Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

To be honest, I don't know what this thread refers to. The cnet link never specified whether they mean Harmattan or "true" MeeGo, probably don't even know the difference. A lot of people in this thread don't seem to make the distinction, or even be aware that there's one.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

You cite Quim, then gloss over his comment that Harmattan is not MeeGo. A little intellectual honesty, please.

EDIT: it looks like there's a semantics issue at the root of this confusion, and Nokia is not helping. My apologies for adding to the confusion.

Harmattan is not technically MeeGo-- it is "MeeGo" by branding only. Maybe that version should have quotes around it officially... :rolleyes:

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

harmattan/maemo 6 is just re-branded MeeGo
its not real MeeGo that can be run on anything which is the aim with the real MeeGo distro
MeeGo will use RPM and run on both Atom and Arm
this thread was about the version of MeeGo coming after harmattan
MeeGo will get a developer version on n900 and that is not harmattan

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

So has Quim stated that Harmattan is not MeeGo?

Whilst Peter Schneider is stating that Harmattan is MeeGo 1?

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

You are talking about intellectual honesty? Really?

Anyway, I replied to a comment that Maemo 5 cannot be upgraded to meego (AKA Harmattan, AKA maemo 6) because of different packaging system. I corrected the poster to inform him that the system that adopted the meego name for marketing reasons will use the same packaging system as Maemo 5, therefore he needs to find another lame excuse. Then you butted in for no apparent reason.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

No, it is not. Quoting from the article: "The first MeeGo device is targeted to be released during the second half of 2010."

Which operating system will this device run? Harmattan, or "the version of MeeGo coming after harmattan"?

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

FWIW, what Matan says was also my recollection of the events. I.e. that Harmattan/Maemo6 would be renamed to Meego for marketing reasons, and keep the .deb format. Releases following that would include the .rpm transition.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

well thats where nokia are confusing everyone then by talking about 2 versions
the version coming to n900 is MeeGo not harmattan, it will be in MeeGo repos at the end of the month and its being compiled to run on Atom and N900.
harmattan is not going to run on Atom so thats solved which version is being worked on for N900

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

It's obvious that, in this case, Nokia IS contributing to FUD. Harmattan is MeeGo and yet it's not.

This is getting ugly.

(I updated my previous post)

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

the first meego device targeted to be released during the second half of 2010 won't run harmattan afaik. that also answers the question, if the n900 is getting meego (harmattan).

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

The bit I got confused over - okay, sorry. misread your message. I read it like you'd said Quim had commented that Harmattan was not MeeGo. Hence my confusion.

Mistaken, as you've shown. cheers.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

!= means the opposite of "equals". Harmattan really isn't MeeGo. But then again the APIs is should be close enough to call it an "instance of MeeGo" or something. The motivation of _calling_ Harmattan MeeGo was to get marketing behind one brand.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

Welll... he did say that (=! should have been !=, but it means not equal either way), which is the problem. But again, this appears to be a technical interpretation vs a marketing interpretation.

This debacle is making me nuts. :mad:

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

But, wait, you have not reached the bottom of it, Intel calls Moblin 2.2 MeeGo just as Nokia calls Maemo 6 MeeGo, bringing the number of identically named, but technically different MeeGo's we're talking about to three. We have a Marklar on our hands :)

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

Cripes.

Looks to me like MeeGo needs additional qualifiers to clear this up.

MeeGo Netbook 1.0. MeeGo Mobile Computer 1.1. MeeGo WTF Plus.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

You forgot all the MeeGo UXs (netbook vs handheld) and all the different vendor productised MeeGos. For the majority of people UI = OS and they will be very confused.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

This is the I told you so part :)

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

I knew I thanked that for a reason.

Looks like we found you a platform, Mr. Council Candidate. :D

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

It was said that Harmattan will be Debian based, so here's how I interpret that:

Harmattan isn't step 5 of 5. It's step 4.5 of 5. Or, maybe, it's step 5 of 6. Oh, I don't know. I think my hair is turning blonde.

But until someone puts a MeeGo version number on Harmattan, the confusion won't stop, so I'll do it:

Harmattan == MeeGo .8

And it shall be written, that no matter how brief, that MeeGo will also be Debian based. And it shall be the Über handheld/netbookthingy GNU/Linux 'cause it will also support GTK. And throughout the land, everyone will have a pony and will live happily ever after.

My work here is done.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

I've read it somewhere, just can't find where at the moment, anyway, Harmattan is MeeGo 1.0.

Unless your == means something else a la != :-)

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

if it helps anyone (MeeGo/Harmattan/Maemo6 confusion):

http://wiki.maemo.org/What_can_we_re...n_features_.3F

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

Put this MeeGo support in perspective:

- From unstable to stable, if MeeGo doesn't make developers happy it will never make users happy. Developer happiness is a requird milestone no matter what.

- Leaving aside the Nokia-centric perspective, if MeeGo doesn't make users happy by own merits it will give a hard time to device vendors making happy their customers. So again user happiness is basically a milestone for MeeGo no matter what.

Sure, still this doesn't answer the question of Nokia's Harmattan official support and Nokia proprietary apps, but maybe these two axis help you figuring out worst case scenarios.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

Intel did pull their Meego titled netbook download. Right now there is no Meego distribution in the wild. Instead of using "!" (not) maybe we should use "~" (approximately) and entitle Maemo 6 "~Meego-N" and Moblin 2.2 "~Meego-I".

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

You're right, I think qgil says it here:

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

I'd **** bricks if they spend more resources in unifying the branding elements of MeeGo than actually synchronizing the technical aspects of it.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

Hi, I'm grateful for the reply, and don't really want to get into an argument at all, and even with a sentence that is generally a prelude to an argument, I'll just pose a question if I may.

With the N900, I would take this site as ample evidence that developers are very happy with Maemo 5. So I think that milestone has been achieved. Now how about the end user?

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

Wow, I stop reading for a few hours, and there is already a ton more posts.

To clarify some points to my post.

I never said MeeGo was based on Fedora, only used Fedora in a comparison to upgrading from a Debian base.

Harmattan is just the release name for Maemo 6, Even if they decided to dump Maemo and go with MeeGo, Harmattan was just a release name. For example, Debian Squeeze 6.0, or Ubuntu Lucid Lynx 10.04.

MeeGo, as per their insistence, is RPM based, and so Harmattan, being debian Based (at least that's what they're still saying, right?) would be the next logical choice for our updates.

Unless we're just getting Maemo 5.1.2 or whatever they do their internal versions as.

I've been around Linux for a very long time, and even in the Windows world, you know there are code names for releases. Longhorn became Vista, etc.

If Maemo truly worked like Debian and wasn't tied into the hardware as much as it was, you could theoretically just change /etc/apt/sources.list to use harmattan instead of fremantle and use Maemo 6. Or in the case of the n8xx phones, change diablo to fremantle. Has anyone ever tried this? (sorry if this derails this topic, which is really been chewed to death anyhow).

So again, to clarify.

MeeGo = RPM based distribution (it's own flavor (flavour for the UK crowd)

Harmattan / Maemo 6 = QT4.6 Debian based with some API / UI changes that MeeGo will also have. In essence, MeeGo+Debian = Awesome IMO (whether we get this update is still to be seen)

N900 = Awesome phone/mobile computer. As a side thing I thought funny, when I loaded up blueman on my Debian box this morning, it detected the N900 as a 'Computer' rather than a phone.

slaapliedje

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

it is true, you cannot "upgrade" between two different operating systems, like say from Windows XP to Ubuntu, but you can always install a fresh operating system instead, which will require some "flashing" and some "hacking" for it to cope well with any given hardware :)

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

m2cm2c- how do u know we could install meego on the n900. what specs does meego require- the nokia is pretty low powered compared to all these other htc's or apples coming out.

and you gotta understand that the software has to run the hardware- there may be limitations on the n900's design.

its pretty obvious that meego is not gonna work on the n900- and if it does it will not work effectively.

just give it up..

and get real xp to ubunto isnt exactly an upgrade is it-..

nokia you are a bunch of %$N)S

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

Considering Meego is slated to run on all sorts of hardware (at least that's Nokia+Intel's goal) then there's not much holding back the OS from being put on anything besides official driver support. I don't think it's like Windows Phone Series 7 where there's minimal software and hardware spsecs the device must have in order to qualify to run it.

Re: N900 NOT upgradeable to MeeGo
 

i dont care what OS my N900 is running as long as it gets Flash 10