N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

I tried to read threads about this matter but some are very old and there are new kernel power releases and decided to ask about the current situation:

Is it possible to use N900 as an external monitor and keyboard for another device?

If yes, by which way of connection?

a) usb port

b) bluetooth

c) wifi

d) some other, what?

I read about usbIP but could not find where did it end and what you could do with it.

I just thought that now that we have very very small usbsticks with whole live distros and raspberries and such that can't it really be possible to run one like that and use n900 just as the screen and keyboard? There are some further questions which will come later.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

There are many ways to achieve that. First which comes to mind is indeed setting up IP over USB and then connecting to the target as X server.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Did you check this out?
https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.ph...ight=bluemaemo

and this?
https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.ph...t=hen+usb+mode
newer: https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.ph...&highlight=hen

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Why not run a VNC server on the external device and use the N900 to control and view it, I think it is tightVNC viewer in the repos.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Idea was that because it is not possible to add ram or faster cpu to N900 could it be possible to adapt intel stick pc to N900 and run that using N900 as monitor and keyboard? And then make a case for it with a slim external backup battery to give power to it. That is the idea and would like to know is it possible with Palis usb host mode or how?

Now have been checking different computer sticks and it seems that running ubuntu on an intel apollo stick is possible with linuxium ubuntu version. When tried to find instructions running debian I found this https://www.debian.org/releases/stre...apds03.html.en

Thought that someone could be interested. Seems like some good and usefull instructions.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Biketool is correct....TightVNC is a convenient way to achieve the desired effect....if that is indeed the desired effect...
I have used it a lot...

Frankly you aren't really asking "a" question ...pertaining to a specific usage...
But are asking many different ones and each has much diffferent effects in implementation and in end results...

Sure you probably could just use the n900 as a display...
Sure you probably could use the n900 and plug in usb sticks with alt os's...

Problem is...the n900 relies on the usb for power...
Plugging in other things into it..and running goodness knows what ...
Will drain your battery quickly.
Even with bluetooth or wireless mice and keyboards...the battery will drain quick.
Even if you have an octopus of an adapter to try to feed the n900 peripheral devices (mice, keyboards, usb sticks...) and feed it power...
It will still drain...quick (not as fast as without ...mind...but still pretty rapidly..)
To work around that...you would have to find portable os's that use a minimal power footprint ...and also use apps that are minimal as well...and even then...

Frankly ...if using a device for such endeavors ...
I would suggest a n800 or n810...with tightVNC...
Bigger screen....
Usb port AND separate power port.
It is much more viable a usage situation ...than the n900

But that is just my suggestion.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

I was thinking the battery myself too. I have understood that N900 charges itself when plugged to a computer with usb at least when you use it as a mass device. But so is it that it doesn't charge when used as a monitor or keyboard? I mean that if the stick computer could be charged from a different port than from which it is connected to a N900 then there could be a charger for that and N900 would be charging itself through the stick computer. That is the way I thought it should work. But if it is absolutely not possible shoot me down before I fly to the sun and get my wax wings melted. I'm not a rich man so dobn't wanna put my money on something which won't carry.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

what you want ...is your cake...to eat it too...and refund it as well for the value of 3 cakes...

When utilizing any usb ...as in "mass storage mode" or "pc suite mode" or "usb charging mode"
it doesn't matter if the device is a n900 or any other random device that can do the same thing.

For example....
the nexus 5 and say...
maru os..or...buntu convergence..
with a monitor and bluetooth mouse and keyboard...
utilizing a "slimport" cable that allows connection to the monitor and device...as well as power to the device...
Even STILL...
with power being fed to the battery ...
It is not even a "holding pattern" on battery ...
there is a power drain on the battery...
and that is a very well thought out implementation and usage...

Expecting miracles out of one micro port to be able to handle work loads of data ...connected devices...and keep the battery up...
Is expecting a lot.

That is one of the reasons why I so love the separate power ports on the n8x0s
It allows for heavy work like you are wishing for.

(And by the way ...flying close enough to the sun with feathers and wax ...well...for the wax to get warm enough to melt...you also would most likely have zero oxygen to breathe...and the feathers would most likely catch fire ...turning you into a nice wax candle ...first...
Ever before the wax just melted...
Not really a pleasant way to go...
1- a frozen popsicle before you get there...
or
2- a flaming mass of wax and feathers...when you do get close enough...
either way Daedalus would be laughing ..)

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Writing this with my N810, connection over wifi from N900. This feels a great device! I think I can bury my stick pc idea and gonna follow your instruction and find out what I can do with this. Now just feel stupid I didn't buy one more of these when I could have got it for 20 eur.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Exactly.
Just what I have been saying for years...
The n8x0s ARE great devices...
Glad you are beginning to see the light ...

and ..Maemish ...
As my Gran used to say..

The world is full of people who have no problem being hard on you..
So don't be so hard on yourself..

Beating yourself up is just unhealthy ...
and a lot of work...

Let others do it for you...

Any time Maemish ...
I am happy to help.. and beat you up ..
save you the time, effort and trouble ...

:D

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

You might look for a super cheap old Nook HD or similar trash can ready ARM tablet to run a VNC client on. I would load with an alternate ROM so you dont have to deal with an online account or bloatware, reason is touchscreen area and the OS behind the VNC client app is not so important. Another idea for a stick computer is grab a Rasberry-pi sized ARM computer or cheap TV settop box and load with Debian, there are even small AMD64 mobile chipset(intel cherry trail)boxes, I have used them to make cheap Ubuntu game computers for kids running 10-20 year old win/WINE games and Nintendo64 emulators.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

I prefer the idea of the stick computer cause it would fit under the space behind N900s screen when keyboard opened. Was thinking of making a casing where you can stick N900 in the case and to the usb and have a proper specs computer in your hands. The intell sticks have their own micro usb power port so my idea could work: to have intel stick behind N900 screen and beside it a slim external battery giving power for the stick computer. So it would be a dock where you stick your N900 when you need to have up to date machine with horsepower (as for some would may like to use it for running kali). They have in them as default the win 10 and you can get nethunter from windows store. Ubuntu can be set on it so it can probably run most of the needed tools on linux side. It has usb2 and usb3 depending on the model, 2gb ram and 32gb for storage plus micro sdcard slot. Just a bit pricy to buy if it is unsure how well it would work. But it would be easy to build casing for the stick and extra battery for them to serve as a dock.

But as I mentioned before I think I will first get to know this N810 I have.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Connection of the 2 device will be a problem.
USB on N900 is too power hungry for a always on connection, even if you dont charge or do anything. You have to pull the plug.
Running a wifi hotspot drains your battery too.
Bluetooth may work but maybe too slow for vnc.

Most usb pc arent optimized for power consumption.
So your idea with open keyboard too increase the battery space is good. But the camera may want an open spot in the "middle" of your back.

Before buying and messing with all that stuff it might be cheaper, and easier to just rent a server and vnc via 3g into that. Sadly does not work on bad connections.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Drives me crazy this "it possibly drains and consumes all the power" or "it would be easier... I'm not saying I do not believe you and I believe you know more like one should know. It's just this my problem when someone says "you can't" I feel I just have to try before believing. Getting me to trouble all the time - this mindset. Could have a much easier and peacefull life.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Ah....
But Maemish ...Pythoneye isn't saying and never said can't...
You are.


All Pythoneye and I are saying is...
micro usb ports were never built for the singular load of ONE port handling continuous power, battery charging, and everything else thrown at it ...monitors and / or vnc and / or wifi or bluetooth and / or mice and / or keyboards ...and / or os's that then need to be so light as to be past DSL (damn small linux) ....
JUST to run on this idea you have put together.

And no one has insisted you must "believe them" ...here...
The EXACT same work has been done in this attempt...before..with other devices...(my last example was maru and buntu convergence on the Nexus 5 with slimport cabling..)
This isn't about believing anyone...
I could give a tinkers damn if you "believe me" or pythoneye..
The science ...the work that has been done...the trial and error done..all has been measured inside the parameters of the tech existing...and the verdict ..for now ...is in.
Believe all you wish ....believe the earth is round...believe it is flat...
Your belief doesn't negate the findings.
Teams of devs have worked on such ideas with the micro usb port and utilizing slimport -esque cables ...
all kinds of optimizing ...
done exactly what you wish...
But the cost to attempt the same for the n900 may be too high.
and even then...
as I said...the best with all that running ..and microusb charging ...
will be a battery drain...I don't think you will maintain a holding pattern ...
No one else can ...

And this isn't a "can't" issue...
This is called no option but to work inside the box...
within the parameters of the known limits of the physical equipment that cannot be exceeded

And believe me ...
you aren't the first to have thought of this idea in our forum...
I have as well...
The only difference is ...
I would ...except for ports and their necessities ...in the body ..
and the battery...gut all else...and put another battery in the cavity..
and somewhere shove in the smallest stick pi there is ..as well..
and the only difference between your new idea
and my old idea is...
my idea may work.
Mainly because you are stuck on the n900...

Whereas I ...I am stuck on the n810 :D

"The n810 Tank" ...solid build....separate power ...separate usb ...
may still have a drain on a couple of battery...
But I bet you can run much more...much longer.
You may even get a holding pattern or even actually charging ....

But you will most likely have to drop the idea of micro usb as the "carry all" ...and have separate power port ...instead ...to help.
Micro usb was never really designed for such load ..

But...its your choice what and how you do what you do...
and I wish you luck with the endeavour on the n900.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

I wonder about this one; do you mean that the N900 chipset itself consumes a lot more power when USB is used, even if the connected device is not drawing any power from the N900?
I guess that's possible. Might be that more modern USB chipsets are designed differently.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

My knowlegde of usb is limited, but currently the n900 draws about 18ma in device mode propably through pullup detection resitors (1.5K+15K) when conneted.
But it may even drain the battery fast if you just connect it to an unpowered host.

I heared usb 3 tried to improve on that. usb was never really low power.

On top of that the n900 usb hardware stack is "unique" and not simple (there may be bugs).
The n900 usb plug is in a bad spot and not robust.

Some kind of relays maybe a solution to disconnect and connect the devices. Maybe ask someone more involved how it should be done (joerg_rw for example).

There are still very few powerefficient affordable fast small linux boards. Most arent good at idle powerconsumumption and you cant turn them off cause linux still needs so much time to boot.

There is the rumor that someone used a setup with a n900 and some type of other external compute modul for some time, but i could not find any further information on that.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

I've thought about pretty much the same thing, but I came to the conclusion that, while it might be a fun experience to implement, it has no practical use. Why is that?

First, think about when you want to actually use the N900 as an I/O device!
It is never when you have a "proper computer" with an actual keyboard and a monitor around. Let's face it, while the N900 can do "PC I/O", with its tiny keymat and small low-resolution screen it's very bad at it. It's so bad, that any worse would be useless.
Actually, even the tiniest of laptops will be better at I/O (GPD Pocket anyone?).

So you want to use the N900 when you need a "proper computer", but you don't have one around. This will usually be mobile scenarios when you're "on the move", where even something like a GPD Pocket will be too clumsy.
A compute stick, while being small on it's own is pretty useless in this scenario, because you'll need at least an external power supply. So at least you have to plug it into a "powerbank".
You'll most likely have some sort of bag with you if you carry an N900, a compute stick and a powerbank. So why not put a GPD Pocket (or an even more conventional laptop) in it instead?

I can imagine putting the N900 in one Jeans pocket (happens quite regularly), a powerbank in the 2nd (I don't have a powerbank, so this doesn't actually happen, but I could see myself doing it) and the compute stick (or a slightly bigger and sturdier Intel Compute Card or Zbox Pico) in a 3rd pocket. Then I hook up the powerbank to the PC from one pocket to another.
Quite frankly, I don't see myself doing this, because if I have no bag with me (that could fit some laptop), it is usually because I'm doing something where a bag would bother me. In that same situation I wouldn't want to have two electronic devices in my trousers connected to each others via a cable.

bottom line:
The N900's key strength is being a (bad) "proper computer" on its own. If you have to add any element to it to accomplish that task, you lose this feature and are better off, looking for an entirely different solution.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

I measured the intel stick and it would sit nicely under the N900s opened screen. I have about the same sized powerbank. To make them sit side by side in a case with a microusb on it into witch to just slid the N900, that was the scenario. Not to have wires and stuff going from pocket to pocket. Don't make me to prove I'm wrong. I think I will wait for maemo leste to see is N900 enough as is for me or not. But the idea and the vision of running with N900 a proper compact computer don't seem to leave my mind too easily. Have got emotionally so attached to that little creature. Now writing this with N810 which gives some ease for the will of learning to use something new. Didin't expect this to be this good device.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

That whole box will be a lot bigger than the N900 alone (plugs & cables).
I understand why you find that idea exiting (so do I), but from a practical POV, you'll have a clumsy ugly box (assuming your craftsman skills are as bad as mine), and still a bad keyboard and a mediocre screen at best.
Combine that with a slow device running outdated software (even if it's just the interface to the stick) and that's the point where I'd get a GPD pocket, which has a relatively proper screen and keyboard, and is just as fast as the stick without the added bottleneck that's introduced by whatever interfacing method you chose (ssh, vnc, whatever).

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

If you dont care for camera, the upper keys, and it still fits in your pockets, that might work. I still like to hear an experience about such nice modular design. Post pictures of the beast, if you do this.
But watch out for battery consumption and heat of the module and tighten the n900 usb port.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Checked the prices. 20000mAh powerbank 20eur, male microusb / female usb cable 5eur, china copy of intel stick 100eur. The proper stick is pricy. Not sure if I should just by the older stick with ubuntu 14 on it but it has only 1,4 ghz processor and 1Gb ram. But would get with 50 eur and cause this is just an experiment would really want to get everything under 100eur. Also there's a big difference with the weight of the powerbanks. N900 150g and lightest capasity powerbanks at least 250g, normal weight about 400g which is too much.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

I wish I had some Pi-zeroWs, big community and it can run Ubuntu Mate. Get a PCB hub solder down the USB devices you need like KB, mouse, touchscreen and use the HDMI for display.
Probably about 10euro for the board, a good MicroSD card will cost more than the system board and it fits your design spec, 3D print a box/N900 mount for it, again VNC and SSH to connect wired or wireless.
There is an option to hard wire the N900 via internal USB pads too, this is not a bad use of a N900 with a non-functional USB port or failed GSM module.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Thanks but not entering the Pi world. Or maybe I'll check. The board is just a bit bulky and needs space for the casing. It sure would give more free space to choose the operation system.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Pi-zeroW is the tiniest thing there is.
and cheap.
but don't expect to be running heavy stuff...It can't quite take that.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

It is not much better than an overclocked N900 and has only 256mb more, but most or all of the drivers are FOSS so the chosen OS can follow regular updates including kernel, AKA why it is so much work or impossible to upgrade the N900 or whatever your favorite mobile gadget is.
My frequent 'web2.0 ruined the WWW' applies here too, offload to a server you own what you cant do with mobile hardware or learn to get by without.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Hahaha...
comparable to an overclocked n900 is exactly right .
Still...
You know kids these days...
Unless it is an icosahedracore...
With liquid nitrogen cooling ...
To handle the important things in life...
Like ..facebook...instagram...or snapchat..
And render in 17 Dimensions ...
Then ... speed comparable to a overclocked n900 may seem insufficient ..

For many (especially those who have gotten spoiled on gigs of ram over the last few years) it would be "learning to do with less"...

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Just found a post where one guy had tested to run compute stick with 20000mAh powerbank. Run it 10 hours, doing 8 hours windows updates and same time watching youtube with cpu 100. Now I'm glad cause 9000mAh powerbank is then enough or even less so not to need to be too big and heavy. One information step closer of possibly going for it.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

Does it matter is the host computer that would use N900 screen and keyboard 32bt or 64bt? Almost ordered the compute stick but now just need to check. I thought of buying a 32 but 64 would be better I thing.

There are powerbanks with two cabels for charging so one could power the compute stick and the other N900 if using Y-cable.

Re: N900 as an external monitor and keyboard?
 

I don't see why it would matter? It's 2 separate systems connected to each other via USB bus, just like any 2 computers connected via any network protocol. The role of the network stack is to hide the computer architecture.