for the snooze time after you set the alarm; is it easy to create preset alarms which are deactivated until you activate them. Can you set a sleep timer; can the sleep/alarm sound be set to music you've loaded
When you create a new alarm you are asked:
  • Time: Hour and minutes
  • Alarm name
  • Repeat: Mon, Tue, Wed, Thu, Fri, Sat, Sun

All alarms you have ever created are shown on the Clock app's main view until you delete them. You can active or deactivate them by simply tapping them.

When an alarm triggers you have two possiblities: dismiss (pull from down) or snooze (pull from up).

You can change the clock alarm tone from the Settings app: System settings: Sounds and feedback. There is "Select from music files" when you try to change tone.

att 2013-12-07 22:24
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARJWright (Post 1393463)
- navigate via the web browser to a page with a downloadable PDF; download and save the PDF. when you zoom in on the PDF, does the text reflow; do images reflow too. Can you click on links. How much a delay to load a large/heavy PDF than a small one. Can you attach that PDF easily to an email - can you share/attach to an email that PDF right from the PDF - not starting first with an email. Can you attach that PDF to a calendar entry. Can you attach it to a contact?
Downloaded Jolla's press release with the browser. Tapping downloaded PDF didn't do anything. I had to start Documents app and from there to select the downloaded PDF.

I don't understand what you mean by reflow. When I zoom in on the Documents app current image of the screen is scaled up by multiplication and when I stop zooming app will render the page again with proper resolution.

When you tap links it will open Browser or Email app (or if you miss a little bit it will split the screen with functionality view on the top part).

From the functionality view in Documents app you can tap Email but for some reason it doesn't add the PDF as the default attachment as I would have expected. There is also "Bluetooth Share" and "Add account" to choose from functionality view. I don't understand why there is "Add account". Maybe a bug.

In People and Calendar apps there isn't possiblity to add PDF as entry to the contact/calendar entry.

att 2013-12-07 22:31
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARJWright (Post 1393463)
- create an appointment, in the location field put an address in your city, save the appointment. Go back to view the appointmnet. Can you click on the location and it open the maps. When you close the map view, does it take you back to the calendar, or to the event feed. Does it cache the map view you looked at.
- create an appointment. In the location field, put a phone number. Save the appointment. Go back to the appointment view. Can you click on the phone number and it dial? Can you add pauses and additional numbers (call-in codes) to that number - for conference calls.
There isn't location field.

There are
  • Event name
  • Description
  • Starts: date, time
  • Ends: date, time
  • Recurring
  • Remind me

pycage 2013-12-07 22:37
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
The filemanager of the poor:

Open "file://" in the browser.
Then you can at least browse the filesystem and open files.

ARJWright 2013-12-07 23:30
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by att (Post 1393474)
I don't understand what you mean by reflow. When I zoom in on the Documents app current image of the screen is scaled up by multiplication and when I stop zooming app will render the page again with proper resolution.
There are usually two states for the text on PDF doc readers. One, where you don't have the lines wrap, and a second where the width of the PDF is constrained, and the text lines wrap. For some PDF viewers, they will show the original layout when opened, but if you zoom in, the text will reflow within the viewport of your screen, wrapping the text so you don't have to pan/drag to read a line.

Your answers to my scenarios are much appreciated. I think Jolla will be better able to define the success of broken/fixed, upcoming, and new features based on those scenarios. As I think through a few more, I'll add.

mikecomputing 2013-12-07 23:50
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pycage (Post 1393481)
The filemanager of the poor:

Open "file://" in the browser.
Then you can at least browse the filesystem and open files.
what about https://github.com/nemomobile/qmlfilemuncher

I am suprised people bashing about filebrowser when this can be done by the community?

There is plenty of other things in the coreOS that need to get fixed. Filebrowser is probadly mostly used by geeks/developers.

For me its way more important that webbrowser, camera, phone, email work very well. But also stable API for developers. So let Jolla focus on that first and let the community make a filebrowser or some kind of backend to the OS in some way... Btw. without those stupid doubleclicks to change directorys.

m4r0v3r 2013-12-08 00:30
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
I think people should checkout the Nemo Mobile repos for whatever they need for now, and maybe reskin it?

MSameer 2013-12-08 00:42
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by m4r0v3r (Post 1393498)
I think people should checkout the Nemo Mobile repos for whatever they need for now, and maybe reskin it?
Nemo does not have silica QML components so the UI will have to be reworked :/

m4r0v3r 2013-12-08 00:50
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSameer (Post 1393501)
Nemo does not have silica QML components so the UI will have to be reworked :/
I may take a look during my holiday period at work.

jjaone 2013-12-08 03:38
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quick partial reply concerning the calendar; there is no location field in jolla calendar event, so maps integration is not available, at least for now.

Cheers..

rannari 2013-12-08 09:14
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Is Gnupg included in the SailfishOS package? That would satisfy my needs before some native GUI app for encryption/decryption comes out.

att 2013-12-08 09:22
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rannari (Post 1393556)
Is Gnupg included in the SailfishOS package? That would satisfy my needs before some native GUI app for encryption/decryption comes out.
Yes, there is gnupg2 and already installed.

Version: 2.0.4
Release: 1.1.1

att 2013-12-08 09:29
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARJWright (Post 1393487)
There are usually two states for the text on PDF doc readers. One, where you don't have the lines wrap, and a second where the width of the PDF is constrained, and the text lines wrap. For some PDF viewers, they will show the original layout when opened, but if you zoom in, the text will reflow within the viewport of your screen, wrapping the text so you don't have to pan/drag to read a line.
Okay, I haven't noticed any reflow behaviour on the Documents app when viewing PDFs.

strongm 2013-12-08 10:25
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARJWright (Post 1393487)
There are usually two states for the text on PDF doc readers. One, where you don't have the lines wrap, and a second where the width of the PDF is constrained, and the text lines wrap. For some PDF viewers, they will show the original layout when opened, but if you zoom in, the text will reflow within the viewport of your screen, wrapping the text so you don't have to pan/drag to read a line.
Reflow is an attribute for the PDF, not of the reader. If a document has not been marked by the author for reflowing (which includes the document being marked up with additional tags to make reflow work properly) then a PDF reader should not reflow it. But yes, some readers will attempt to reflow even unmarked, untagged PDFs, but that can end is a mess ...

pycage 2013-12-08 10:26
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by att (Post 1393566)
Okay, I haven't noticed any reflow behaviour on the Documents app when viewing PDFs.
Reflow goes against the nature of PDF, which was designed to look exactly the same on all output devices. Therefore the hacks some apps apply to reflow PDF content may not work well on some kinds of documents.
That said, PDF is a considerably bad format choice for eBooks.

Bundyo 2013-12-08 12:45
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Interesting. I have a File Manager in Sailfish on my N950, but I don't remember where I got it from. It sure uses Silica.

gerbick 2013-12-08 12:52
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bundyo (Post 1393636)
Interesting. I have a File Manager in Sailfish on my N950, but I don't remember where I got it from. It sure uses Silica.
Screenshots?

mikecomputing 2013-12-08 13:03
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bundyo (Post 1393636)
Interesting. I have a File Manager in Sailfish on my N950, but I don't remember where I got it from. It sure uses Silica.
When I upgraded from my n9 from nemo => sailfishos filemuncher was left there and worked in sailfishos. Not seen any silica based browser so far...

Bundyo 2013-12-08 13:13
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Here you are:
http://bundyo.org/jolla/shots/20131208145831.pnghttp://bundyo.org/jolla/shots/20131208150010.pnghttp://bundyo.org/jolla/shots/20131208145906.pnghttp://bundyo.org/jolla/shots/20131208145929.png

ggabriel 2013-12-08 13:14
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
That file manager icon is exactly the same as the image in jolla.com, maybe you managed to download a package in Alpha without noticing? :-)

Bundyo 2013-12-08 13:18
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Well, I only used the Jolla releases repos for downloading, the others require password.

Bundyo 2013-12-08 13:26
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Yes, the Jolla apps repo has a jolla-fileman package, I think that was it. I hunted through the repos and enabled developer mode, probably that was when I installed the file manager too.

att 2013-12-08 13:42
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bundyo (Post 1393657)
Yes, the Jolla apps repo has a jolla-fileman package, I think that was it. I hunted through the repos and enabled developer mode, probably that was when I installed the file manager too.
Thanks. I also installed it: pkcon install jolla-fileman

MSameer 2013-12-08 13:51
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bundyo (Post 1393636)
Interesting. I have a File Manager in Sailfish on my N950, but I don't remember where I got it from. It sure uses Silica.
How did you get sailfish on N950?!

Bundyo 2013-12-08 13:53
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
By upgrading from Nemo - there's another thread here for that :)
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=90761

Bundyo 2013-12-08 14:07
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
There is one very annoying issue though (both in N950 and N9) - all the swipes are rotated (and Maps scrolls in rotated directions). Do you guys know of a fix for that?

att 2013-12-08 14:09
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by att (Post 1393662)
I also installed it: pkcon install jolla-fileman
It already crashed me once :)

Opening files from it is a little game of chance. Image files open nicely to Gallery app, but PDFs, ODTs, executables, WAVs and text files don't seem to open from Files app.

Bundyo 2013-12-08 14:11
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Yeah, I didn't actually use it, prefer the Midnight Commander :)

pycage 2013-12-08 14:16
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bundyo (Post 1393672)
There is one very annoying issue though (both in N950 and N9) - all the swipes are rotated (and Maps scrolls in rotated directions). Do you guys know of a fix for that?
I can imagine that the reason for this is that the screen in the N9 and N950 are actually landscape screens and landscape mode is the natural orientation.
So the edge gestures work as if on the natural screen orientation.

bockersjv 2013-12-09 10:27
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
One thing no one has mention... well i may have missed it... .is that there are no emoticons in the messaging app :O

zamorph 2013-12-09 11:10
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
What sort of call logs / call history detail does the Jolla have?

I ask because, on my N900, for a specific contact, I could view an extensive Communication History, which included SMSes and phone calls.

But when I moved to the N9, it didn't have the same call logs / history. It was much more limited, and only displayed the last call from any specific contact.


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