maemo.org - Talk - Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Thanks, that's all I've been doing, shmerl so far has done the lion's share of maintaining the docs (I think/assume), I haven't fiddled with them heavily for quite some time now.
Just PM me your Google email address, I'll lock them soon unless there's a strong argument against doing that (I got a solid rationale why I wanted to do it, but I dont think I outlined it all).

shmerl

2012-11-30 02:59

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Note this discussion about the future of Sailfish UI:

https://lwn.net/Articles/527094/

shmerl

2012-12-04 03:24

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Interesting table of VP8 hardware decoding / encoding support:

http://wiki.webmproject.org/hardware/arm-socs

Note that at least one ST-Ericsson SoC (NovaThor LT9540) supports both. Quite a number support at least NEON, which improves VP8 decoding. I wonder if Jolla took this in consideration.

shmerl

2012-12-04 22:38

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

FYI: http://jolla.com/press/Jolla-press-r...er-21-2012.pdf

kollin

2012-12-05 04:24

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

https://sailfishos.org/wiki/Main_Page#Q.26A

Quote:

SDK Binaries
We are improving based on the feedback we have got from the community and the SDK will be available for download in early Q1 2013. Stay tuned on these shores.

;)

jalyst

2012-12-05 04:39

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Quote:

Originally Posted by kollin (Post 1301512)

https://sailfishos.org/wiki/Main_Page#Q.26A;)

It better bloody be "EARLY" Q1... :rolleyes:

jalyst

2012-12-10 05:31

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalyst (Post 1299224)

Thoughts on this?...
Perhaps we could aim to have a 1st half (or thereabouts) sent to them by about the 11th, & a final 2nd half by about the 8th.

Quote:

Originally Posted by thedead1440 (Post 1299225)

Yup I think let's just go all-in send one big doc to them by 11th Dec...The earlier the better IMO...

Quote:

Originally Posted by shmerl (Post 1299226)

Probably sending the whole thing at once won't hurt if we explain that they can take their time to review all the questions and answer what they can.

Okay so the consensus seems to be one large clump, rather than a 2nd (final) clump around Jan 8th?
(I'm away from the 15th till about the 8th IIRC...)

shmerl

2012-12-10 06:40

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

I'm OK with that.

jalyst

2012-12-10 12:38

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Quote:

Originally Posted by anthony_barker (Post 1299171)

Favorite features of n900 <SNIP>

Quote:

Originally Posted by kai_en (Post 1299176)

Have anybody asked what's the default browser rendering engine? Webkit? Or maybe Opera?

Did you guys put this in the doc before it was locked, how many times do we have to explain these things? :rolleyes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalyst (Post 1298657)

I was thinking I may lock it soon, leave it read-only (& commentable) for all with or without a direct link, & give access to those who are interested in helping with:

*Adding new content (using this thread/elsewhere, ensuring it's relevant & not already in the docs)
*Removing redundant/crap content (we must be sure of this, it's probably best to discuss here 1st)
*Answering points that already have answers (ditto)
*General formatting, grammar, punctuation etc.

Those who'd like to help can simply PM me their Google account/email* & I'd grant them access...
As for sending-off a "batch" imminently, I'm not really convinced of that, doesn't seem like a huge amount to me, I reckon Jolla/Sailfish can deal with it in one batch.
I reckon we send it in one big doc, aim for 11th Dec (2wk) or wait till new yr after most holidays are finished, say around Jan 8th? (6wk).

Night.
*if you don't have one set-up a temporary one, it's piss-easy.

Locked now, I need more people to volunteer to help please!!!
PM your Gmail address, if you don't have one create one & then I can give you editor rights.
It needs to be sent in about 24hr, & I don't have time to review/edit, I haven't reviewed it at all in the past wk+.
I'm adding those who have volunteered now....

SD69	2012-12-10 14:41

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalyst (Post 1303077)

Did you guys put this in the doc before it was locked, how many times do we have to explain these things? :rolleyes:

Locked now, I need more people to volunteer to help please!!!
PM your Gmail address, if you don't have one create one & then I can give you editor rights.
It needs to be sent in about 24hr, & I don't have time to review/edit, I haven't reviewed it at all in the past wk+.
I'm adding those who have volunteered now....

Please coordinate with Tim Samoff who is organizing maemo's coordination efforts with Jolla at the moment. Also, please note that we are currently working through a formal non-disclosure agreement with Jolla which may get us information that may not be available publicly.

shmerl

2012-12-11 07:02

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

I brushed the questions a bit. There are some new answers from Stskeeps there. Those without answers can be sent to Jolla I guess.

jalyst

2012-12-11 16:33

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Quote:

Originally Posted by SD69 (Post 1303114)

Fair point, I have contacted him (CC'd a few others) to see where to from here, TY.

jalyst

2012-12-12 16:30

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

I PM'd timsamoff, stskeeps, & the two main document co-editors approx 31hrs ago...
I'm finished with this, hopefully others will step-up & formally present it on behalf of the community.
Personally I think it's best that it comes from someone on the Council or BoD....
I take-off for work related stuff in about 48hrs & then on to the longest leave I've taken in years.
I suspect the Council/BoD have too much on their plate atm, & so can't have this ready/sent in the next few hr.
Hopefully though one or more of them will be willing to help finish-it-off within the next wk or so.
For those that wish to be made editors of the two Google docs, I can be PM'd at any time.
Thanks to everyone that helped, especially shmerl, who did much of the doc formatting/organizing.

timsamoff

2012-12-12 16:44

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Thanks, I'll look into this and try to incorporate some of the info in what I'm doing... I'm a bit swamped with work stuff at the moment, so it'll take me a day or so to read through the thread.

Tim

jalyst

2012-12-13 07:58

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Quote:

Originally Posted by timsamoff (Post 1303878)

Thanks, I'll look into this and try to incorporate some of the info in what I'm doing... I'm a bit swamped with work stuff at the moment, so it'll take me a day or so to read through the thread.

Tim

Thanks Tim, feel free to PM your Gmail address at any time, & I will give you complete access to the Google docs.
(Which were just recently changed to read/comment only, except for editors)

RX-51

2012-12-13 18:34

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

I'd like to suggest a hardware solution to make Jolla standout:
http://www.engadget.com/2012/12/13/y...roid-hands-on/

Of course 3ed quarter of 2013 might be too late, it could be something to tinker with!

Dave999

2012-12-13 18:56

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Quote:

Originally Posted by RX-51 (Post 1304258)

instead of two screens I think jolla should build one 6,3 full HD inch screen device and add a keybaord. As a secondary option: A disc phone.

Like this:
http://www.slashgear.com/6-3-inch-sa...2013-13260736/

jalyst

2012-12-14 03:47

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Errm, what are you talking about crazy Dave, this is the perfect thread for that sort of input...
Thanks for the useful input RX-51, editors will eventually add it to the docs, if something like that isn't already in the hardware section.

shmerl

2012-12-14 06:42

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Dual screen idea is definitely interesting. I hope it won't get some ridiculous patent, preventing anyone else to implement such setup.

One question however is ergonomics. Holding something in the palm of your hand feels good if it has enough friction with the surface. Having a glass screen there doesn't feel comfortable. I wonder how they are solving this.

kollin

2012-12-14 09:35

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Quote:

Originally Posted by shmerl (Post 1304370)

With the "dual screen" set up, the biggest problem of all will be the battery life! ;)

qwazix

2012-12-14 09:40

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

I'm sorry I'm posting this so late, and I don't know if it has been already asked, but I have a question regarding licensing of Qt applications. Normally a developer is required to obtain a commercial Qt licence to be able to commercially distribute Qt applications. Nokia, as owner of Qt, had made a special exception for mobile applications in order to boost their "ecosystem". Will this exception still be valid? What about possible future tablet sailfish hardware?

Dave999

2012-12-14 18:53

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

You don't have to pay as long as long as you follow the rules.

http://qt.digia.com/Product/Licensin...se-Comparison/

are you a business?

MartinK

2012-12-14 20:25

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

They are keeping the LGPL license for Qt, so nothing changes in this regard.

qwazix

2012-12-14 21:25

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Ok, didn't know that you could create closed source if you link dynamically. So that covers it. Thanks guys.

I am a business by the way.

shmerl

2012-12-16 01:27

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Dynamic linking is permitted with LGPL (see section 6 of the license) if you comply with details about the distribution. I.e. you should not prevent reverse engineering for example and some other details. See:

https://www.gnu.org/licenses/old-licenses/lgpl-2.1.html

jalyst

2013-01-01 16:23

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Sooo I've been away for about 18-days & it seems very little has happened in this thread...
Is the Council/BoD still planning to submit this community feedback/dialogue to Sailfish(Jolla)?
I've had no requests for full access to the docs yet, ofc this isn't imperative if you just want to copy/paste to another medium, reformat, & formally present that.
But it's still handy in order to use them as live & ongoing base/draft docs, which can serve as the basis of a formal series of Ideas/Qns, & Concerns/Criticisms.
I realise there's more pressing matters, but this won't take lots of time to finish-off & maintain going forward.

Akkumaru

2013-01-01 16:35

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

You mean the questions weren't sent to Jolla? I've been waiting to get SOME answers (that weren't already answered)!

cvp	2013-01-02 09:40

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Hardware: your device has a status LED RGB?

Software: it is in the final OS Sailfish Low Power Mode Screen Supports?
If it has not. We will have access to the OS to make it to intigrieren itself?

timsamoff

2013-01-04 02:02

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Please view the Hildon Foundation's formal letter to Jolla:

http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1310696

This is a starting point. Please don't forget about this thread, as it will become crucial during future talks with Jolla, as well as other potential Hildon Foundation and maemo.org sponsors.

Thanks,
Tim

jalyst

2013-01-04 07:11

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Thanks Tim, better than nothing, & an okay start given that we're only now familiarising ourselves with them...
Hopefully we can eventually ramp-up to much more community content being raised in frequent emails, or whatever the dialogue medium.

shmerl

2013-01-06 05:15

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

News that potentially affect Jolla's alliance with ST-Ericsson:

http://translate.google.com/translat...cle3608010.ece

I hope this won't disrupt any of their plans to release the first handset.

jalyst

2013-01-06 08:13

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Sigh..............

mikecomputing

2013-01-06 17:06

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

micronokia buys out stericsson.....

Dave999

2013-01-06 17:07

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Sigh.........

jalyst

2013-01-06 17:12

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikecomputing (Post 1311580)

micronokia buys out stericsson.....

What!?! :eek: :(

Dave999

2013-01-06 17:26

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalyst (Post 1311585)

What!?! :eek: :(

He is trolling.

shmerl

2013-01-06 22:57

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

I don't think it's known yet what happens to it. But if it falls apart, Jolla will have to look for new partners, and it's a potential setback.

jalyst

2013-01-07 04:32

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

I wish we could send more of the stuff we've gathered but in my PM exchange with timsamof; he explained that Council/BoD felt it's too early to approach them with most of those qns/ideas & concerns/criticisms, & that any exchange with Sailfish(Jolla) would centre around the mail-list (not TMO) anyway :-/

Dave999

2013-01-07 06:04

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms

It's becouse jolla don't answer questions. It doesn't matter if we send dem now or later. We won't get any official answers. What we can hope for is an jolla employee with courage en enough to find the questions and answers them but the chances are still very slim.

Mybee we should ignore jolla and try to answer the question by ourself? At least we have the answers even if it will take a while.

Jolla is unliked.

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