Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

For those in the UK I tried an adaptor on eBay from psylins described as a USB A Female to 5 Pin Mini B Plug Gender Changer. This does not auto switch to host mode but works fine when manually switched.

I tried it on a cheap Poundland USB card reader and it worked fine.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Hi all,

I'm successfully using my N800 in USB host mode with the GoldX cable kit that was mentioned in the N810 thread. (No auto-switching with this cable, either.) I picked up a cheap powered hub based on the Genesys Logic GL850A chip, which seems to work fine, and is cute as a button to boot.

The biggest problem with the hub, though, is that although it can operate in bus-powered or self-powered mode, it always reports to the host that the AC wall adapter is attached. This seems a bit dangerous--if the user connects four current-hungry devices without supplying external power, I don't see what would prevent the hub from attempting to suck 2+ amps out of the upstream port. I don't intend to ever use this device in bus-powered mode, so I'm not too upset, but I'm a little concerned about inadvertently disconnecting the AC power during heavy current draw. I could see this happening if I accidentally plug into a switched outlet in a hotel room, for example.

So, my question is--does the N800 have any sort of over-current protection? Would it damage the device to suddenly attempt to draw an amp or so from the onboard USB port?

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

The N800 will just shut off the 100mA-limited supply and stop working in host mode. You'll need to reboot to fix it. Nothing will be permanently damaged.

-Robert

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Great, thanks Robert. After reading your post, I gave it a try myself, and confirmed that an excessive current condition simply causes the musb device to shut down with a lot of vbus errors in dmesg. A reboot of the N800 restores everything to working again.

I should also share a hint about recharging devices like cell phones from a powered USB hub connected to an N800. By default, USB auto-suspend is enabled in OS2008, which causes client devices to be put into suspend mode after two seconds of no activity. Suspend mode is supposed to be low power mode, so most devices won't recharge when suspended. To disable this, change the autosuspend parameter of the usbcore module:

echo 400000 >/sys/module/usbcore/parameters/autosuspend

This changes the autosuspend timeout to 400,000 seconds. This needs to be done before any USB devices are connected.

Keep in mind that disabling auto-suspend will impact your battery life, though, so only disable it when your N800 is connected to AC power! (Or, in my case, a CA-100 cable looped back into the powered hub...)

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

For all those looking for auto-switching USB on the N800; how much interest is there in being able to purchase a "professionally modified" N800 to Female USB cable? I described my process previously about bending up the metal casing, adding a touch of solder, and heat-shrinking a USB gender-changer to make a nice clean auto-switching cable on a budget, but I know there were a few responses saying things along the lines of "'Easy' is relative if you don't have a soldering iron". If there's interest I'd be happy to mod up some of these cables and put 'em up for sale on my company's e-store for relatively cheap (a few bucks more than the cost of the cable itself and adapter). I'd also consider just splicing some cables together instead of using the gender changer, but I think in the end the gender changer with heat-shrink actually makes for a cleaner cable with better connections (since there aren't any wires that actually ahve to be spliced... those USB wires are tiny after all!).
We're based in Canada so anything beyond North American shipping costs might be a bit silly for just a cable, but I'd have to look into it.

Anyways, Yays or Nays?

-Rob

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Yays Yays Yays Yays Yays

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Rob, I have interest in that idea. One ideal cable for me would be something that stays close to the outer edge of the N800. Ideas: an L-connector on one end (or a "knuckle"); a flat cable; about 3" long (to end up at the middle of the bottom of the N800). Then, if I needed a peripheral to stay with the N800, I could dream up some way to attach it to the back.

Whadaya think?

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Probably the most viable solution out of those for that sort of approach would be something like a short 3-4" long "dongle" type of cable that could connect into the USB on the N800 and then wrap around to the back. One thing to keep in mind of course is that the USB port is only exposed when the kick-stand is lifted up, so unless you plan on permantenly removing your stand having a USB device connected while carrying the tablet around in your hand is not exactly ideal.

The "dongle" type of cable is the only one that would be fairly easy to mod up as a flat cable or "L-style" would require some plastic fab work that I'm really not up to at this point. (It's possible but I can't think of a way to do it that wouldn't put a lot of stress on the USB connectors themselves when connecting/disconnecting, so a cable is a better and easier approach).

Thoughts/responses to that? In the mean time I'll source out some parts tomorrow or Friday for a "standard" cable as I mentioned originally, so keep an eye on the forum here and I'll post up a link in the next few days.

-Rob

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Rob, I can't disagree with your preference of using a dongle type cable to begin with. Maybe someone with more cable-modding experience could offer some advice there.

You're right about the kickstand issue-- I was aware of that. I still think people could be interested in walking around with something attached and that the kickstand is just something we'd have to put up with. I could be wrong, though.

I'm eager to see what you come up with! I'm new here, but I would suggest opening a new thread for the purpose of surveying interest in purchasing your modded cables and, if it comes to this, marketing them.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Yup! Sorry about that! I've fixed the post.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Yay.

I'd buy two, and to hell with the shipping costs.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

I would go for an adapter or 3-4" dongle (like the micro B to mini B) would be best - I can keep them in a pocket or case where a longer cable tends to take up lots of space and can get tangled.

You might be able to do better with surface mount solder paste. My silver ink conductive pen also works but I would prefer something soldered.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

I've managed to find a source for a small mini-B to Female A adapter that I'll be modding up to do the OTG auto switching; should be a nice compact solution for most applications. Can't get my hands on them for 2-3 days yet, but as soon as I get them in and fixed up I'll post up a new thread.

In fact this should probably go in a new thread anyways, but just before that, anyone got votes on a short cable still? (as opposed to the adapter) The only advantage that I can think of would be that a cable would be a bit more compact for leaving attached and carrying around, but not really sure on that point...

Also, the adapter spec only says USB 1.1 but I'm guessing thats more because nobody's thought of a USB 2.0 scenario for it rather than a physical wiring limitation...

Anyways, here's the adapter to give you an idea:
http://www.electronicproductonline.c...s/usbAdapt.jpg

-Rob

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

My preference would be a dongle. If adapters are easier to modify, how about this idea:
A modified Female mini-B to Female A adapter, mated with a 3-4" Male mini-B to Male mini-B cable.

The adapter exists (wish it were black): http://cgi.ebay.com/USB-OTG-Adaptor-...QQcmdZViewItem

I'll bet the cable exists as well. With these two, you'd end up with the requested dongle, and if your peripheral is mini-B, just take the adapter off the dongle!

Can you think of a case in which using an adapter would be preferable to using a dongle?

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Check out this angled mini-B to A cable:
http://industrialcomponent.com/newnex/uhr22mbro1.html

It's expensive...

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Yep, but can you find one that has a Female connector on both ends? Unless you weren't replying to me...

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Alternatively, this dongle with 2 adapters:
1) Male mini-B to Male mini-B
2) Male mini-B to Female A (like so many we've seen)

The first adapter probably doesn't exist (recurring theme) so again I'd be looking for a short mini-B to mini-B cable. Shoot.

http://www.usbfirewire.com/Parts/rr-...-ext-06big.jpg

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

The small adapter would be preferable for travel use or use with peripherals that already have a cable. For example, if you're out and about or travelling around and want to be able to just grab some files quickly off of somebody else's USB thumb drive (or your own of course), just plug in the adapter and the drive, grab your stuff, and toss the adapter back in your pocket when you're done. The problem with a dongle is that it's easy to damage and rather difficult to carry around on a regular basis. The compact size makes it very handy, and it would work well with things like travel USB keyboards/etc as you could just leave it attached to the keyboard's USB cable and not have to worry about loosing it or having it get damaged while transporting.

On the other hand, the dongle is better for "on the go" usage; i.e. having a USB device attached while carrying the tablet in your hand, which I'm pretty sure is more what raynman is after. Biggest problem there is the cost difference:
the modded adapter is probably going to end up being somewhere between $10-15 Canadian + shipping
That mini-B to mini-B angled dongle cable itself is going to cost me $50 USD + taxes just to get, let alone mod and put back up for sale. And on top of that you'd still need something like the original adapter that we're talking about if you wanted to connect up your standard USB equipment... so it comes down to cool idea, but is it really worth it?

Raynman, I know what you're going for, and if you're willing to commit to the costs then I don't mind doing the mod on the cable for you, but I can't see many others really willing to go that far for the added bit of convenience; am I wrong?

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

yes they do have A female to A female.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

jolouis,
I mostly agree with you. The cost difference is huge. It seems the only hope for something like that would be many interested parties and a good deal on a bulk purchase. While I don't see how dongles are more easily damaged than adapters, I do see how adapters are easier to slip into the pocket on your way out the door. In my opinion, adapters are more prone to breaking when plugged into the N800, obviously since they don't flex. Truth be told, I'd find the convenience of a well-designed dongle worth more than the convenience of not having to switch USB modes in the software.

That said, being the Dutchman I am, I will try my best to fit in with the crowd and settle for an adapter for the sake of cost. Thanks for lending an ear.

--------------

nhanquy,
I was speaking of a Female mini-B to Female A adapter, like the one I posted:
http://i1.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/90/2f/c8f5_1_b.JPG
http://cgi.ebay.com/USB-OTG-Adaptor-...QQcmdZViewItem
Except in black. If someone finds one, I'd still be interested in that, alongside the adapter jolouis will be making.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

raynman,

There is B/M B/M cable

http://www.datapro.net/images/1596.jpg

for your black B/F A/F adapter.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Yep, I have that one bookmarked... someone in this gigantic thread posted it awhile back. 3-4" is my target length. Thanks for the post though.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

I'd suggest just go ahead and make some up and put them on e-bay/craigslist then see how it goes. Personally I'm fine with the command line switch at the moment, I don't have any practical use for OTG. I'd think 10-15$ shipped cost would sell.

As far as the cable IF I were in the market, I would also want no more than 5" so it would be more likely to fit in a case (which I don't have yet either).

For the person talking about walking around with something USB plugged in... you could use the kickstand to make a pocket (with any luck your USB device would fit inside it). Or you could make a case that would accomodate both devices with kickstand. I'm planning to make one to carry my Nokia, Cell phone, camera, and cables out of cardboard. You could then cover the cardboard with cloth, wrapping paper or markers to snazz it up a little. I need to buy my camera to determine size before I make the case though.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Ok, where do I send the money?

(I just read the whole thread and am exhausted. Not that I understood the whole thread, not being a handy guy with a soldering iron. But a cable that lets me plug in a usb drive sounds awesome.)

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Well, I'm interested in buying either a dongle or adapter... How about a poll:
Would you buy, if both were available for xx.xx USD each:

• Dongle
• Adapter
• Both
• Neither

Then, by tallying dongle+both, and adapter+both, you have basically a guarantee of how many people are interested in each product... and might buy it, if you're lucky, and if it does come out to that price.

Oh, and the price in Raynman's latest link is 14.50 USD. Is shipping across the border that much?
(50 - 14.5) = 35$ to ship a cable :eek:

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

I'd pay $20 for an OTG dongle or $10 for an OTG adapter.
If I got the OTG adapter cheap enough, I'd also get this:
http://www.usbfirewire.com/Parts/rr-2mbr01-ext-06.jpg
and use an applet to switch modes for my smaller (mini-B) devices that don't use the A adapter. I think that's a workable solution.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

$14.50 USD + 8.00 USD general shipping/handling + $25 international shipping charge. (and I was generalizing so I just rouneded as I figured there'd probably be some other border brokerage/etc charge thrown in there... there always is). Now keep in mind that's one cable, so additional cables would bring the overall price down, but that's still a lot of shipping costs for such a small item. I've been trying to find a local (or at least Canadian based) supplier of these type of USB dongles, but short USB dongles of any type seem to be quite a rare item (that makes sense when you think about most things beyond the Tablet) let alone ones with the appropriate connectors.

Anyways, good advice on the poll; I've started a new thread to bring the developments into light and see who might be interested in actually buying an adapter or dongle:
http://www.internettablettalk.com/fo...ad.php?t=15705

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

OK, the $25 for international shipping surprises me. Glad I don't live in CA! (Either the state or the nation :))
Yeah, it's understandable that they're rare. And even that right-angle connector is awfully long -- I'm sure a connector could be made shorter, but there's just not many devices that make people want that I guess...

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

An idea for an alternate adapter-gadget-thing: I've heard random rumors of battery-powered USB hubs before. Seems like a nice N800 accessory would be a 'backpack'; a custom case to clip under the kickstand of an N800, with a mini-usb cable and power cable coming out one end (to connect the N800), and inside a bank of, say, 3 9V batteries, the powered hub, and a charging adapter. Hours of runtime, 4 powered USB ports, and a handy brick-like form-factor (which probably would bother some people a lot more than it would bother me.) I don't expect you're interesting in fabbing up some backpacks, jolouis, hence putting it back here rather than the new adapter thread.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

yes, there are battery powered usb hubs, and rechargable usb power sources. I'll just go search zaurus forum at oesf.org as they were discussed there.

http://www.amazon.com/Cyberpower-CP-.../dp/B0002UQALQ

http://www.portablepowersupplies.co....atterypack.htm

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Well my initial success with host mode was a bit premature it seems.

Some of the time a device is detected just fine and accessed with no problems. I have a USB hard disk and hub that shows up in file manager as well as additional devices plugged into the hub.

However from time to time one of two things happen...

No indication of device being plugged in at all, including "lsusb".

Get a device unrecognised warning followed by a no filesystem warning. N800 locks up and reboots.

Anyone else seen this? OS2008 btw.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

What sort of connector/cable are you using shenson? I had a similar problem when I started out with a home-made USB female A to female A gender bender; the tablet didn't recognize things, it would bring up weird messages, and just generally got really mad. A device would work once, then not again, etc.

Went out last weekend and grabbed a proper factory gender changer and decided to mod up my USB cable for OTG host mode while I was at it, and since then I haven't had any problems with anything that I've connected: they all just work as you'd expect.

-Rob

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

The thing I've got is described as a "USB A Female to 5 Pin Mini B Plug Gender Changer" a professional looking molded factory one.

Though with the USB cable being right next to the N800 socket it does get pulled a bit so I suppose the connection could be intermittent.

I'll try a USB A female to A female gender changer to see if that helps.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Shenson:
I've done a few tests:
Tools :
- 4-5 pins soldered cable.
- 4 ports hub
- Portable battery (output:5v.Can charge the n800 with it)
- Hub power adapter
- 80 Gb 2.5 HD

* Using the portable battery to power the hd or the hub with the hd attached, made the "unrecognised device", and then the "unknow filesystem" appear, but *nothing else*.No reboot,tho.

* Using the Hub power adapter for powering the hd, or the hub with the hd attached, made both messages appear, but the filemanager opens successfully.

So: if you get both messages, but the hd doesnt get mounted, maybe the hd is not being properly powered.My portable battery doesnt provide enough juice for the hd *sigh*

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

The battery might provide enough power, but the N810 goes by what the usb interface ASKS for power, not what it uses.

BTW - the MicroCenter 8Gb flash drives they have for $29.95 at their check-outs work in host mode directly through the adapter.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

hi all! im writing this lines with my new keyboard a4tech kls-5up mini usb keyboard!works perfect with my n800!if you want a small like notebook keyboard i suggest you go and get this keyboard!! It rocks!!! i connected the keyboard with a home made usb cable!!it swithces automaticaly to usb host mode!just join pin4 with pin5 on the nokia side cable and it works!cheers all!

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

I've now got a USB A female to female gender changer which I'm using with the original Nokia cable. The result is much more reliable than the other adapter but some oddities remain.

If I plug the cheap card reader in I get device not recognised, no filesystem but no crash, no LED lights on the card reader either.

The second time I plug it in it lights up and is accessed normally.

I have a wireless USB dongle I'm also testing. With that there is no obvious effect, no message no LED nothing.

However after that nothing seems to work. The card reader no longer produces any message at all. I need a reboot to get the functionality back.

I'll do some tests to see what dmesg says later.

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Check out the wiki, USB Host mode on the N800 using OS 2008..Very easy howto.. Its so much easier than modding your own usb cable..
I followed the directions from 2nd part,Another Simple Method of setting the N8X0 with OS2008 to host mode - Status Bar Switch..
Freakin Rocks... Becareful with your adapt/usb cable plugged into nokia,
I've come close to killing the usb port...:D

Re: N800 USB Host Mode Experiment
 

Almost surely the wifi stick requires more current (much more) than the ~200ma that the n800 can provide, so, to avoid damage to the usb port, it is cut off until you reboot.