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-   Jolla1 & TOH (https://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=56)
-   -   Jolla User Experience Thread (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=91875)

richardyates 2013-12-11 15:41
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Got the chance to try out google navigation today

Turn by turn instructions including voice instructions worked just fine

However nothing I could do meant that the map was on the screen, so I got a green bar at the top of the screen with instructions of what to do, under which was a blank white screen

anyone else?

jalundan 2013-12-11 15:46
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bockersjv (Post 1395041)
Turn the phone over? The light shows different colours for different events and is something th N9 was missing.
That's not the point. :( The point is that is there a possibility to turn it on by option. Meaning that for example, when I leave it to recharge and the battery is full, the led blinks. I hate lightblinking when I try to sleep. :D But on the other hand, I must leave it for it to have battery for the next day. I know, I know.. It is a very small problem, but it's just me that wants these things. I'm the person who has taped "breathing light" over with duckt tape from a mac and a monitor because the blinking is irritating. :D

Quote:
Originally Posted by bockersjv (Post 1395041)
Chose a bright picture and make an ambience from it, or make your own single bright colour jpg and use that. :D

I love the stock grassroots colours.
Yeah. But the problem is, that for example I have not been able to create an ambience with dark picture (almost black) and having for example white text even that would be totally visible. So the easiest way would be to change the background image of an ambience once I have gotten whit(e/ish) text.

The bright coloured pictures work just fine, but for example every time I try to make an ambience from a black and white picture, I get this suck *** orange or baby poop coloured text. I have tried at least with 5-10 different pictures and the result is always the same. S**t coloured or orange. :P

Watchmaker 2013-12-11 15:50
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalundan (Post 1395044)
[...] the problem is, that for example I have not been able to create an ambience with dark picture (almost black) and having for example white text even that would be totally visible. So the easiest way would be to change the background image of an ambience once I have gotten whit(e/ish) text.

The bright coloured pictures work just fine, but for example every time I try to make an ambience from a black and white picture, I get this suck *** orange or baby poop coloured text. I have tried at least with 5-10 different pictures and the result is always the same. S**t coloured or orange. :P
Just out of curiosity, could you upload a screenshot of such an Ambience? :D

ste-phan 2013-12-11 15:58
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ggabriel (Post 1395034)
Once again: the applications remain open, they just don't appear on that screen. There is no workaround that I know of, but then again you don't want to be scrolling down forever, right?
what is cooler than scrolling 9 multitask windows?

Scrolling 20 multitask windows, all with life content!

on 1:12 , the N900 and how a true multitask browsing device looks like.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wbu_JN8Q-k

ggabriel 2013-12-11 16:05
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ste-phan (Post 1395049)
on 1:12 , the N900 and how a true multitask browsing device looks like.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wbu_JN8Q-k
While it's nice for its time, you do undertsand that the UX doesn't go with the gesture philosophy, right? :-) Maybe there should be an option to open a dedicated application with _all_ those minimised windows, for the hardcore user.

jalundan 2013-12-11 16:08
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Watchmaker (Post 1395046)
Just out of curiosity, could you upload a screenshot of such an Ambience? :D
I shall deliver!
http://koti.kapsi.fi/~jalundan/20131211180522.png

Hideous color. Baby poop... :mad:

Mikkosssss 2013-12-11 16:30
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalundan (Post 1395044)
That's not the point. :( The point is that is there a possibility to turn it on by option. Meaning that for example, when I leave it to recharge and the battery is full, the led blinks. I hate lightblinking when I try to sleep. :D But on the other hand, I must leave it for it to have battery for the next day. I know, I know.. It is a very small problem, but it's just me that wants these things. I'm the person who has taped "breathing light" over with duckt tape from a mac and a monitor because the blinking is irritating. :D
I turned off my N9 breathing charging light long time ago by editing mce.ini. So it might be possible on Jolla too. :)
Disable charging light is now added on N9QTweak.

Watchmaker 2013-12-11 16:35
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalundan (Post 1395051)
I shall deliver!
http://koti.kapsi.fi/~jalundan/20131211180522.png

Hideous color. Baby poop... :mad:
Mmm... interesting. :p
If you want to experiment, try with a plain back image and let's see what happens then.

att 2013-12-11 16:40
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikkosssss (Post 1395060)
I turned off my N9 breathing charging light long time ago by editing mce.ini. So it might be possible on Jolla too. :)
See /etc/mce/20hybris-led.ini and /etc/mce/10mce.ini

jalundan 2013-12-11 17:02
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by att (Post 1395063)
See /etc/mce/20hybris-led.ini and /etc/mce/10mce.ini
Hmm.. I'm a huge newb with sailfish / maemo. Coming from iOS world to this, and 1 day in at Jolla-world. So any pointers to a web page or any instructions how to be able to edit those?

I can work my way with unix/linux, but no clue where to start..

vo-de 2013-12-11 17:23
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Received my Jolla on Monday and switched from my N9 to Jolla today.

First, thanks for Jolla picking up and continuing N9 heritage! N9 was and still is great phone, but obviously it has not future. Jolla seem to be something like rough diamond right now - it needs some cutting and lot's of polishing, but it looks promising. Wish Jolla success so they can keep improving it.

My first experience with Sailfish was rather confusing but after a couple of days I'm growing into it. This is power user's phone and has few friendly buttons giving hints what to do next. I'm ok with that, but I expect lot of negative reviews because the initial impression counts a lot and not many reviewers are happy to speend week or even days before rushing to write their review.

Some comments to Jolla, if you are reading this
  • Please increase contrast (or less transparency) between text and background picture. My eyes are not that good anymore and for example reading email summaries or settings can be hard depending on the ambient light.
  • Integrate calendar (current day) to notifications screen.
  • There are plenty of inconsistencies in UI - sometimes I need to press something, sometimes need to use pulley menu. For example answering call vs ending the call. Or editing existing alarm requires long press which is not so obvious.
  • Double tap on sleep screen should show also battery and network status - now one needs to scroll a little bit for no obvious reason as there is plenty of screen estate left. Put some calendar information there as well.. Generally, if there is unused screen estate, use it for something intelligently.
  • "Deleting in 5 seconds.." can be rather annoying - is there a way to speed up the process?
  • Blinking LED's need to go

bockersjv 2013-12-11 17:24
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalundan (Post 1395044)
That's not the point. :( The point is that is there a possibility to turn it on by option. Meaning that for example, when I leave it to recharge and the battery is full, the led blinks. I hate lightblinking when I try to sleep. :D But on the other hand, I must leave it for it to have battery for the next day. I know, I know.. It is a very small problem, but it's just me that wants these things. I'm the person who has taped "breathing light" over with duckt tape from a mac and a monitor because the blinking is irritating. :D


Yeah. But the problem is, that for example I have not been able to create an ambience with dark picture (almost black) and having for example white text even that would be totally visible. So the easiest way would be to change the background image of an ambience once I have gotten whit(e/ish) text.

The bright coloured pictures work just fine, but for example every time I try to make an ambience from a black and white picture, I get this suck *** orange or baby poop coloured text. I have tried at least with 5-10 different pictures and the result is always the same. S**t coloured or orange. :P
I understand what you mean about the flashing leds, if the Jolla community is anything like the n900 one there will soon be an app to modify its behaviour.

On the matter of ambiances I understand your issue now. I too loaded a black and white image and whilst the lock screen is fine it gradually turns diarrhoea like as you move down the screens. Not found a way to avoid that yet :(

bockersjv 2013-12-11 17:29
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vo-de (Post 1395074)
Received my Jolla on Monday and switched from my N9 to Jolla today.

First, thanks for Jolla picking up and continuing N9 heritage! N9 was and still is great phone, but obviously it has not future. Jolla seem to be something like rough diamond right now - it needs some cutting and lot's of polishing, but it looks promising. Wish Jolla success so they can keep improving it.

My first experience with Sailfish was rather confusing but after a couple of days I'm growing into it. This is power user's phone and has few friendly buttons giving hints what to do next. I'm ok with that, but I expect lot of negative reviews because the initial impression counts a lot and not many reviewers are happy to speend week or even days before rushing to write their review.

Some comments to Jolla, if you are reading this
  • Please increase contrast (or less transparency) between text and background picture. My eyes are not that good anymore and for example reading email summaries or settings can be hard depending on the ambient light.
  • Integrate calendar (current day) to notifications screen.
  • There are plenty of inconsistencies in UI - sometimes I need to press something, sometimes need to use pulley menu. For example answering call vs ending the call. Or editing existing alarm requires long press which is not so obvious.
  • Double tap on sleep screen should show also battery and network status - now one needs to scroll a little bit for no obvious reason as there is plenty of screen estate left. Put some calendar information there as well.. Generally, if there is unused screen estate, use it for something intelligently.
  • "Deleting in 5 seconds.." can be rather annoying - is there a way to speed up the process?
  • Blinking LED's need to go
I raised the fact that 3g and battery needs to be on the lock screen, it can go to the right of the clock. Sent it to Jolla care, it's madness that you can't check battery status on the lock screen without having to scroll.

The delete in 5 seconds is great, you get used to it. It does not stop you doing other things or deleting other things as you can have several countdowns going at once. IMHO must better that a "are you sure" dialog.

The UI becomes 2nd nature in time and does make sense ...mostly.

"I like blinking I does" :D

ggabriel 2013-12-11 17:29
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vo-de (Post 1395074)
"Deleting in 5 seconds.." can be rather annoying - is there a way to speed up the process?
You don't need to wait, just go away and it deletes it ;-) (according to the guide or some video where Marc explained it)

prosetheus 2013-12-11 17:34
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ggabriel (Post 1395034)
Once again: the applications remain open, they just don't appear on that screen. There is no workaround that I know of, but then again you don't want to be scrolling down forever, right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bockersjv (Post 1395038)
Also if youi long press on the screen so you can close selected apps you get a chance to view more than 9 (not sure what the limit is though). Also bear in mind that if you open one of the minimised apps and Jolla puts it to the top of the multitasks screen. So the ones that have slipped out of view are those you have probably not been using.
Thank you for clearing that up. Tried to see through youtube if I could see someone clearing that up but till a couple of days ago did not find the answer.

Am I correct in assuming that the N9 allows scrolling downwards scaled to how many apps are open? I assumed Jolla would be like that too.

I have been a big fan of the N900 and use it as my daily device (its more than perfect). Have used iOS and Android and found them unbearable.

I cannot find a better place on this forum to ask this question at the time being, but can/will the Jolla phone enjoy the same level of support from this community as did the N900? My highest priority in selecting my next device will be to go with the device that this phenomenal community is behind.

ggabriel 2013-12-11 17:37
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by prosetheus (Post 1395079)
Am I correct in assuming that the N9 allows scrolling downwards scaled to how many apps are open? I assumed Jolla would be like that too.
yeap - N9 is like that. But bear in mind that in the Jolla the UX is different, as you flip different screens by going up/down, so it'd be impractical to have 100s of open applications and have to scroll all the way down until you get to the launcher. That's the logic anyway, I'm not a UX designer ;-)

att 2013-12-11 17:47
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalundan (Post 1395069)
Hmm.. I'm a huge newb with sailfish / maemo. Coming from iOS world to this, and 1 day in at Jolla-world. So any pointers to a web page or any instructions how to be able to edit those?

I can work my way with unix/linux, but no clue where to start..
In Settings app: system setting: Developer mode enable Developer mode and allow Remote connection. Write a password (try to invent long but easy to write one) and save it. (Don't touch Allow developer updates!)

Start Terminal app. Because you want to edit system files, run command devel-su and give it the password you earlier gave for Settings app.

Enable mer-tools by giving commands:

ssu ar mer-tools
pkcon refresh

If you already know how to use vi editor, you can skip this step. Install easier to use editor by giving command:

pkcon install nano

After that go to directory to edit files, take original version aside in case you want to restore the original and edit the file:

cd /etc/mce
cp -ip 10mce.ini 10mce.ini.ORIG
nano 10mce.ini

CTRL+X to exit from the nano editor. Commands are listed at the last two rows when editing file.

WARNING! When editing system files it might be possible to brick your Jolla.

prosetheus 2013-12-11 17:49
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ggabriel (Post 1395080)
yeap - N9 is like that. But bear in mind that in the Jolla the UX is different, as you flip different screens by going up/down, so it'd be impractical to have 100s of open applications and have to scroll all the way down until you get to the launcher. That's the logic anyway, I'm not a UX designer ;-)
I dont have any UI design experience myself. :P

I have not been following the development phase of Jolla in recent months, but is it possible that someone could implement vertical scrolling of running apps (like N9) ONLY in multitasking screen, whereas swiping left or right to get back to normal Jolla app icons and maintaining the default vertical scrolling there?

I absolutely loved it when we got that app on the n900 where a light tap on the camera shutter button took us straight to the multitasking/app screen. That was genius.

Will modification of that level be available on the Jolla phone?

att 2013-12-11 17:55
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vo-de (Post 1395074)
Please increase contrast (or less transparency) between text and background picture. My eyes are not that good anymore and for example reading email summaries or settings can be hard depending on the ambient light.
Are you talking about 1.0.1.10 (Laadunjärvi) which was released at Monday, or older release? Because 1.0.1.10 already increased the contrast.

att 2013-12-11 18:10
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by prosetheus (Post 1395084)
I have not been following the development phase of Jolla in recent months, but is it possible that someone could implement vertical scrolling of running apps (like N9) ONLY in multitasking screen, whereas swiping left or right to get back to normal Jolla app icons and maintaining the default vertical scrolling there?
I have understood that Jolla uses Lipstick software to run the home screen (lock screen, switcher, launcher, ...). You probably can customize it. You can use QML to write screens for Lipstick

w00t can correct me if I'm wrong :)

richardyates 2013-12-11 18:14
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Just waiting for an update to the mail app, wonder what it does

vo-de 2013-12-11 18:25
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by att (Post 1395086)
Are you talking about 1.0.1.10 (Laadunjärvi) which was released at Monday, or older release? Because 1.0.1.10 already increased the contrast.
The latest (.10). Bright text is fine (for example From: in email summary display) but the normal text does not have enough contrast. Having left-right gradient makes it even harder to use summary display for good. Most of the text in email setup is also pretty unreadable because of low contrast.

I'm using the "Rope" ambience as it seemed to offer the best experience from built-in ambiences.

minimos 2013-12-11 18:34
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
I noticed that if I set the device with "English UK" language, the maps app shows distances in yards/miles. Bleargh :-/
Is there any way to get English language and metric units? I miss some kind of en_DK locale!

richardyates 2013-12-11 18:40
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by minimos (Post 1395096)
I noticed that if I set the device with "English UK" language, the maps app shows distances in yards/miles. Bleargh :-/
Is there any way to get English language and metric units? I miss some kind of en_DK locale!
I'd like that too, spent years getting used to kms when abroad, don't want to go back now

aegis 2013-12-11 19:14
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Being able to set the measuring system independent of the language might be the best idea.

Incidentally, can I have meters and miles?

It's a mess but we're gradually getting rid of yards in the UK, even on the roads. Getting rid of miles might take a lot longer.

http://www.ukma.org.uk/distance-information-mess

zlatko 2013-12-11 19:16
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Question for lucky Jolla owners(and employees) - is the browser supporting certificate import? This is needed for internet banking etc.

juiceme 2013-12-11 19:25
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ggabriel (Post 1394959)
Right, 2 more low priority questions, if anybody really can be bothered and knows how to confirm them:
1. Can the Jolla send SMS's even if there is no cellular network? And what I mean exactly is: will it put it in a queue and send it at the first opportunity when there is cellular network, like pretty much every single Nokia does and pretty much every other device does not, except perhaps blackberry or newer devices I don't know?
2. This is a trickier one: can the browser open pages over SSL with ident authentication? (N9 couldn't in its first version, and could in its second; iOS/Android failed miserably when I last tested).
1.) Yes, just tested it. The message will be sent automatically when you get coverage again.

2.) Could you tell me an example of a site to try?

abyzthomas 2013-12-11 19:57
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morpog (Post 1394963)
On Harmattan, yes. On Sailfish, no. As you can see on SailfishOS only 9 open apps at once.
How about the messaging app. Can you open multiple windows of messaging with different people (like we can do on N9)?

I keep about 4-5 messaging windows open all the time and I just switch between them on my N9.

prosetheus 2013-12-11 20:06
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by att (Post 1395088)
I have understood that Jolla uses Lipstick software to run the home screen (lock screen, switcher, launcher, ...). You probably can customize it. You can use QML to write screens for Lipstick

w00t can correct me if I'm wrong :)
I would also like confirmation on this. Considering Jolla/sailfish OS is based around a philosophy of being 'unlike' and open, I should hope so that this is the case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by abyzthomas (Post 1395137)
How about the messaging app. Can you open multiple windows of messaging with different people (like we can do on N9)?

I keep about 4-5 messaging windows open all the time and I just switch between them on my N9.
This is also one of the main reasons for putting forth this issue. I hope that browser tabs or communication tabs dont fill up my usable apps area leaving me fumbling to manage other tasks.

att 2013-12-11 20:16
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by abyzthomas (Post 1395137)
How about the messaging app. Can you open multiple windows of messaging with different people (like we can do on N9)?
Nope, but you quickly change the person you are messaging with. Swipe right and tap the last message of some other person.

Wallace 2013-12-11 20:17
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
I made accidentaly a crap backup from whole phone but dont want to keep that.

How can i delete it? Cant find a way how to do it?

w00t 2013-12-11 20:24
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by att (Post 1395086)
Are you talking about 1.0.1.10 (Laadunjärvi) which was released at Monday, or older release? Because 1.0.1.10 already increased the contrast.
And if you'd like to tweak it some more, see config in /var/lib/environment/nemo - you want the QT_DF_* variables in 50-jolla-ui.conf

att 2013-12-11 20:33
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wallace (Post 1395143)
I made accidentaly a crap backup from whole phone but dont want to keep that.

How can i delete it? Cant find a way how to do it?
Settings app: System settings: Backup, tap the backup, tap Delete.

juiceme 2013-12-11 20:37
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by abyzthomas (Post 1395137)
How about the messaging app. Can you open multiple windows of messaging with different people (like we can do on N9)?
I keep about 4-5 messaging windows open all the time and I just switch between them on my N9.
Now how do you do that on N9??
On my device the messaging app and mail client both can only open once. If I swipe away and start them again from icons I just get the already open application....
Is there a setting/tweak somewhere to do that?

zamorph 2013-12-11 20:42
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vo-de (Post 1395074)
Integrate calendar (current day) to notifications screen.
I second this.


Quote:
"Deleting in 5 seconds.." can be rather annoying - is there a way to speed up the process?
This is such a brilliant feature. As Bockersjv indicates, you can carry on doing other stuff - it's just a very clever way of avoiding having to confirm that, Yes, you do indeed want to delete something. It streamlines things so brilliantly!


Quote:
Blinking LED's need to go
Coming from the low-power mode screen of the N9, the notification LED is a minimum must-have in my opinion.

N9uwu 2013-12-11 20:44
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by juiceme (Post 1395151)
Now how do you do that on N9??
On my device the messaging app and mail client both can only open once. If I swipe away and start them again from icons I just get the already open application....
Is there a setting/tweak somewhere to do that?
If I swipe away a messaging instance with an open dialog, re-launching the messaging-app opens up another instance. Don't know why your N9 behaves differently.

Miharin 2013-12-11 20:45
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
So how do I connect my Jolla to Mac? Or Linux for that matter? Android File Transfer app doesn't seem to do it.

abyzthomas 2013-12-11 20:57
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by N9uwu (Post 1395156)
If I swipe away a messaging instance with on open dialog, re-launching the messaging-app opens up another instance. Don't know why your N9 behaves differently.
If you launch the messaging app and swipe away and relaunch, you will only get 1 window.

If you launch the messaging app and open some contacts messages, and then swipe away and relaunch from icon, you will get a new windows. You can keep doing this with as many contacts on N9 to have their message windows open so you can switch between them. I leave the message window open for the people I message often so I can switch to them easily.

Edit: I always hoped if the email client also allowed us to do it, but it does not on N9.

beylow 2013-12-11 21:04
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Got my Jolla today from DNA. Very excited. But later I was totally disappointed. The phone sometimes doesn't find my sim card and losing signal for more than 10 times in less than half an hour. The phone is already updated to the latest firmware. (BTW. my sim card works perfect in nokia and samsung devices) I have to constantly restart the phone in order to re-detect the sim card. I went to DNA, they refused to change a new one for me. They told me the only option is to send the phone to service point. Unbelievable service! I have heard that usually in Finland they will replace the faulty phone with a new one. This kind of experience really let me down. This is definitely the last time for me to purchase anything from DNA. And Jolla, let's see what you will do.

att 2013-12-11 21:04
Re: Jolla User Experience Thread
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miharin (Post 1395157)
So how do I connect my Jolla to Mac? Or Linux for that matter? Android File Transfer app doesn't seem to do it.
You need MTP client for Mac. I use simple-mtpfs for Fedora Linux.

Gphoto2 gets in the way so I have to mount, umount and mount again to actually use the filesystem. Haven't used any time to short out this problem because it is so fast to mount-umount-mount.


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