Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

Pdonner's post about their new N810 got me thinking. We've seen 3 generations of tablets (or 2.5 depending on your viewpoint) and it struck me:

Nokia is playing a game of 'Here ya go! Just kidding!' with each generation.

When the 770 gave way to the N800 the hard cover was lost (find me someone who wasn't cheesed at that besides the people that didn't understand the concept of sliding the case up 3mm and sliding the stylus out in about 0.2 seconds.)

When the N800 gave way to the N810, they yanked out all that juicy storage space. Not only did they not go for 8GB internal to try to soothe people, they bumped it down to 2GB in what was most likely a move to keep the already ridiculous cost down.

(And apparently the GPS they made room for sucks based on what I've been reading.)

What gives? What is going through the head of the person deciding which features to nix and which to include on each new generation? (The two things I brought up are what I think are some of the most important.)

*Edit: I should also mention I think things like material, appearance, location of things like the d-pad are a matter of preference.

Discuss!

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

Nokia official motto: things always can get worse:D

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

Sometimes the designers (in any company) do very strange things indeed. I have a digital camera with all the buttons perfectly placed, e.g. the zoom button is a nice up/down button exactly where the thumb is when you hold the camera in your right hand. This was the 4th generation of this particular model, and finally everything was good.

Then I bought the 5th generation model, which had almost exactly the same specs - they just bumped the megapixels a bit and increased the number of pixels in the LCD screen. But they also moved around the important buttons. The zoom button is now a very difficult to operate tiny little thing placed far away from anything, and in its place under your thumb is a silly little switch for changing between video and still pictures. Not something you'll operate constantly. And so on.

This camera vendor totally wrecked the design, from one model to the next. I really don't understand what goes on in design departments in some companies.

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

I see where you're coming from but I'm very forgiving for the simple fact that sw-wise we have a lot of freedom. I also can't imagine that these IT's are either cheap to produce or a big profit earner for Nokia. For some, like me, the progression allowed me to buy the 770 at a knock down price otherwise I would never have been able to afford/justify one at all. Others are getting the N800 at bargain prices. So there is an "upside" at least. HW/feature-wise, all three are impressive in their own way, horses for courses I suppose. As a constructive suggestion why don't current/prospective owners come up with their own designs and feature sets, two categories: "if money was no object" and "realistically". I bet Nokia would be interested in the results. I also bet some fool would post the iPhone :-)

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

Hedge,

The question about design choices is a good one and it isn't confined to Nokia products. As far as I'm concerned, the whole problem with products whose design puzzles the user (at best) or frustrates the same (at worst) begins with the engineers who are ultimately 'left in charge' of what will/won't 'go into' a particular product.

Left alone in the hothouse environment that must define many of the engineering divisions of most major and many minor corps, these men (and a few women) struggle to answer basic design questions without ever consulting a user other than themselves, or perhaps, occasionally, a fellow cube-mate.

So, when trying to decide where the d-pad should go on the N810 or the zoom button on your camera, the engineers in charge most likely did not actually conduct rigorous or even some basic real-world usability tests (for references on this fascinating subject, search the web for "Tufte").

I really do love my tablets, and have much good to say about them, but sometimes it's very important to say that the 'emperor has no clothes' (can you say gps?)! Should we, as consumers, really have to wonder why things end up in the 'wrong' place or are missing altogether when other 'features' are inexplicably included? Of course we should'nt. Most of us blame ourselves; we say, 'well I just can't seem to make it work' when we should be asking just what you did, which is what the he*l were they thinking?

Nokia engineers, please chime in here and defy me. In the design process for the N810, was usability testing as important as say hardware component testing? Who did decide where the d-pad was placed?

Edit: Better question: who decided gps was more important that internal memory? If it was a matter of space, who joined the debate? Hardware guys, I'm guessing. Nobody ever said, well, we could just leave it out till we get something that works...why not? Here's a reason:

http://www.internettablettalk.com/fo...ead.php?t=9876

Thanks Karel...

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

See, though, d-pad placement is tomato tomahto. Personally so long as it's not ridiculously placed I could get used to it.

Functionality is another story. Imagine if they removed the dpad completely? (Guess we'll have to wait for the N900 for that) :D

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

BTW as far what the designers "must have been thinking", don't forget the influence of the marketing people. I suspect one lot comes up with fantastic ideas (some may say "fantasy") while the other lot have their own ideas, which we can guess includes aims many of us would be miffed about ('nough said)... and then at the end of the day the manufacturers *tell* them what they can have for a particular price point. IOW one big juggling act.

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

Well, you have to remember that the N810 is meant to be more mainstream... they removed the second card slot for the keyboard (which is the right thing to do even though I'll miss it). I never liked the hard cover of the 770 and after using my N800 without a screen protector or case for 9 months, it's clear that the 770 or N800 never needed the hard cover to begin with.

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

I agree. Most of these decisions are exactly that, and we do 'get used' to what they give us. So, while I'm grateful (i just saw this: http://www.snopes.com/photos/technology/storage.asp
:pfor what I've got, I still think it's up to users to be vocal about what works and what doesn't. BTW the d-pad is just an example; personally, I happen to think it's ok where it is=tomahto?

The debate may seem silly, but if designers/engineers are following this, it might have some impact on the N900. Or are we too late?:D

Oh and the marketing guys. I think they have some impact, but I think that on the whole, they're given what we (are about to) get and are told, 'Now, make it pretty'! Cf, apple...

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

zerojay: In your usage it might not require one, but mine gets dumped into my pocket along with whatever else is in there and has to fend for itself. I don't carry a bag, don't have a car, most of the time I'm wandering around downtown. If I'm lucky I have cargo pockets but hate heavy things knocking against my knees. The great thing about the 770 was that if you (as you said) have no need for a hard cover, you don't have to use it. You can carry it around as-is (seriously, I doubt it's inclusion in the 770 jacked the price up astronomically).

They also shaved a bunch of size off, so I'm skeptical about accepting that it was either GPS or the second slot. Might be they won't be happy until it's 1mm smaller on all sides than an iPhone.

Which brings me to another point. A second card slot is just bizarre to me from a design perspective. The fact remains, they added that functionality, and then removed it. I'm not trying to debate whether things are good or bad, just that there were many things they implemented, things that were received with great fanfare by the community, and then were taken away for inexplicable reasons.

*Edit: Oh, and Greyghost, that pic is probably Nokia taking it *off* the plane after launching a new version of the aircraft. :)

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

LOL! I notice it's 'missing' a hard cover as well:)

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

What sort of sundry items do you keep in your pockets? I don't carry a bag, I do have a car (this is, in my opinion, irrelevant to the point about hardcovers :P) and my N800 has lived in my pocket for the past 11 months just fine. The key is in separating your goods—you don't put the sharp stuff with the expensive electronics. Keys, Leatherman and pen go in the left pocket, and the N800, the cellphone and (sometimes) the GPS go in the right. It's very clean and requires no hardcover at all! :)

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

I do something like that. I wear quality jeans, where quality = having a watch pocket. My cell phone and USB-sticks (flash drives and 802.11g) go in there. My — let me check... — 2 knives, multitool (Vise-Grip toolbox - sometimes joined by a Gerber), 4 mech. pencils, mech. eraser, and 6" scale go in my right front pocket, where nothing fragile goes. Keys and change go way down in the bottom of left front pocket, N800 (in sock) sits on top, when I'm carrying it in my pants pocket.
More often, at least this time of year, it rides in a jacket pocket by itself. It seems to be a reasonably rugged device, so it's not likely to be damaged this way.
Now with only one pocket, it could be a problem, but I can't afford enough hard, bangy gadgets to fill all my pockets and leave no place safe for the more refined gadgets.

*edit: Hedgecore mentioned bottle caps below. I throw them, and any other random junk, in my left hip pocket. Right hip pocket carries wallet, which contains a third knife.

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

Mildly off-topic, but how do you like the Gerber? I have a Charge Ti that's just fantastic (single-handed knife opening and an incredibly comfortable pliers grip), but I haven't had any opportunity to get my hands on a Gerber.

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

Right pocket = building swipe card, work swipe card w/drawer key, lighter, the odd bottle cap if I decided to put it in there in a haze, maybe a pen.

Left pocket = show flyers, band buttons, 770, the odd bottle cap if I decided to put it in there in a haze, misc interesting beer coasters, etc.

Not a lot, but most of the time I walk everywhere. On an average day where I'm wandering around I walk about 10-15km depending. I realize it'd be fine if it were in a hoodie or jacket pocket, but really. I want the protection and you guys can't take that away from me. All it takes is something stupid like a piece of gravel or road salt in your pocket and your screen is fubar.

Re: Here ya go! Just kidding!
 

Death to the Leathermans! Gerber akbar! :p

Well, I don't have much experience with the newer Leathermans. My kid brother has one with funny thumb-wheel blade locks, which hurt my thumbs. My dad has a Wave, which is OK, but the thing I like about the Gerber is the one-handed opening of the pliers. For me, the knife blade is probably the least-used tool on the Gerber. If I need a knife, I pull out one of my three folders, according to the task at hand. The Gerber's blade is half-serrated, which is occasionally useful, but usually one of my knives is a better fit. Since you didn't mention carrying a slew of knives, perhaps you're better off with something like the Charge, with handier knife blades and less handy pliers.

That said, I'm real happy with my Gerber (Pro-Scout 600). I like the file and scissors; both are the best I've seen in a multi-tool. The saw is nice, too: it holds a standard 1/4" jigsaw blade. Comes with a carbide grit blade, but you can get blades of all varieties at your local hardware store.
Grip is quite comfortable because of the way the sheetmetal is formed. The locks aren't the greatest in the world, but do the job.

One great thing about the Gerber is that, with a pair of pliers, you can adjust the tension, or even disassemble the pivots. Then, you can rearrange the tools that are there, swap them with other Gerbers, or replace them with your own. A hack-friendly multi-tool! :D

My main complaint with the Gerber is that the nylon sheath doesn't hold up well because of the way the tip of the pliers protrudes. It gets a hole in the bottom of the sheath after a couple months of belt carry. The pliers can also prematurely wear out pants pockets, if carried tip-down. I now carry it tip-up, and no more problems.