Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

What exactly do you need me for? To repeat what i said before it was cool to tell and everyone called me troll?
You can blame market, you can blame users, you can blame anyone, but probably the main problem is that they did things wrong.
I explained why and when not one time. But I hate it that when i say stuff that is not positive but turns to be true, people call me troll. I know it's related on how I tell it, but the point is that I'm tech guy and I think it's not about what words exactly you choose but the meaning.

So if anyone feels good about calling me troll to ignore the problems, I would take it :)

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Hear!

It is sad if they fail. But not really end of the world.
I will not blame them (Jolla) for the effort whatever goes.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Yeah, that's right! Get rid of all the engineers, all the finance people, all the marketers. Just do what you can asap to plop a tablet into the hands of everyone who ordered one. Of course, the fact that the device will not have any support and new features never added because there isn't anyone left to do that kind of work doesn't matter... ;)

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Seriously??? That's all you care about? Your tablet? Even without 3G?

Customers always take the hit. That is sad reality. Look at all those customers stranded abroad when the tour operator who got them there folded. You not getting your tablet or me being left with a phone with no future updates is nothing compared to a family with three small children stranded on Ibiza nad having to find their own way home.

Jolla has tried. They have not made aa big a hole in the world as we had hoped but blaming them? No way. I take my hat off and bow to them. I may mention a thing or two where I think they made a mistake but that does in no way diminish my respect for them.

I still hope this is only a temporary setback although it does not look good.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Yeah, sure. The nonexistent finance manager will pay the factory to ship the tablets to the nonexistent employees at the fulfillment center. You'll then get an e-mail invite from the nonexistent support employees, which you will fill out and return, which will then be read by the nonexistent fulfillment employees, to ship your package out to you. Of course, when you find that the display is cracked (which should have been caught by the nonexistent quality control people), you'll then have to ship the tablet back to the nonexistent support folks to have it fixed.

In short, getting rid of people is tantamount to shipping nothing at all.

Man, their engineers are going off to work at other companies. There _is_ no comeback from that. (Just think Nokia if you really need a concrete example...)

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

That never happens in the corporate world. Instead, the captain tells the crew and passengers to remain calm, and that everything is just fine. Meanwhile, the captain is busy searching for the nearest lifeboat to get the hell out of there before the ship goes down.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

I think quite a few good things came out of Jolla, the HADK is pure and utter gold and the amount of work that went into it is amazing. Also much of the source code is reuseable. Its brought Mer a long way.

Maybe this community will actually take whats there and make their Utopic OS, and not be dependent on companies like Jolla. Maybe a rebirth of Hildon, I remember w00t creating a desktop prototype in QML.

We currently have everything we could ever want in terms of technology, libhybris so we can base on any android device, and maybe Sailfish with a different kind of frontend.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Just in case I wasn't clear.
I would rather not get the tablet as opposed to Jolla going bankrupt, or, in my opinion, having to lay off people.
Heck. I would put whatever I can once again to help them continue.
I have lost job before to let other people in, and I would do it again.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

For what it's worth, the latest Jolla community meeting log is quite interesting to read:

http://merproject.org/meetings/mer-m...14.30.log.html

In the latter half or so, Stskeeps describes a potential move to a Qt-style dual-licensing scheme for the Sailfish OS, and then the topic moves to dealing with the worst-case scenario; what could be done to keep devices running, and allow community support for Sailfish, should Jolla close its doors. Also, the next meeting has been moved up to next week, given the current circumstances...

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

on desktop it is because X11 and nvidia, intel, ati GFX drivers sucks both open and closed drivers that is.

My Lenovo at work constantly fails GFX glitches and dual screen problems and so on :mad: Just came home from work. Three times this day my work was interrupted by this ****ing messy X11/xrandr/gfx shitness.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

I am not surprised. As stated already it is bussiness that means income is needed.

Smart raise the price same day as above announced. Maybe some supporters buy one if they had not seen the price was dropped below last week.

http://shop.jolla.com/eu_en/cat-jolla/jolla-1.html

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

I'm wondering if I should buy a second Jolla phone as a spare part in case everything goes south with Jolla Ltd and my current Jolla phone gets broken.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

It ain't over 'til the fat lady sings....

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

She's down the cake shop

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

It was over when Marc left. It would be like Bill leaving MS or Steve leaving Apple to find new opportunities, those people don't leave a promising company or one that still has fight.

A true shame, I was in Helsinki and had a great weekend but as my Jolla has been in a boot loop with no help form them I they lost my custom. Sailfish 2.0 was a year too late and much as I tried I could never get ordinary people to see what the phone was about.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Like this one? ;)

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

I actually contributed, and to the follow-up. So if anyone goes to Greece. You can pick up a bottle of Ouzo ;)

Seriously. I just twitted Jolla to convert my order to donation. Not much, but ... I hope they will continue.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Well, I paid extra for the 64GB model, I paid extra for the latsu case. Maybe Jolla should offer some other accessories, at a slightly elevated price, to keep afloat. I know! Many folks complained about the lack of this. How about a charger for $75. If everyone bought one, would that be a sufficient lifesaver to toss them to keep from sinking?
Seriously, how much money do they need raise to continue?

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

With 10-12k orders, each would have to order 0$ cost accessory for 50$ to give them another month, financing a company for return is a bit different order of numbers than IGG/KS

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

I suggested long ago they should sell T-shirts etc, easy money.

I wonder what happens with the Lastu case now? Do we get that bad boy as a little trophy of failure?

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

naa, but it would raise interest from investors, of course!

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

All my computers run funtoo (desktop, laptop, laptop at work) with multiple screens and I'm on latest SW. I barely have problems. Some people pay for monolith choice and when they let others to choose for them the technology.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Sure, on TJC also are calls for IGG/KS, but finnish realities mean they would need to sell something (maybe selling support would work), but again, they got 2 mil for a product, doubt similar level of funding is possible even if they went around the limitations of no 'gifting/donations', which is 1-2 months realistically. Investors would need to go in for a year (or actually couple, return on investment in a year with Jolla seeing how MS is faring in that regard... yeah). Still think the conspiracy theory of investors willing to put money in in exchange for something Jolla is not willing to give them seems probable (putin! putin!! putin!!! or NSA/Mossad, add the bangs yourself)

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

I did a lot more on that when I had some spare time over summer. I should really get it into a demoable state someday :)

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

While I guess many community members would be willing to get without the tablets they backed if it helped Jolla to get over the current crysis, there are still many others who trusted Jolla to deliver and who could generate a lot of ill will and anger if they never get what they ordered/backed.

And I'm afraid that ill will, not delivering & loosing trust is really something Jolla might not affort at a moment when critical investment rounds & licensing deals are at stake.

Also while the amount gathered in the crowdfuding campaign is not insignificant, I'm afraid it still can't "power" an undertaking of Jollas size for long.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

*fingers cross*

there is more that I want jolla to achieve.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Hmm. I hate to say it, but yeah, with respect to Jolla's size (and aims), the amount gathered in the crowdfunding campaign is just that: insignificant. Along with the associated ill-will, much as it may seem overwhelming right now. The tablet touches, at most, ten thousand users; but a truly successful phone rollout would potentially reach hundreds of thousands of users, perhaps even millions.

If the sacrifice of the tablet project would allow Jolla to complete such a licensing deal, there'd be no question -- the tablet would have to go.

But yeah, it really isn't one or the other. If Jolla could get more funding, they'd be able to complete the tablet easily (at this point, there can't be anything other than money holding back tablet production, as they can already produce and ship completed units). And if they're already at the point where they're laying off employees, there's not much point to actually producing and shipping the tablets, is there? If there isn't going to be a Jolla in the near future, it'd make more sense to refund backers than to send them a device with no support and no future...

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Yeah, people very often underestimate the amount of resources that sustainable development of properly designed, stable, tested, documented and supported software takes.

Please let me reiterate - you are basically advocating pissing of 10000 people, with large amount of them being right in your home country. Sorry, but that still does not sound like a good idea. :)

Especially if you ever want to get (another) licensing deal - "well, we did promise something to 10000 people who gave us their money but we had to use it for something else - oh but we will for sure keep all promises we have made for this deal!" - is not a good starting point IMHO. ;)

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

I was making the comparison between:

a) Jolla pissing off 10000 people

and

b) Jolla going immediately bankrupt.

This ridiculous comparison all started off with Dave999 stating that he preferred the latter to the former, if it would allow him to receive a tablet. I simply stated that the former was preferable to the latter.

In truth, neither is possible -- Jolla will either go belly-up (and therefore fail to ship all the tablets, as is looking more and more likely), or Jolla will find some way to pull out of its current nosedive, at which point it will be trivial for them to ship all the tablets (as money is the only thing left stopping them from doing so).

So yeah, this was never a serious conversation in the first place...

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

My entire department uses Lenovo with multiple screens and yucky RHEL Desktop and we are just fine. My personal are Gentoo no problems.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

I did buy a T-shirt as part of the preorder. Maybe they should offer a I am the Last one T-shirt to go with my I am the First one t-shirt.

I also ordered the Lastu case, no idea what will happen..

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

:rolleyes: I Hey, dont blame me. ;) Not just me, but the 10000. All of them. Trust. I only stated that shipping tablets are crucial to Jolla and what it means is basically it's their top priority. Even if they have to fire all. Ship it or die trying. Only after shipment it's possible for Jolla to continue (if there is anything left).

So my point is basically what Martin asked you in the last post. And I don't think they can afford that so that's the reason behind my statement.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Who's the fat lady?

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

There is most likely penalty payments if they do not take the tablets.
Plus, its nonsense to retract the tablet now that it's shippable!.
And let's remember its jolla's most acclaimed product to date.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Um, no. Realistically, they have two top priorities right now:

a) Find more funding to allow them to maintain operations (after which purchasing and shipping more tablets will be trivial),

and

b) As was discussed in the community meeting, use whatever time and resources are left to prepare contingencies to keep the _existing_ devices up and running (this includes stable, flashable images of the latest OS versions for phone and tablet, and perhaps a start at a community-based Jolla store or other repo).

Continuing to try and push the tablet forward at this point in time is really kind of pointless. :(

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

Equally important. But what business will you do when the market lose faith in your ability to deliver. 100 millions won't help you. I have seen to many focus on the money when it's the credibility and reputation that matters.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

There was a time Apple borrowed $150 million from Microsoft and things worked out just fine for them. The problem with faith is that folks must be willing to give it.

I do not see a lot of that.

Almost like folks are happy to be proven right that a small company of what seems to be our peers in one fashion or another is failing. That's not how it should be. Not at all.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

It's just envyness ;)

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

I don't think that the loss of faith is completely adequate description.
I might have lost some faith as such, but I will continue to use my device.
Also, there is faith, from my side, that even if/when they die, they will work hard to ensure we - community, can keep sailfish alive.

Re: Discussion over the Design, Features, and Rollout of Jolla's new Tablet, Assuming that it isn't a Figment of our Collective Imagination
 

No, not all of them - not me, for instance.

Plus: Jolla must focus now on a product that sells - funding won't help on the long run. Therefore I suggest concentrating on what is unique and IMHO that is Sailfish, the OS, not any hardware (since TOH did not catch on). See https://together.jolla.com/question/...ance-to-focus/