Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

What facts? How can you be sure that they were not bluffing, just to trick "the community" into taking over their responsibilities?
The server was supposedly paid till end of 2012, but surprisingly it was still up in mid-January 2013. Hmmm...

I am not saying that it isn't end-of-life - it was end of life at the very moment when they made the deal with Microsoft.
But I am also saying that they would not dare to switch off the repos - not before the community agreed to take over the burden. Which was BTW a great deal for Nokia, so it comes as no surprise that they even founded you the new server, because it is still much cheaper for them.
My point is that I don't quite understand why I must be tankful. I paid them lots of money for the phone and they do me no favor to keep the repo servers running,. and knowing the business, I'm quite sure they would have kept it running, if nobody had volunteered to took it over. So yeah: thanks for doing me the favor that I haven't asked for! :)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Would you take the risk? I wouldn't.

Especially given the previous Nokia track record (supl.nokia.com not working on N900's since forever, maemo.nokia.com shut down more than 1.5year ago, ovi files shut down with a month's notice, autobuilder/wiki down for months etc.)

BTW the reason it was running mid-January was that the migration was underway, and they accepted to keep it running until the move. The tmo invoice was expiring 20/01/2013 and we moved out on the 16th.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

I don't know if I would have taken the risk. I haven't spoken to them in person so I cannot say how likely it was that they were just bluffing.
But I know that until Nokia was responsible for the repos, the servers were up an running fine. And I also don't believe that they would have founded you the server without an actual business case. So what was the business case, if not a way of saving money?

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

I mean guys, since we have to use mirrors anyway and none of you sees an issue with that, why not to let Nokia shut down the servers, if they will, and just switch our phones to the mirrors? And eventually move the forum to some other domain...
At the worse case, assuming that they did switch off the servers, wouldn't the final effect be quite the same for an end user of their phone?
if you don't know if its a bluff - why not to call it? :)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Like the way you are applauding yourself. :p
At least one is taking you serious :eek:
While unhiding from your 'rock of untold wisdom',...
Well, still it is just a rock you were proud of hiding behind. :cool:

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Sorry - no speaking your language.
If you have something to tell me, you will need to express it in a way that I would be able to understand.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Piotr, you seem to be new here, and you are bringing up the topics that were discussed here over and over in detail over the past few months. If you just bought your N900, I'm sorry for you. If not, you're embarassing yourself a bit.

@Admins and Moderators - Guys, this thread reminded me of some interesting lecture I once watched online (that is only one of many out there on the Interwebz, but I found only this one right now) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=-F-3E8pyjFo . I think it could be of great use (well, I would expect a moderator to have a bit of knowledge on the subject of keeping the community clean of derailers, in the end moderator is someone like the policeman in here :P)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Oh, that's nice, but don't be sorry - my phone is probably older than you ;)
I'm just saying that Nokia wouldn't dare to switch off the repos, and you agreeing to take over also took over some responsibilities, so don't tell me now that I should beg you to put them back online.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Despite people posting exactly that, several times, AND having it all detailed in the top post on this thread.

And then, in some sudden miracle, rather than shut up in your ignorance of what's happened, you proclaim to "know" all kinds of things, including:

And you know this how?

I was on Council. I spoke to those at Nokia and at the companies running the servers. I know that before we had step one done on setting up a backup and transition plan, the server shut-off time was set in stone. The date for them to turn off equipment was extended by the company running it because we asked them, politely, and showed we had a plan in place to transition which was already well underway. Had we not, it would have simply been shut off and discarded, like many other services that are now gone (like scrathcbox).

My proof is direct talks with people in Nokia, as one of the contact points with Nokia and the service providers. What's your proof? None. You're full of opinions, and have NO facts to back up anything you're saying, other than your "knowing" things that you clearly have no understanding of.


Tell you what, if you don't like it, we can fix that. We'll just place an IP ban in the firewall for your posting address. That way you can act as if Nokia had just shut everything down, as planned. Then you don't have to worry about us doing you any favors.

As for the mirrors: Those hosting the mirrors right now have limited bandwidth and resources. Handling the small load of users that are being extra careful not to pummel them without need is one thing. Handling everyone in the community for the long haul is quite another. And that's not even counting all the non-community N900 still out there.

I for one haven't switched either of my N900 to the backup repos, because I don't need to. Both are set to do monthly checks, but for now everything I need is on the device. I suspect lots of people in the know still haven't updated to the temp repos yet, because they don't have the need right now and don't want to strain that resource. As they find need, the user resources will likely not be enough.

You're so full of answers for someone who has no idea what's going on. And yet, despite seeming to know it all, you're not willing to do a single thing to help out. No contribution, no thanks, nothing but moaning and whining. There's a word for people like that: Leaches.

Take your self-centered drivel elsewhere. We have work to get done.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

professional experience.
let's say that I used to work for them... :)

personal advise: never throw treats that you are unable to fulfill. it makes you look week..
and also, why wont you learn some manners? :)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Lol... You're far from professional. You can't even tell the difference between a community and a support site. Anyone reading ANY of your past posts, in this thread or others, can see that.

I doubt you've worked for Nokia, ever. And even if you had, Nokia is no longer what it once was. I've worked at Xerox and Kodak, and have seen first hand what happens when companies implode. Services and support are generally the first things to go.

Regardless: You're ignorant of the facts of the matter. The services were paid for on contract with an external provider. The termination of those contracts was set before any transition plan was in place or presented to them. The service providers had already started to spin down when we approached them (and Nokia) about a community run system.

Believe whatever make believe you want in your head. Reality is reality. Your thinking otherwise won't change that.

Welcome to my ignore list.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Listen, T*****AD!
Nokia switches off servers whenever THEY want - like the Akamai server farm for repositories (several 100 machines), WE are offering you backup servers like skeiron some of which I pay for from my own pocket. Meanwhile we're all waiting and watching for *Nemein* (paid by Nokia to do the migration and hand stuff over to community) to establish and debug a completely new hw-setup tailored to somewhat fit what we, the community, could afford. repository.maemo.org been tested before we asked Nokia to switch the DNS to point at it. We neither control the DNS (yet) nor do we have any control over the server farm and when it got switched down. You're asking for us to continue operating the Akamai serverfarm? Sure, give us the MONEY and MANPOWER to do so, and we'll happily do. [insert some other swearwords here]. I guess some 20000$/month might suffice. See http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=88222 and STFU!
I'm spending some imaginary infraction points on you, if that matters to chemist. Honestly, you are a disgrace

Best Regards
jOERG

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

I can bet that not anyone...


Actually, I said "lets say..."
All the western companies are the same - trust me.
You don't really need to work at Nokia to know what Nokia "thinks".


Yeah I believe that is how you got fired. But you know, IMHO the first to go are people without skills. :)


I'm just saying that they were bluffing to lure you into taking over responsibility for the servers... And you it took over... but now, instead of fulfilling your obligations, you are showing to me why you got fired from a customer support...
Really, don't get it on me - I swear that it wasn't me who fired you!

But to be honest, I would have fired you, if I only had chance, seeing that you supporting skills are completely non existent. :)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Yeah - Nokia is God and they do not respond to anyone...
I believe you :)

Why wont you try with less swearing next time, if you want me to take you seriously?
I mean, I understand how fighting with a server for a second week can be frustrating, but don't take it up on me, man - like it was my fault that you cannot make it work :)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

static.maemo.org seems to be down so no CSS on any page except TMO.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Thanks for gracefully switching back to topic!!!;)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

In my 15+ years of corporate work, I've never been fired. But again, believe whatever fiction you want. Seems to be the Polish way...

Fact of the matter is, we are where we are. Help out, or shut up. Whining serves no purpose. Done.


Just out of curiosity: Is every guy named Piotr (Peter in Polish) an äss-hat? Or is it just the same guy, with multiple accounts again? :rolleyes:

PS: To the tagger... awesome tags. Will follow that advice now. ;)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Hmm... I'm getting pages just fine. May have been a small glitch? :confused:

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

I rebooted FW just a ~2h ago, just in time before access via ssh became impossible. Our new wizard maemo sysop Falk tweaked some setting on same FW a few minutes later, which I hope will take effect from now on. I dunno if Nemein likes us messing around with their FW setup, but since we can do (since 2 days or so), we did. Will ask Eero about his take on that, tomorrow.

cheers
/j

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

{woo hoo}Go Rochester. I don't believe arguing is better than constructive criticisms in light of what is happening. I thought i was the only person in Rochester with a N900 :eek:

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Could we ever set up all our phones to run torrent files, maybe in a background program? So people that want a particular piece of data would not be so dependent on one up to date source. Also reducing the cost of maintaining the community, among other things?

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

maybe the css is still on port 81? makes probs for some people behind firewalls ...

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

I was thinking to some similar solution.. Maybe designing a cloud-system for this purpose (I don't know if it is only a fantasy dream).

@ the experts: I'd like to know the amount of data we are speaking and the supposed traffic.

For example: repositories 10GB, 1TB/month
talk 30GB, 100TB/month..
etc...

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

cloudflare.com is quite useful for this - and it's free, if you don't need ssl.
and there are probably other services providing similar functionality.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

just a factoid to throw in here; the backup service we have is holding onto 1.3TB of data...

So not 10GB to be put in cloud ;)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

There was discussion of doing just that. In the end, it may be what has to happen. But I'd still rather see a public repo setup, even if that repo moves.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

I remember similar distributed repository discussion in some desktop distro (Ubuntu/Debian ?). A good point was made that you are actually indirectly telling the swarm that you have outdated libraries. An attacker just needs to wait for an update for a remote exploit to come down & all the swarm participants that are requesting it before they manage to install it. So this would have to be addressed somehow. :)

Still, a trusted central repository just doesn't have this issue.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Has anyone heard of bit coins? It claims to be an unhackable form of currency trade. I would think secure data transfer would not be an enormous hurdle if some one were to apply a similar framework.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Thank you for the link. The hole dynamics of this situation is pretty interesting.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

~2h ago we enabled repo
It's slow but improving, due to 2000+ devices leeching full packages.gz at a time.
I hope for this to change once all devices have cached the current file's version.

cheers
jOERG

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Looks like lists.maemo.org went down around the same time. They on the same link? :( Hopefully it's temporary.

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Thanks for all the hard work guys :)
I'll wait up 2-3 more days, so the server can take breath before doing my first update for 2013 o/

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

since last night I seem to have access to most repos again - many thanks to all who contributed!

But this still does not help me, my N900 reports after apt-get update that some certificate has expired, and advises me to just du apt-get update again - the reported key as expired is No. 1349249546.
What can I do about this?
(Please forgive me if this is a silly question.)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

thanks everyone for your hardwork

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

rm53,

The expired certificates are from the official Nokia repos i.e. downloads.maemo.nokia.com; nothing can be done about them other than ignoring them ;)

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Hey, it's me again! :p

And yes, uuummmh, the CSS is still on port 81.

And yes, I'll repeat this message until you bann me! :D

Cheers and thanks a lot for all your time and works! I'll donate more this evening!

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

fixed. For some reason the VM been up but unresponsive. ->reboot
Thanks!
/j

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

I still cannot access the repos but it's ok, no harm done.
We can wait few more days untill everything goes back in order.

: )

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

It's slow, but you know what, repos are up! That's a great first step in getting all this infrastructure fully community run, imo. Thanks to all involved, again!

Re: [GENERAL NOTICE] Service Downtime
 

Hi all,

Can someone give advice on how to access to 'https://maemo.org/packages/' ?

I cannot logging anymore (looping on asking the password), and there is no reset password link ...

A++