Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

No problem, I was just wondering that probably nokians on Maemo development team could update their N900 test devices on a daily/weekly basis with the last build, and in some point they freeze the build version defining it as a Release Candidate for PR1.X. But as Nokia doesn't want to compromise with release date the this RC build is known only when the PR1.X firmware is released, otherwise there would be pressure from users.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Good thing they avoided that! </sarcasm>

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

well another rumour to add to the mix, but someone on the forums hinted they had a test release... so there is a possible chance they are testing with some of the clever dev's :D

(Again only a rumour until i remember where i found that post!)

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

and still i do find this whole we will not say anything about dates and releases a bit weird and very last century.

Look for example at another major software release that is done every year. And i think the lines of code are also there huge.. Thats the eclipse foundation (where now symbian also wants to model itself to)
They plan releases almost 1 year ahead. They never miss there target.... never.. At least from 1.0 releases to now 3.5 (last year), they always delivered right on time.

So for such a large development which loads and loads of teams (all over the world) that all need to be synced for 1 release date and they can do it. Why is it then so hard for nokia todo those things??

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2?) and its release date
 

YES! Think exactly the same thing. It is a quite a travesty that bluetooth is broken in the device. The basic stuff in a unit like this should at least work. Nokia should get their priorities straight. They should stabilize their present stuff before making newer bigger plans with MeeGo and whatever.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2?) and its release date
 

I have my share of demands for the next version, but Nokia is a big company, I am sure they can work on several things at the same time. :D

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Who do you think you are making such sensible comments here? ;)

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Getting deeply into the mastery of speculation... sorry in advance if I am repeating what someone already told here!

I just did a more detailed research on bugs.maemo.org for all bugs marked as FIXED with the Target Milestone as "5.0+", and the latest build mentioned was always 10.2010.08-XX (08 means the week and XX is the version of the build for those who don't know):

Qt 4.6.2 for Maemo got its public release at 15th Feb (week 07). Source: http://labs.trolltech.com/blogs/2010...mo-5-released/

I am pretty sure the PR1.2 will be based on a version 10.2010.08-XX, since it was the build with the most number of builds I've found, being the latest build 10.2010.08-23 the latest (Source: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9182). 23 builds within one week doesn't seem feasible...

Anyway, week 08 was between 21 and 27st Feb... @casper27 mentioned in a previous post on this thread that last FW update took 5 weeks between the build and its release. Sure this may vary depending on how the tests go, but the bug 9182 was marked as RESOLVED/FIXED at 5th March (build 10.2010.08-23 ), last Friday... so I guess they are still including bug fixes to PR1.2.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Why you little!!! :mad:

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

well would be nice to get insight of what is fully included in pr 1.2 but we know thats not gonna happen so keep checking forums . :D .

n900 route seems to have a light in the end lets see how things plan out ;)

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Eitama, I meant it a dry humored compliment - I think you are absolutely right (I even thanked you for your comment). Perhaps your response to me was also meant in the same bone dry humored sense. :)

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

I would like very much if they separate Ovi Maps package from the FW build and distribute it through apt/App Manager... That's how it is being done now on Symbian version, I don't know why it isn't the same way with Maemo...

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

but that is also true for Modest and MicroB......
Those should be apps that shouldnt be tied to a firmware release...

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

So following this reasoning, PR1.2 will not include fixes from 10.2010.10-2 (Source: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=9460), since it's newer and only been built twice (at the time of closing the referenced bug)? :confused:

While I understand your logic behind this reasoning, I fear it might not hold true. :(

Anyways, looking forward to official Qt 4.6, when PR1.2 finally arrives. :)

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Actually we can have two speculations - when PR 1.2 wud be released globally & when it wud be released in UK.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

I'd much prefer to see most of the system just distributed as .deb .rpm updates -- that's how desktop linux works?

Just like with apps (and like ubuntu or fedora) there should be multiple channels - a "stable" version which may only get rolled-up fixes -- the equiv of a PR 1.1 bundle, and perhaps another version with more recent, but tested fixes.

Why do we need a monolithic "firmware" - only reasons I can see are
- for updating the real device firmware, bootloader etc
- to provide for a faster recovery ie a complete re-install

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Ummm, the system is distributed as a set of .deb updates. If you do the OTA update, what you're getting is a whole load of .deb files. To simplify the process, most of these are hidden, and it's just the top-level maemo5 update you see (which depends on all the other updates, so pulls them in automatically).

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

you know what! I have learn't and accepted that I love being a beta tester and having buggy software. If I didn’t then why am I still buying nokia?? I play with my n900 all the time and it never gets boring. I got bored of my free ipod touch when it first came out within 2 weeks. Everything was done and too easy for me to enjoy it and play with. I love manual and not auto.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

As I mentioned on another thread we haven't seen any relevant news in the past weeks... no FW update, practically no increase of apps on Ovi Store, few new apps on Extras-Devel, etc... So we have plenty time to spare speculating in order to relief our anxiety!! :p

Some of the early adopters already gave up and sold their N900... Just the strong are surviving!! :D

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Felbutss, I am (kinda) with you! I bought the N900 knowing and looking forward to improvements - that's a big part of why its exiting. I must admit though I did not expect nor look forward to so many bugs. :)

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Look what happened a few months ago with Ubuntu update in 9.10.
A small update caused the whole wubildr and grub to crash/panic.
Nokia cannot have thousands of phones suddenly crashing due to one of their software updates. People will not listen to warnings of firmware not ready for end user release and such. Just look at all the threads on here from people who have downloaded/deleted somethin they should not have.
If Nokia released beta firmware for anyone to test this forum would just be one big HELP ive Bricked my phone thread.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

I think nokias FW updates so far are like beta's.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

I'm one of the early adopters of this device, and yet mine is still working and I still loving it. More apps more fun :D

Everything of the first generation of any Nokia devices are BETA, look at the Nokia N95-1 for example. It was a beta and yet it is still the biggest selling point of all N-series. Alot of people still buying and using it. And it is still not outdated after 4years.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Actually, I find it difficult to maintain a highly modified device while waiting for firmware updates.

I'm the kind of person that likes to flash the entire device, from scratch. Then muck around as I see fit.

That said, I reflashed before 1.1.1 hoping for 1.2, and have tried not to fill up the device until 1.2. Since that time, I have been less excited by my N900, daily. I know it's my fault for thinking that 1.2 would come out and I could resume playing, but I really didn't imagine feeling this stagnant.

A simple solution would be to just ignore 1.2 and go on my merry way, but I can't bring myself to delve deep into mod threads and scripting until I know that I won't have to redo them, or they will be rendered useless.

I do log in daily to check the forums for a "PR1.2!!!!" thread, but day after day I'm not seeing it. Kind of like my financial aid check :(

Anyways, thanks for reading the post, just wanted to share my feelings on 1.2 waiting.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

I can't help thinking that people seriously should quit whining. The N900 has been out for less than 3 months and we've already seen 3 updates (2 minor and 1 a bit larger). There's a PR1.2 update somehwere not too far down the road bringing us official Qt 4.6 and other goods.

Most people (that's my impresion, anyway) don't experience major problems with their N900s. Those that do either accept it as part of it being a brand new product, while others go screaming about how bad the device and Nokia's support is. I think they completely fail to recognize how advanced (and therefore) complicated a piece of machinery it is. It is naive to think that any company have the resources to find all possible errors in a brand new product. They'd have to test it against all possible (and impossible) 3rd party products in all thinkable (and unthinkable) scenarios. I work as a software developer, so I know what kind of resources testing requires - and my company only makes fairly simple applications, not complete pocket computer phones.

My previous phone was a SE K800 and believe me, the first few firmwares were pretty bad. I've had it white-screen (screen all white, even after pulling the battery) on me twice. After about a year and a couple of updates it finally became stable, but still it was an extremely basic phone compared to the N900.

If you want to live on the bleeding edge (which the N900 is), you'll have to accept a few hiccups in the beginning. Alternatively you could buy an iPhone and accept that you can only do with it, what Steve Jobs think you should be allowed to.

Sorry for the rant, but I felt I had to let it out. Still I eagerly await the PR1.2 update as everyone else.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

I'm waiting for this new update aswell, gonna do a complete reflash when it comes out.

N900 is superb, features are missing ofcourse which is why I still have my N95 8GB, I'll be annoyed though if I can't completely get rid of my N95 8GB within 6 months, MMS, video calling and *decent* Sat Nav software are all I need.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

I've read this thread and have some input;

I don't know Linux or Unix. I work mainly within a Windows environment, which I am proficient at. I thought it was a risk to take on a phone that runs on Linux premise, but none the less took the jump and got the N900. This first week has been a baptism of fire. Initial thoughts were that I didn't like the limitations of the device in terms of Sat-Nav and no MMS support (which has been fixed by this fine community), but through research and generally browsing the forums / downloads I have done a total 180degree flip on my opinion of the N900.

I love it.

I have seen too many people whining about lack of applications / support from Nokia. I have to ask myself what level of ignorance these people actually bought the phone with...? It's Linux based. Open Source. Do you really think Nokia are going to spend their professionals time and money to develop applications for an open source code? Do they even understand the concept of open source...? Or were they simply looking for a phone with internet....?

Previously I had an N95-2 (8Gb). I loved that phone too. Until I got this one. Primarily it was a device for my music - internet as well, with phoning people being secondary tasks. It took me 2 1/4 hours to copy my 2 continuous days worth of music from the N95 to my PC via USB. It then took me a further 1 1/2 hours to successfully delete the music and folder structure from the phone itself. I then plugged in the N900 and teracopied the entire music directory from the PC to phone in approximately 4 minutes.

I got no complaints. I love this phone. So much I have just sent my N95-2 to a recycling website. Got 120 notes for it too. I had forgotten how massively, frustratingly slow it was.

I'm now used to the lightning N900. I'm certainly not used to the OS or Xterminal or Linux command strings, but in time I'll learn. Thats what people need to do. Accept the phone for being a cutting edge piece of tech and learn about it. Nokia owes you nothing. Knowledge is free. Google is your best friend (oh, and apparently Maemo.org fits in that category too)

So.

First post.

Hope I didn't speak out of turn?!

Oh yeh, sorry, that was off-topic. Looking forward to the next firmware!!!

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Switch_, you need to stop messing with windows and install openSUSE 11.2!!!!

Learning linux is going to take you probably another few months at a minimum to be able to appreciate even 10% of the N900's genius.

Installing openSUSE is not going to be easy - but stick to it and leave stupid windows behind.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Thanks for your input rash mate, but unfortunately it comes with the territory.... Both the works one and the home one! Gaming, Photoshop and Illustrator are my tools of release - all of which are mainly Windows based. Believe me when I say that if I thought I could ever get one over on Micro$haft I would, 100%, but monopoly is exactly that. 90% of us are a captive audience and as such don't have many options available to us.

Besides, do you really think that the Mrs could ever wrap her head around command line interface and Xterminal?

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Ah I see, unfortunately I'm in a similar situation to yourself, I can't play games in Linux easily!!!!!!!

But try dual booting at home with Linux, linux is not ALL command line and these days you can do everything via the pointy clicky way. Heres a video of the OS that I use at home (not my video but similar), you realise the limitations of Windows quite quickly and realise the crap they have been feeding people.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rhg7d...eature=related

Since you are new to Linux I'd try it on a seperate non-critical PC first, you are bound to mess it up many times.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Since you're new to Linux, I suggest trying out virtualization before you dedicate a box to it. That way you can try several different distros in a week just to get a feel of it, and then start worrying about dedicating hardware for it once you're committed.

VirtualPC from Microsoft is easy to set up but usually screws up Linux installations. Maybe you can try VirtualBox.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Oh yes ofcourse, volt, try VMware Player, it's free and you can easily download a free openSUSE, or Ubuntu VM.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

My experiences with VMWare, which was a fair bit of time ago, was that it was nowhere near as easy to set up as VirtualPC. I believe the newer VMWare Player is probably much easier to set up though.

I've successfully managed to set up Ubuntu and OpenSUSE amongst other distros in VirtualPC, thanks to google. However, some of these VirtualPC installations have just died suddenly without proper cause :B

And I much prefer Windows 7.
</offtopic>

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

*cough**cough**cough* noob *cough**cough**cough**cough*......:p:p:p:p

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

+1

Linux on a my phone YES
Linux on my servers YES
Linux on my laptop NO.

I have to laugh always at my coworker that has many of those little annoyingly problems when developing on his linux based laptop...

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

<offtopic>
Windows is for closed minded people who cant see outside the vision created by some nerd M$ engineer.

For people who want PC to behave like THEY want it and DO what they want - that's where Linux kicks in.

Whenever I have to do something on Windows PC, I can't stop frustrating myself. It's soooooooo darn limited (it's getting worse with every new version)!!!

Let's be honest - Linux on desktop is NOT for everyone (unless you're ubuntu user and want only basic things).
</offtopic>

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

I hope that 4 years from now we can say the same thing about N900!!! ;)

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

The validity of this statement is:

false.

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

Nah, windows is cool. It's easy. It's all about having the easiest possible interface in a family environment. It's not for closed minded people. It's for people with children, who want to play games and go online easily, by clicking the big blue e or globe with a fox. 7 year olds have a certain difficulty with command line interfaces. Even more so when spelling is not their strong point. Windows aint all bad.

I have W7 x64 build 7600 on my gaming rig at home. It's lightning quick. I've turned off all the crappy User Account Control things too. It doesnt give me grief. It saved all my data from a borked HDD by warning me that a fail was imminent. My Mrs can even get on Facebook on it!

Now thats worth paying that kinda money for....

Re: Speculation about the next firmware (PR1.2) and its release date
 

<offtopic>

Sorry. The previous post was <off topic>

</offtopic>