Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

Umm...the article is pretty clear that it's just regurgitating rumors...

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

I didn't say what it was or what it wasn't... notice in my previous post the "..." for sarcasm...again... it's late I suppose and everyone is tired. :rolleyes:

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

@spinnukur:

Oh, you're right ...

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

@ysss

-.- ;):p

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

I think if this were the case then they wouldn't be "training" store staff. They would get a one pager on what to answer when someone asks... which is probably, nothing is going to change...yet.

Personally I think it is a new market approach that would be lead by high end non-osx phones at the lowest cost on a very fast network.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

wasn't t-mobile rumored to be buying Sprint and don't some of the latest phones support cdma AND gsm , like the touch pro 2?

Could make sense

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

Article is a lot of hand-wavy economic predictions about how an unlimited $50 will be bad for T-Mobile, because they'll get too many subscribers. Engadget should stick to reporting gadget news.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

I am losing more and more respect for engadget every day. Every article seems more and more like an OpEd piece than a report of the actual facts.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

this is what i say:

Why do people swear that everyone wants a data phone. There are customers who come in my store simply to want a usable phone and the demand for internet access on the go is not that serious. i say if tmobile got a lot more people say 30m more so thats near 60m chop half that in half who would actually be using data a lot maybe less than that. Its us geeks who use internet so much and we are a small percentage.

There are people who want to buy the G1 for the appeal and only use it for texting i kid you not. to date the G1 and Mytouch probably sold lets say somewhere under 7m i really can't speak for the number someone correct me but what other phone really strains the network? Behold hell no, blackberries ... doubt it. All in all i don't think it should be 50 dollars (from a non-consumer point) in my humble opinion cause they can make more money.

I think they should make the current loyalty plan (including text though) made for everyone not a "all-in-one" 50 dollar plan and data be separate for people who want to use it pay for it. Also you have to take into account most people are on flex pay too so if flex pay customers even the annual cannot utilize this they still will be making profit.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

Exactly, plus if the 4G is rolled out more extensively on both it'll make it easier to combine both networks, from my understanding.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

If the $50 unlimited rumor is true, the implication is that T-mobile is willing to cannibalize the revenue stream coming from it's high-value power users in order to attract more lower-value consumers. To close the thought, that would further imply that the data hungry "power user" really isn't a big part of the T-mobile customer base to begin with.

Edit to add: It seems risky to offer unlimited data as part of this package from a financial point of view, especially since separate data plans can potentially add incremental margin (especially with regards to subscribers with the premium phones).

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

well, after some research, I think it won't be so much buying Sprint as getting into some of Clear's spectrum and/or onto their network and doing some tower partnering so that t-mobile can pretty much flick the switch on nationwide 3g and also promise 4g in the next little while.

we'll see.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

We all keep saying unlimited data, but we have yet to know which data plan...If my memory serves me correctly T-Mobile has four plans--$9.99, $19.99, $34.99 smartphone, $34.99 Crackberry. So as far as we know the data plan if the $50 is true could be the $9.99 or $19.99 one with maybe the possibility of the smartphone or crackberry plan costing you an additional $15 to add ( still cheaper than other all-in-one plans still ).

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

I agree with you - the $50 unlimited rumor doesn't make sense.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

I (personally) think it ($50 plan) is just so crazy it might work.

Customers are frustrated about the complexity of the plans, bills, etc. This simplifies the billing and their workers to sell something to potential customers that much easier "Your bill will be $50, period".

I think they will see a huge boost in subscribers, and while they may lose some of their margins on data plans, most likely even people who don't really use the data aspect will get on the plan because a) they understand it b) its probably about the same (or less) than what they were already paying.

If they can keep up with network capacity, it could be a huge payoff in the longrun.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

This is from the guy who runs Tmonews.com.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

At $50 for voice and data, they would lose a lot of their margins. The only way this works is if the voice and data plan is actually a data only plan with VoIP explicitly permitted.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

It could be data, that's run through TMobile servers (like their current web2go). Which isn't a real data plan that smartphones like the iPhone or n900 would use.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

If Project Dark does not involve the N900, I will be disappointed, because it will mean no N900 for a while. It's hard being a gadget lover without much disposable income...

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

There's always a good chance that it will be marketing b.s., of course.

If T-Mobile wants to go from 4th to 3rd, they need to cut prices. In the US, everyone who can afford a phone has a prepaid or postpaid cell phone. So, the conversion prospects are:

0. Current smartphone customers paying more than they'd like.

1. Current prepaid dumbphone customers on other carriers who want a smartphone but can't afford the data charges.

2. Current prepaid dumbphone customers looking to pay less for voice and text.

3. Current postpaid dumbphone customers looking to pay less for voice and text.

A $50/unlimited everything plan hits (0) and (1) for sure, possibly (2) if they can imagine a use for a smartphone, and maybe a few of (3). That's how T-Mob can grow their subscriber base quickly. Oprah isn't going to do it.

This seems bloody obvious to me, but never underestimate the ability of a management team to think that fancy marketing will trump basic economics.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

Agreed. Though we can certainly hope that isn't the case here, and they do actually go through with what we've been hearing.

Doesn't mean he's telling the truth or even been informed correctly. If all TMO employees had to sign a couple NDAs we won't know till someone flips the switch if any of this is anything more then speculation.

All we can do is hope that our dreams of an inexpensive plan for the Geeks of the world is really in the works and soon to be in affect. :)

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

boost already does this and you can get your BB88xx'series unlocked and have email and everything else for $50/mo.

the US market is changing and pulling a couple of good units out with contracts before it gets even more muddy financially here in the US is a good thing.

a little data birdy said that ATT will be launching a series of netbooks before christmas and that tmo will be launching 1-2 netbooks after christmas.

also, i believe that this black sumtin sumtin is more data driven then some mobile phone. tmo has a really tiny sim device that data card developers can use which helps in the design of units. lets see if this comment stirs any pots or laughters?!

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

1. The only blackberry model to work on Boost's iDEN network is the 8350i, there are no 88xx series that can work on it. Also when I say work, it's a very limited level of functionality. Due to a lack of service support on the Boost network, email and other data services were left out. Voice and (very) limited text only.

2. Yes Boost does have a $50 everything plan, but Boost Mobile only has the iDEN GSM/GPRS network with some very lacking dumb phones. There's no 3G, there isn't even a 2G, you get a max speed of about 19kb/s. If the unlimited everything includes a real internet plan with 3G and the possibility of 4G in the future AND the use of nice phones like Blackberrys and the N900, this *will* shake things up.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

I want to clarify things: in the talk I have preferred to warn people against the worst case scenario - which can well happen.

Damage to the silicon happens when the system is forced to run in overdrive mode (550&600) constantly, because of the extra voltage required by these operating points.

Tampering with these sort of settings puts the system out of its supported operating range.

Edit:
But normal usage is ok and only those who are planning to do 24/7 number crunching on their phone should be worried.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

Lets say I never put computer off. Including phone. I put it on AC.

Now I experience a bug, for example in Flash (as I experience such bug on Linux desktop) which uses 100% CPU. On desktop I not even notice since the thing has more than enough resources (quad core etc).

Now my phone is in 500/600 range whole time, correct? Is this dangerous?

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

According to TI the OMAP3430 features the "TWL4030 is the optimized all-in-one audio and power manager" and "TI's SmartReflex™ power and performance management technology" which has "Sensors that adapt voltage dynamically in response to silicon processes and temperature variations." In any case, if this is built like regular CPU's it should have a temperature threshold, when this threshold is reached it should shut down to prevent any hardware damage.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

After doing a little research, I discovered some things you guys might be interested in. I was curious as to why you guys kept mentioning 500mhz as a max when Wikipedia mentions 600mhz, so I started looking for links from TI to back up that speed. I found something perfectly fitting. :)

http://www.spinics.net/lists/linux-omap/msg13152.html

In adition to mention the max clock speed of the TI OMAP3430 as being 600mhz, I specifically love this part:

Looks like even if someone *was* doing full 24/7 number crunching at 600mhz that the CPU could hold up as long as it didn't overheat(which we can't guarantee)

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

It's not only about heat. It's about the operating voltage. The value required damages the silicon. Of course the expected lifetime of the device is where the discussion should focus.

Which one of the components will fail first?

Ideally you don't want them to have too different lifetime and using the CPU locked in overdrive mode will definitely shorten its life.

Up to the point that, toward the end, it will not even function at lower voltages.

This doesn't apply to every unit, but we have to consider field failure rate and come up with margins that do not get it out of control.

Like in any other processor, some units support higher clocks at the same voltage, but we refer to nominal values.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

If Project Black is a low cost plan, Wal Mart beat them to the punch http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...-64206872.html. This should pressure all carriers to be more competitive on price.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

interesting, but from what I see this does not include 3g.
Even so, does anyone know if it would work with the N900?

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

Too bad it the Straighttalk plan is on the Verizon network so the N900 can not be used.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

It would appear given the way that Egadget wrote it, only a few phones will even work with these plans. And yes it's only "mobile web" not 3G, not even full internet.

http://www.engadget.com/2009/10/14/n...storm-walmart/

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

http://media.boygeniusreport.com/wp-...dark-slide.jpg

so this unlimited plan stuff might be true

http://www.tmonews.com/2009/10/proje...ees-the-light/

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

@mykency: Mad props for getting the forum back on track and keeping the info current.

As for the actual factual info. This all means little, everything we had before is still speculation, though it does prove there is a new plan or plans comming out for T-mo that will be "The Most Affordable Unlimited Rate Plans" presumably on the US market. Which would likely mean 60 or lower.

This certainly gives hope and by the sound of "The Handset You Crave" there may very well be subsidizing, though still no mention of the N900.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

It have to be the N900 i mean what other device has not been mentioned already we know about the Blackberry 9700, we know about the Cliq and the Samsung is nothing special . Also many people who know about it say that we already know the answers because most leaks are correct including the N900.

Even when i mention the N900 to my manager he just smirks and say i cannot tell you.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

I'm trying not to let excitement get the best of me, but dammit, it's sounding more and more like the N900 will come from T-mobile with a killer plan.

Arg! with my whole family on AT&T...

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

I really wonder (if they do this) how they are going make a profit if they subsidize the n900 AND do a cheaper rate..

And it's also annoying me because now I kinda wanna wait till I get more news from them before deciding whether to buy it from Amazon and then buy their plan. Or to just get it from them.

Though I wonder.. do you have to pay tax when you buy a mobile in store?

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

yes but even with the EIP you can stretch it out over the course of 20 months so in a sense it will cost little to nothing.

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

EIP? (googling didn't turn up anything helpful)

Re: Big announcement coming soon from T-Mobile ; Project Black to shake things up?
 

Installment basically like say its subsidized 299 you can break down the payments unto your bill for 20 months thats suppose to be the new eip the old/current one only lets you for 3 months