Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

So what is your suggestions, not in a "they should do something" way, but actual thing they should do which would make for example Facebook port/fix Whatsup on Sailfish. You must have tons of ideas as you seem to think it's easy and Jolla is just evil for not doing it.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

The way I see it, TMO bashes everybody all the time. As we have already seen, it is impossible to please everybody so there will always be "something not good happening around Jolla" no matter how or what they do. If something is not delivered "on demand" at once, it is interpreted as "it will never happen". If something is not going to happen, it's "wrong" no matter reasons behind decisions. Much of that attitude is unfair towards Jolla and unfortunately much of constructive criticism is lost in that loud bashing. So for us that actually want to see Jolla staying solvent and having some patience may sometimes be hard to distinguish that "constructive criticism" from "bashing just for fun/whatever".

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

so you want two threads for the same show? To me its enough with one.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

There are no Tizen devices around and whole project seems to be more like Samsung's leverage on Google. They make absolutely no money with Tizen.

We'll see how they make in the long run. For example, Red Hat actually withdrew from consumer market because there were no business potential. Ubuntu on consumer side doesn't profit either.

Cut off Google funding it and you have no Android. Cut off funding from Jolla and you have no Sailfish OS. Difference is that Google has many other sources of income, for Jolla Sailfish OS is the core business, so if it was completely open sourced, where would that business be? If there is no answer to that question, there's no much reason to actually demand for such thing - there has to be profit somehow or there will be nothing in the long run. But of course, if you truly believe that Android is much better choice Open Source wise, then by all means go that route - as long as it is there.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

i dont want to open this thread when it have new messages and read same. i want to read only discussion about Update10 here.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

well, we have no news about U10 so ...

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

dont read the things you dont want to read. About 95% posted in this forum is not interesting to me so i simply ignore it and move on...or create a new thread if you like that. Follow you heart but use you brain to filter.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Well, the whatsapp-part works for a while but I think because of the out of memory problem I have to restart whatsapp every time after I've send a message(or received one).
That is not realy workable for me.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

okay i'll just ignore this thread and won't post also :)

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Hmm... Mosconi must be a funny guy and good making jokes if nothing isn't going to happen before XMas...
If the RC is stable so why not opt-in for us unpatient people?

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Sounds like a solid choice if you have nothing you like to say or anything you like to read.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

That's pretty much the crux of it. There are two strong camps on TMO:

1. "Jolla is the best thing since sliced bread, there is absolutely nothing they can do wrong"
2. "Jolla sucks, everything they do is rubbish"

The trouble is, when you come along saying, "Jolla is generally OK, but there is room for improvement," you get immediately attacked by both camps for being a member of the opposing one.

In my experience, members of camp 1 tend to be more aggresive. But that is no different from any other field: politics, religion, sport, music fans... I guess if people like something, they feel the need to shout twice as loud to drown not just someone else's but also their own doubts.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Sounds like Mosconi's blog post was ghostwritten by him as well :D

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

No Tizen devices? You have no idea what you're talking about. There are considerably more Tizen devices than Sailfish devices, both in terms of total numbers and SKUs, and this won't change any time soon. There are phones, cameras and watches, and there'll be a hell of a lot more next year ...

Canonical's largest efforts at the moment are in the consumer space. Firstly, working with AMD / NVIDIA and Valve to make Ubuntu, and Linux more generally, a serious alternative to Windows for gaming - as this is the biggest stumbling block for so many non-professional but still sophisticated users. Secondly, Ubuntu Touch.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Let's see ... but if one doesn't materialise, it'll seem utterly stupid on his part. The official Jolla account, bijjal, carol chen and others certainly haven't had anything to say. I suspect he blurted out something that he shouldn't have, especially when he made it AFTER the self-imposed cut off described by bijjal previously.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Awesome, where can I buy one? Oh
I heard that before

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Hey you from the middle ground, stop attacking my middle ground

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

- India, shortly, and since the first device is aiming at the ultra low end in this market, it's likely to ship a lot of units.

- Samsung Gear watches with Tizen number in the millions already.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

If you are referring to NX2000 and NX300 cameras, their firmware is derived from some parts of Tizen code. Only devices (meaning other than smartphones) using Tizen that I know of are Samsung NX1 and Samsung Gear S as Samsung Z was shelved (most likely permanently). Additionally, Tizen is not FOSS but contains many bits and pieces that are under Flora license, which is not compatible with Open Source initiative. Also SDK is closed source. In that sense you are right, there are more devices running Tizen or some derivate - just no smartphones.

It has been for some time now, which of course is nice, but money is generated elsewhere which is then used to fund that effort. Also, partnering with AMD, Nvidia and Valve is not going to be all for Open Source. All of them use proprietary technologies for their own advantage, even if they are built to be used with Linux based stuff. So, I guess we are still back where we started - FOSS stuff makes money in enterprise as there is nobody who actually has been able to make money in FOSS consumer space only. However, I do hope they succeed because I'd love to use Linux as my main laptop-OS, with or without closed source pieces. :)

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

You bring up cyanogenmod, they were also to be shortly in india and were very short, funny how that goes. So can I buy one for xmas? Or shortlier shortly? Like next year? Like previous year?

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

And as everyone has been able to see, Steam for GNU/Linux has been working out fantastically well and will certainly not be dropped or 'left in the community's hands' in the foreseeable future.

Let's first wait and see how much devices will actually be sold.

As to Tizen watches and other 'wearables': I'd be extremely surprised if, in 10 years, there will even be 'smart watches' or any of that other fad nonsense at all, let alone ones running Tizen. 2013 is going to be the year of smart watches! No wait, 2014! Actually, we made a mistake, it's 2015!

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

There are 4 Samsung Gear watches with Tizen:

Galaxy Gear (original) which was Android, but latterly 'upgraded' to Tizen
Gear 2
Gear 2 Neo
Gear S (latest)

Plenty of Sailfish isn't Open Source? What's your point?

No I didn't.

Steam certainly isn't being dropped for Linux. Far from it. Where you get this idea or impression I have no idea. They're pinning their future on it.

Millions. i.e. far more than Sailfish will have shipped in 12 months time, unless something extraordinary happens.

~3m smartwatches were sold in 2013. It'd be shocking if more than double weren't sold this year. Sales will explode in 2015, if for no other reason than Apple are launching their product. I'd be amazed if less than 25m are shipped. It'd also be pretty amazing if Samsung were not top 2 with Apple. So do your own calculations.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Oh really sorry, one of your alter egos did, because so open source it gets rekt by money, hoooah for open source and stuff
Tomi is that you? Tizen was to explode in 2014, now in 2015, from zero it will be nuclear tizen explosion. Steam consoles make so much difference, maybe steam powered nucular explosion

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Also don't forget Firefox OS - while I have no idea if or how Mozilla is making any money from it, it is certainly shipping on quite many low-end devices.

An even though I don't really like the app development concept they choose (Javascript & HTML5 only, bleh :P ), the one I got recently due to its low price (~36€) works decently and I could imagine using it as a smarter dum-phone replacement. It has no terminal emulator out of the box and there is no Python and/or Qt/QML, so it is of course totally unusable for serious usage as mobile computer. :)

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Tbh, you sound totally deranged ...

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Point is, none of the provided examples are completely FOSS but contain more or less significant pieces of closed source components, proving my original point that there are at the time (at least almost) nobody in consumer product business doing everything completely Open Source. Sailfish is mostly, open parts are:

- Mer Core
- Nemo middleware
- Most core apps

These are the parts that make up most of Sailsifh OS and by statement by Stskeeps: "default policy is to open source unless it's covered - and we usually contribute those to Mer or Nemo Mobile projects." Which IMO is pretty clear. But obviously not enough for some until every single piece of it is Open Source.

Closed parts are:

- Sailfish UI, which is the part Jolla wants to license to other manufacturers to generate income and which also contains some licensing agreements that prevent Open Sourcing it completely.
- Hardware adaptation, which they simply cannot Open Source as it contains proprietary stuff owned by others.

But for now, enough offtopic. Maybe this discussion could continue in some other thread...

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Tbh, you sound like totally deranged tomi ahonen from 2012 'next year will be the year of tizen', then from 2013 'next year will be the year of tizen', now with 2014 coming to an end 'sooooon, very shortly...', it's just not happening

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Nobody wants to release software that breaks devices. That leads to unhappy end users, and bad press.

Software releases come when there are no (or acceptable) regressions in functionality known, and upgrading has been proven to be a smooth experience with testing.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

You're somewhat right. There have been contributions from people 'outside', but they haven't been anywhere near as I would like to see.

On the other hand, the point I was trying to convey is that it always seems to me to be a bit of a chicken-and-egg problem. Contributions are few and far between because making them is harder than it should be.

And that's all I'll say about this, as it is rather OT :)

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Where are the mods? This is so derailed right now...

We have nothing to say because the thing we came to talk about is no longer being talked about! Why should this thread be filled up with off-topic stuff? The last few pages should be moved to 'general'.

This thread exists for a reason. This is not that reason.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Because we've been given no news since the teasing Tweet?

Just because there is no news on a topic, that doesn't give people free license to bump that topic needlessly with off-topic discussion.

Admittedly, this in itself has gone too meta. In the interest of the thread, I will not engage with you further regarding this.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

I'm in no rush for update till I get TOHKB for phone and Jolla Tablet. Maybe April or May?

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Has Jolla stated whether TOHKBD compatibility is coming in this update, or is at least planned for the future? As it stands right now, an on-screen keyboard will still appear even if you're using TOHKBD to type with.

If not now, I'd like to think (if only for the sake of dirkvl's sanity in his thread) that it will arrive by the time the last units have been shipped.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Oh! Now you have me worried!

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Oops, SailfishOS Update10 is available: https://together.jolla.com/question/...-vaarainjarvi/

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

The only official information we have is from bijjal, we are now less than a week away from xmas, therefore we should not expect even an opt-in update before the new year.

Since there is no more information, speculations are high.

wow, I was few seconds inpatient then!

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

Free space required: approx. 1,5 Gigabytes

Holy crap, it takes less than that to do a full zypper dup on my laptop.

Re: SailfishOS Update10 discussions
 

1,5 Gigabytes if you on u8