maemo.org - Talk - Jolla Tablet Refunds (latest developments)

Moreover, calling anyone troll just coz you don't like what they say is new cool thing nowadays. Everything you don't like on internet is trolling, right?

And if two people disagree with you, then it's a circle jerk :)

zenecho

2016-01-13 13:08

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZogG (Post 1494725)

So what have they done all those years?

Well I do have a Jolla phone, that I like very much, and its pretty much had regular updates since I had it. Some things are ace, somethings are still crap. As a long time Linux user Im used to those sort of problems. :)

gerbick

2016-01-13 13:51

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZogG (Post 1494725)

Maybe this is the reason.

For the record, I didn't call you a troll. But I did ask a question.

Care to answer it or will it be ignored yet again?

ZogG	2016-01-13 14:13

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by gerbick (Post 1494742)

For the record, I didn't call you a troll. But I did ask a question.

Care to answer it or will it be ignored yet again?

Mostly frustration and because i believe that more we keep silent for those kind of things they become something acceptable. As we see it gives them opportunity to repeat same mistakes again and again and get away like nothing happened.

ZogG	2016-01-13 14:31

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by zenecho (Post 1494739)

I'm not sure we are talking about same phone. I'm Linux user more than 10 years, no dualboots, no wine here as well BTW.
While 1 phone was released and it had updates, most updates were bug fixes and still we have a lot of that were not fixed from first releases. The difference with and power of Linux is that most of lacking things of it can be implemented by community. While you can do it with writing apps you miss, you can't change/fix/patch most of the important and core things of the sailfish as it's not 100% opensource and I'm not talking about blobs, like you have in Linux, where it is your choice to use nvidia driver or nouveau one or even make your own.
Lets take it further, there is no real eco system, no clear roadmap, no way to properly submit bug(question-answer forum engine is not one).
The phone you can't get spare battery, the problem with sim contacts(i assume it was related only for first revision as they kept silent on that one), where solution for battery contacts was a "piece of paper". The phone where main feature is TOH and no TOH with any functionality was introduced. I do understand that they more care about SW and not HW, but this phone is the way to show it and it was their shot in the world and they just ignored all of those problems.
As about lack of applications and option for paid ones, where there is promotion of android Apps support is stronger than promotion of creating native ones(see the problems with API and documentation).
All i get back is that underneath is real Linux, but if you need to run android Apps, why not just use android and use same chroot for Linux on it?
So basically in all those years they introduced one phone with a lot of problems and most updates were package updates and not much real changes and it still lacks common features of any system in 2015 :)
Now you would say privacy and security, while you do not know how and why they use your info (you can't update without Jolla account don't you) and what about 0day vulnerabilities we had and waited for next scheduled update to get then fixed? Is it Linux way?
I would remind you that android, ios and even PlayStation 3/4 are based on Unix system, but are they so open?

gerbick

2016-01-13 14:33

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZogG (Post 1494744)

It's the newer ways to try to get over that concern me more. Watching Jolla closely over the din of this forum is getting harder because... well their movement has become more muted it seems.

ZogG	2016-01-13 16:12

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by gerbick (Post 1494747)

It's the newer ways to try to get over that concern me more. Watching Jolla closely over the din of this forum is getting harder because... well their movement has become more muted it seems.

Muted? By whom? Where exactly they were communicative on this forum?
And even if so, did i mute them on TJC, twitter and their blog so they do not share any more "soons" with us?

szopin

2016-01-13 16:29

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZogG (Post 1494746)

I'm not sure we are talking about same phone. I'm Linux user more than 10 years, no dualboots, no wine here as well BTW.

wine or whine?

Quote:

While 1 phone was released and it had updates, most updates were bug fixes and still we have a lot of that were not fixed from first releases.

Sure, no new features at all :rolleyes:

Quote:

The difference with and power of Linux is that most of lacking things of it can be implemented by community. While you can do it with writing apps you miss, you can't change/fix/patch most of the important and core things of the sailfish as it's not 100% opensource and I'm not talking about blobs, like you have in Linux, where it is your choice to use nvidia driver or nouveau one or even make your own.

You can run Nemo/Glacier if you _need_ that open UI, you then can control everything and write your own anything. Somehow community members added support for Skype chat (skype - that bloody MS closed source evil nicely incorporated into messages app, nothing to see here, yeah)

Quote:

Lets take it further, there is no real eco system, no clear roadmap, no way to properly submit bug(question-answer forum engine is not one).

Sailors track issues brought up in TJC, sure they will not magically implement every feature request from there straight away but you will get an answer and estimate (like with SDL, when upstream accept their patch, now complain to SDL devs they wanted to push 2.0.3 quickly and dropped it)

Quote:

The phone you can't get spare battery, the problem with sim contacts(i assume it was related only for first revision as they kept silent on that one), where solution for battery contacts was a "piece of paper".

There was a small batch, and if you missed it Desire's battery is identical and tested. If paper trick is not good enough for you, their support was replacing the HW, so if you have couple of days to send the phone to support you get it back fixed, both options I understand unacceptable for you

Quote:

The phone where main feature is TOH and no TOH with any functionality was introduced. I do understand that they more care about SW and not HW, but this phone is the way to show it and it was their shot in the world and they just ignored all of those problems.

TOHKBD, TOHLED, thermal imaging TOH, medical device OH (not sure if this one is actually finished or was just planned), arduinOH...

Quote:

As about lack of applications and option for paid ones, where there is promotion of android Apps support is stronger than promotion of creating native ones(see the problems with API and documentation).
All i get back is that underneath is real Linux, but if you need to run android Apps, why not just use android and use same chroot for Linux on it?

Where's the hwkbd Android phone? SO much choice and SO much better, yet Jolla+non-existant TOH work much better

Quote:

So basically in all those years they introduced one phone with a lot of problems and most updates were package updates and not much real changes and it still lacks common features of any system in 2015 :)

It's 2016 people!!!

Quote:

Now you would say privacy and security, while you do not know how and why they use your info (you can't update without Jolla account don't you) and what about 0day vulnerabilities we had and waited for next scheduled update to get then fixed? Is it Linux way?
I would remind you that android, ios and even PlayStation 3/4 are based on Unix system, but are they so open?

Day after patch for openSSL comes out you can download (or compile yourself if you don't trust NielDK), which android phones get to upgrade on the same day those 0days? Unless you mean 0days in Silica, but you should be running Nemo/Glacier anyway by now

gerbick

2016-01-13 16:35

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZogG (Post 1494757)

Muted?

I don't see any particular new news other than they are in business and we're "free to speculate". Any other updates and/or movements have yet to be spelled out.

That's a stark difference to the noise generated on these forums and in social media.

Quote:

By whom?

Read above. It's not by whom but in relation in comparison to whom.

Quote:

Where exactly they were communicative on this forum?

No, no. This forum creates the noise.

Quote:

And even if so, did i mute them on TJC, twitter and their blog so they do not share any more "soons" with us?

You don't factor in other than opinion from what I see. Same as me for that matter.

gerbick

2016-01-13 16:55

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by prometheus (Post 1494501)

This was their last - entire message...

By the way, I forgot to ask. What is the date of this correspondence?

switch-hitter

2016-01-13 18:02

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by gerbick (Post 1494762)

By the way, I forgot to ask. What is the date of this correspondence?

I received that same email on 2015-12-21. I hadn't requested a refund, I requested a Jolla phone in lieu of the tablet but Jolla also declined that.

Dave999

2016-01-13 19:35

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Surprise surprise. No invitations

att	2016-01-13 20:28

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1494811)

Surprise surprise. No invitations

There are still 2,5 weeks left of January :)

Dave999

2016-01-13 20:33

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by att (Post 1494820)

There are still 2,5 weeks left of January :)

Yeah. Heard that before. Heard that in May. Then in June. Heard it again in August...in December and...2,5 weeks is nothing nothing for Jolla, it could take that to just write blog post for Jolla ...

prometheus

2016-01-13 20:43

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by gerbick (Post 1494762)

By the way, I forgot to ask. What is the date of this correspondence?

It was 21.12.2015

But I asked them again for possibility of refund or for any news regarding tablets, here is the response:

"Jolla Service and Support (Jolla Service and Support)
Jan 13, 08:22

We in Service and Support have no answer for you on this matter.

Furthermore we take our cues from official company channels. And, thus far, no official and approved approach to the Tablet case has been decided and communicated to us.

We apologize for this unclarity and please do understand, once it is clear, it will be shared. Via the Jolla Blog as the primary external comms channel of the company.
Sincerely,
Jolla Customer Care

Operating hours: Monday to Friday from 9.00 - 17.00 GMT +2; closed on weekends and public holidays (Finland)*."

Jolla support doesn't have any information?!?!?

Do they even work in a same company?

mikecomputing

2016-01-13 21:05

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

newsflash!!! from a year ago

https://blog.jolla.com/jolla-tablet-...ed-tech-specs/

nieldk

2016-01-13 21:18

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

...
Furthermore we take our cues from official company channels. And, thus far, no official and approved approach to the Tablet case has been decided and communicated to us.

We apologize .... Via the Jolla Blog as the primary external comms channel of the company.

??? If they could only decide. That email contains hidden truth ....

tommo

2016-01-13 21:21

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

1 Attachment(s)

Jolla customer service...

pichlo

2016-01-13 21:36

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by prometheus (Post 1494823)

Jolla support doesn't have any information?!?!?

Do they even work in a same company?

This is getting ridiculous. Of course they don't have any information! How could they? The top management has made it very clear that they do not have a solution yet. How could a poor guy in Tech Support have any information when the CEO does not? If he had a crystal ball, he would bet on horses or the stock market, not work 9 to 5 in a failing company.

pichlo

2016-01-13 21:37

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikecomputing (Post 1494828)

newsflash!!! from a year ago

https://blog.jolla.com/jolla-tablet-...ed-tech-specs/

Good try, but could you not have waited 16 more days to make it more credible?

mscion

2016-01-13 22:35

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Well, I bought 10 Power ball tickets for tonights lottery. The winner gets a $1.4Billion prize (before taxes). If I win the jackpot, I will consider making a donation to Jolla to distribute the tablets.

billranton

2016-01-13 23:22

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by mscion (Post 1494839)

If you win that, you should buy the entire company. That sort of money will keep them afloat for upwards of three weeks!

mscion

2016-01-14 14:20

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by billranton (Post 1494843)

If you win that, you should buy the entire company. That sort of money will keep them afloat for upwards of three weeks!

Ha Ha, Well, unfortunately I have to report that I did not win. However, I did match the powerball number so I'm entitled to $4. Not quite enough to get the tablets delivered but enough to buy 2 more tickets! Maybe I'll try again when the pot gets high enough.

Dave999

2016-01-14 16:44

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by mscion (Post 1494890)

Admit that you did a jolla...as soon as you got the money you decided to change your mind, right?

mscion

2016-01-14 16:50

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1494899)

Admit that you did a jolla...as soon as you got the money you decided to change your mind, right?

Ah yes.. If only that was true...

Dave999

2016-01-14 16:53

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by mscion (Post 1494900)

Ah yes.. If only that was true...

Cmon, be a man about it!

rcolistete

2016-01-14 16:57

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

#mer-meeting: SailfishOS, open source, collaboration 14th of January 2016

Quote:

3. Status update from Jolla (tablets, financing, resourcing, etc.); please address the subject of tablet covers - LastuCase and MapBagrag (10 minutes) (stephg, 14:36:12)
d. Antti Saarnio promised in the previous meeting that the Tablet project would be resolved around New Year's time, but unfortunately it took a little more time. Now we finally have a resolution agreed and we're now preparing the practicalities and the communication. An update should be out in a few days (next week). (vgrade, 14:44:10)

pichlo

2016-01-14 17:02

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Dave999, I am sure mscion will issue an update soon!

Dave999

2016-01-14 18:08

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by rcolistete (Post 1494903)

#mer-meeting: SailfishOS, open source, collaboration 14th of January 2016

Yeah, Im sure vGrade talking about the new owner of jolla. You know who, right ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by pichlo (Post 1494905)

Dave999, I am sure mscion will issue an update soon!

next week is my guess!

ZogG	2016-01-14 18:27

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Jolla is Donald Trump of Maemo ;)

Copernicus

2016-01-14 18:41

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZogG (Post 1494914)

Jolla is Donald Trump of Maemo ;)

Nah, I highly doubt that Jolla is attempting to start World War III...

mscion

2016-01-14 19:19

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by pichlo (Post 1494905)

Dave999, I am sure mscion will issue an update soon!

Now now now.... Regardless, I only said I would consider helping Jolla. So should I buy more tickets or donate the $4 to the Jolla software development fund.

Dave999

2016-01-14 19:20

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

This was jolla stated back in the campaign:
“Our goal is to bring Sailfish OS into the hands of even more users. Every single cent from this campaign will go into producing the tablet, with nothing to spare.”

mscion

2016-01-14 19:22

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by rcolistete (Post 1494903)

#mer-meeting: SailfishOS, open source, collaboration 14th of January 2016

Well, folks here should know the drill by now. Hope for the best, plan for the worst...

Copernicus

2016-01-14 19:23

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1494917)

And so it did. Too bad that in the end it wasn't enough.

Dave999

2016-01-14 19:25

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by Copernicus (Post 1494919)

And so it did. Too bad that in the end it wasn't enough.

Why dident they told us the truth?
“Our goal is to bring Sailfish OS into the hands of even more users. every single cent will go into OS development”

Scam?
Fraud?
Lie?
Incompetence?
Bad luck?

Copernicus

2016-01-14 19:38

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1494920)

Why dident they told us the truth?
“Our goal is to bring Sailfish OS into the hands of even more users. every single cent will go into OS development”

The could have done the other thing: hand out Aigo x86 tablets running Android to everybody, and said "Maybe some time in the future we'll finally get around to porting the OS to this device." :)

switch-hitter

2016-01-14 19:42

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1494920)

Why dident they told us the truth?
“Our goal is to bring Sailfish OS into the hands of even more users. every single cent will go into OS development”

Scam?
Fraud?
Lie?
Incompetence?
Bad luck?

I requested a Jolla phone for my daughter in lieu of the tablet I'd paid for but not received. Jolla obviously decided they'd rather lose an existing enthusiast than acquire a new one so let me see, which option would I go for...

Dave999

2016-01-14 19:42

Re: The Future of Jolla's Tablet

Quote:

Originally Posted by Copernicus (Post 1494922)

The could have done the other thing: hand out Aigo x86 tablets running Android to everybody, and said "Maybe some time in the future we'll finally get around to porting the OS to this device." :)

Yeah, That would have been bad but much better than current disaster :D

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