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-   -   Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=82014)

balisingh 2012-02-09 22:14
Re: Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles
 
how come there was never a symbian phone runnin on an armv7 processor?
i say this because web browsing on the symbians phones is horrendous.
nokia should have gotten a special processor made with a simple arm core with another arm v7 core. one for most simple tasks and another for web browsing and such. achieving best battery life while getting great performance.

zeebra 2012-02-09 23:23
Re: Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rugoz (Post 1158323)
I am not so sure the N9 would have sold 5 millions, but I wonder what kind of lumia sales elop expected if he starts blaming the salesmen.
It was always clear that wp7 wouldn't sell like hot cakes just because nokia makes the hardware. The hope is that nokia can push wp7 adoption above a critical mass.
no wonder he blames the salesmen. its difficult to sell something you don't believe in for a company that has sold out.

selling something you believe in with passion for a company with integrity, now that is easy.

bingomion 2012-02-09 23:29
Re: Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeebra (Post 1162889)
no wonder he blames the salesmen. its difficult to sell something you don't believe in for a company that has sold out.

selling something you believe in with passion for a company with integrity, now that is easy.
Wow yeah your right!
that's a good way of looking at it!:eek:

misterc 2012-02-10 00:21
Re: Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by szopin (Post 1162811)
[...]
As to WP being niche: Nokia/M$ just started ad capmaign in PL, it is huge. Don't watch tv and I still got hit. Friends who own tvs confirm it is there also. Time will show[...]
you / PL got hit by the same hurricane (in an espresso cup) then everybody else...
espresso cup <=> popularity / fan-base
how many ppl use LostDOS imMobilized in your country (how many of the ppl who told you they got hit have (or ever had...) one?
even if they can increase there market share by 100% (at what cost?), that's still going to be twice nothing...
alas, for NOKIA :(

ossipena 2012-02-10 07:32
Re: Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by switch-hitter (Post 1162848)
You can say that as many times as you like but it doesn't make it true. Show us the evidence.

The fact Symbian's sales and margins were growing (verifiable facts) and the fact Ovi was growing rapidly (verifiable fact) right up until the moment Elop made his EOL announcement tells an entirely different story. At the end of Q4 2010 (the last quarter before the Elop induced meltdown) NOKIA was selling as many smartphones as Apple and Samsung combined.
which part of the word scenario you didn't understand?

don_falcone 2012-02-10 08:05
Re: Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles
 
...I'm swearing, the longer i have to read quite childish terms like 'LostDOS imMobilized' / 'LostDOS Paralyzed' and colorized characters / company / brand names (i thought this had been getting better in the meantime!?), someone will hit the killfile AGAIN.

GrimyHR 2012-02-10 09:29
Re: Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by balisingh (Post 1162861)
how come there was never a symbian phone runnin on an armv7 processor?
i say this because web browsing on the symbians phones is horrendous.
nokia should have gotten a special processor made with a simple arm core with another arm v7 core. one for most simple tasks and another for web browsing and such. achieving best battery life while getting great performance.
try nokia 700, you might be suprised

zwer 2012-02-10 09:47
Re: Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwazix (Post 1161739)
Had they kept quiet, and ditched Symbian this february, with 3 Lumias ready to ship, they would have much more customers going to the store just asking for the new Nokia.
Had they kept quiet, WP wouldn't even exist anymore. It was failing badly (it still is, but that's a whole other topic) and Microsoft needed somebody that has some weight to throw it around for their platform's benefit. If they kept quiet they, even if they were to move to WP, they would not be able to sell anything bearing that name a year later. That's probably why Microsoft wasn't a cheapskate in the whole deal and offered all those $$$ to persuade the Nokia board more easily - Microsoft desperately needed it. Nokia, on the other hand, needed it like a an arrow to the knee, as the past year has shown...


Quote:
Originally Posted by tebsu (Post 1162141)
Unfortunately, they cannot sell it, because its in Germany. Note, that its now 15:00 here so there are still some hours where people might request that phone :P
Why would they not be able to sell it because it's in Germany? There are a lot of things never released for the German market per se that are sold all over Germany. After all, one of the best-price web shops, notebooksbilliger.de, operates from Germany and delivers only in Germany and Austria, and they've been one of the first ones to offer the N9.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rugoz (Post 1162781)
Being able to play crysis on any hardware with a wifi connection certainly is progress. It means I don't have to buy a console/pc and game developers are not limited by particular hardware.
As the 'terminal experiment' in the 70s and 80s proved - there is a good reason why you need a localized hardware: breakthroughs in silicon advance much faster than breakthroughs in telecommunications. There is a reason it failed then, and there is a reason it will fail now - Moore's law simply does not apply to telecommunications.

If it did, even if we take a starting point of v.34 modems when the most nooks were ironed out, in 1994 we had 28.8 kb/s (bauds, but let's roughly translate them to bits), we'd all be sporting 120Mbps connections now. For WiFi the stats are even grimmer - in 2000 we had 802.11b with 11Mbps rate, so if the Moore's law worked we'd all be having 45Gbps WiFi connections now. And I'm not even calculating the availability and general demand that makes deploying such networks, especially wireless ones with their limited frequencies and interference, next to impossible. To move everything to the cloud and still have a wireless access to it, we'd need to move the frequencies a couple notches up to the X-ray spectrum as radio waves cannot simply pack that much data. It's a physical limitation, not a technological one.

And then you have the issue of creating a server (farm) fast enough to serve all those terminals with such high demands, which means you'd have to build a couple of nuclear power plants next to it just to supply it with a juice, and probably put it on Arctic as there's just no way to cool off so much processing at one centralized location... No matter how optimized the solution might be, it just cannot work...

Those who dream of clouds providing them with the processing power that their localized hardware is providing don't know the first thing about physics, electronics, telecommunications and general computing. Sure, as an experimental setup it can appear amazing, but connect 1B people to it and you'll see what is a clusterf.ck of gargantuan proportions.

don_falcone 2012-02-10 09:48
Re: Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by balisingh (Post 1162861)
nokia should have gotten a special processor made with a simple arm core with another arm v7 core. one for most simple tasks and another for web browsing and such. achieving best battery life while getting great performance.
...guess what big.LITTLE is for? Hint: this is just _beginning_.

misterc 2012-02-10 19:05
Re: Nokia CEO Blames Salesmen For Windows Phone Struggles
 
agree with your post's general idea(s) as well as most examples [...]
have however one point where i beg to differ, namely networking respectively speed thereof:

Quote:
Originally Posted by zwer (Post 1163065)
[...]As the 'terminal experiment' in the 70s and 80s proved - there is a good reason why you need a localized hardware: breakthroughs in silicon advance much faster than breakthroughs in telecommunications. There is a reason it failed then, and there is a reason it will fail now - Moore's law simply does not apply to telecommunications.
this is nowadays replaced (or resuscitated?) with / by Citrix; plain office clerk doesn't need a i7, not even a i5, leave alone 4GB of RAM to work.
the few users that do actual number crunching, Computer Assisted tasks (CAx) or the like can still get a "fat computer" and connect to the (Citrix) network for office tasks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zwer (Post 1163065)
If it did, even if we take a starting point of v.34 modems when the most nooks were ironed out, in 1994 we had 28.8 kb/s (bauds, but let's roughly translate them to bits), we'd all be sporting 120Mbps connections now. For WiFi the stats are even grimmer - in 2000 we had 802.11b with 11Mbps rate, so if the Moore's law worked we'd all be having 45Gbps WiFi connections now. And I'm not even calculating the availability and general demand that makes deploying such networks, especially wireless ones with their limited frequencies and interference, next to impossible. To move everything to the cloud and still have a wireless access to it, we'd need to move the frequencies a couple notches up to the X-ray spectrum as radio waves cannot simply pack that much data. It's a physical limitation, not a technological one.

And then you have the issue of creating a server (farm) fast enough to serve all those terminals with such high demands, which means you'd have to build a couple of nuclear power plants next to it just to supply it with a juice, and probably put it on Arctic as there's just no way to cool off so much processing at one centralized location... No matter how optimized the solution might be, it just cannot work...

[...]
i live in a residential area where i can get 120Mbps; admittedly i have a cable connection.
with ADSL i'd be stuck @ 20Mbps, but this isn't a technological limit (2010 stats) , it is administrative rubbish (Moore’s Law and Communications)
this is simply the result of monopolistic markets (national carriers / providers) where entering is difficult; and the administrative decrees that competitors have to be allowed don't do the trick, as (in the mobile market) T-Mobile's efforts to leave the US market prove.
nota-bene: in South-Korea, the available speeds are not a consequence of competition but of the government giving the national operator the mission to provide that service

the same situation (i.e. dominant position in the market) that made NOKIA feel very comfortable until it was too late.
when Apple started the iPhone and Google followed suit with Android, they simply had no idea what to do... they kept doing what they had been doing for years, releasing Symbian (or Maemo) devices with outstanding hardware, but not up to market's expectations.
and then, Flopocalypse...
Quote:
A strong conviction that something must be done is the parent of many bad measures.
- Daniel Webster


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