[KDE] kde4 on os2008
 

edit: excuse the incomprehensibility atm... I'm exhausted and going to sleep now.

I'm playing around with KDE4 in a chinook scratchbox, and I've managed to get something that at least partially runs. For example, dolphin loads but complains about invalid protocols. I think that in this case something regarding kioslaves didn't get built (or installed) correctly. I'm also currently fighting with plasma. It sometimes half-loads, but refuses to load its plasmoids (ie the taskbar). KWin4 works nicely, as well as designer-qt4 (not really kde, I know).

Once I get kde4 running well enough to give a reasonably stable interface, I'll release an image for you all to play with. Interestingly, even in this broken build, kwin/kde4 are running extremely fast, and so I don't think that there will be a problem with resources. And, as long as we don't enable opengl (in kwin, etc...) ram usage should be fairly reasonable.


One last thing. Does anyone know of any imon (inode monitor) support for the maemo kernel? And/or FAM support? Apparently it speeds up kde4 a bunch with respect to monitoring files.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Did you manage to build libqt4 with optimizations? I'm not sure if it really helps but I tried and got lost in configuring qt configuration files (what a mess..)
Most of the examples run quite fast but "chip" for example is amazingly slow.
Did you try the bittorrent client given in example? They really have crazy examples/demos.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

well, I did build qt4/kde4 with a mcpu optimization for the exact chip in the n8x0. I searched on google and found the relevant information on a chat log in #maemo. I honestly forgot to try any of the examples.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

ohh... I remember now. I decided to not make the demos to speed the compile up, remove chances of failure, and reduce the image size. Interestingly, I'm already using klipper with good results. It is fast and works off of selected text as well

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Yes for mcpu but what's with
-mfpu=vfp -mfloat-abi=softfp

Under bora, it triggers a segfault in scratchbox's qemu.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Where did you find those values? I'm pretty new to the world of optimizations, but I have heard about a qemu feature that runs the cpu from your device in your qemu session instead of emulating one. There's something about it in /scratchbox/doc/cpu-transparency.howto

Now, if you were to use the n8x0's processor to do the compile... that would take a long time... but it might get around the segfaults.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

A complete rebuild takes two hours on my slow PC, I don't even dare to think about doing it on the n800.
Well, I got this value a bit from everywhere (looking at specifications, google, and mplayer build options)
Only tried on scratchbox 1 / bora. Maybe the chinook stuffs doesn't segfault.

I've put the examples/demos in a tarball, look in developper subforum. It's really worth it.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

So curious, how will your version of KDE be different from PenquinBait's version (other than 3.5.8 vs 4.0)? I'm currently running PenquinBait's version on my N810 and it's incredible :D I can even create shortcuts for Maemo apps to the KDE desktop.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

At the moment, his is _much_ more polished. Otherwise, there shouldn't be too much of a difference once I'm finished. I guess one important thing to note is that KDE3.5.8 is a stable well-polished relatively bug free version of KDE while KDE4 even for the desktop is unstable and buggy atm. So, It's more a project for me to play around with. (I'm running KDE4 svn on both my laptop and my desktop)

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Ah... thanks! LOL the version of KDE on my Nokia is newer than my desktop - I really should update my desktop :p So how do you like KDE4? Is Dolphin really better than Konqueror? Is it a web browser/file manager? Can you run KDE 3.x.x apps?

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

I love dolphin. It's really smooth, simple, and just a joy to use. However, konqueror is still my swiss army knife. I can do anything with it. So, for most simple file management tasks, I use dolphin, but for web/advanced tasks I use konqueror. And I like it that way!

I can run kde3.x.x apps by just running "/usr/bin/3xappname" if they're installed on my system. However, some of them try to use kde4 resources because of the $KDEHOME setting. So, I have a session where I "ssh -X localhost" to get back all of my normal kde3 environment variables. From there I run for example "kontact & kopete & konqueror & konversation &" and I am greeted with my kde3 apps working perfectly in my kde4 desktop!

Overall I am pleased with the state of KDE4 development. Of course, KDE 4.0.0 is not going to be for general users, and in some ways, it has not achieved even feature parity yet much less configureability parity. On the other hand, There are many things in kde4 that are simpler than their kde3 counterparts but at the same time maintain all of their configureability. For example:

Konsole - I <3 everything they changed. It's simpler to configure, looks sharper and cleaner, and is fast loading.

Kopete - Once I get support for jabber ssl (I have messed up somewhere, it does work) it will become my main messaging app. Looks clean, beautiful and seems faster. It also is easier to work with.

Amarok - This is still in pre-alpha state, but I like where it's headed. And, I already love the 1.4.x series.

Plasma - I feel like we'll really see plasma shine come kde 4.1.x. It'll make its debut in 4.0, but you can clearly see that it isn't at all finished based on what Aaron S. has been blogging about.

Step - OMFG I love this. It is a physics simulator slated for kde edu 4.1. It is fast, nice, and has simple easy to use features. You can create particles, soft bodies, rigid bodies, etc.. and can apply forces, tracers, graphers, labels. it's so nice! You should check it out when you have time.

KDE Edu - For that matter, everything in kde4edu seems polished, usable, and just better compared to kde3edu. Highlights are KAlgebra, KmPlot.

Oxygen - I had my doubts when I saw early work on the oxygen theme, but it has REALLY come far, and it puts everything else I've seen to shame. This includes Vista Areo and Mac (Aqua?). It's just beautiful. You can see some of it on the screenshot I posted above, and more at my blog ( http://blog.chatonka.com )

Wow, this really turned into a mini review of kde4. Maybe I'll have to throw it up as a blog post =).

Hope that satisfied your questions.

- And - For a status update. I'm rebuilding KDE4 for maemo4.0, this time making sure I include as many optional libraries as I can manage. Maybe I'll have better luck this time.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

It seems that these segfaults occur when something is compiled and then run during compilation. The segfault then happens because qemu does not replicate an armv6 (which the n800 has) correctly. The workaround for this would be to either use cpu-transparency (maybe a bash script to only use it when not running gcc?) or to disable that part of the make (which would only work if it was a check).

Hope that helps. It would be interesting to investigate the possibility of a cpu-transparency that only functioned outside of a gcc /g++ make.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

From what i remember reading awhile ago wasnt kde 4.0 going to be lighter than 3.x because of the new libs or the new qt ? i would imagine its true only when heavy eye kandy isn't used.


cheers

-Rip

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

It's qmake that segfaults. Either not well built or yes, qemu doesn't like soft float point. No clue really. It's probably not worth it anyway (eventhough I would have liked to confirm..).
I tried forcing the build of qmake without these flags with a bash script awfull hack but didn't play well with scratchbox transparency.
I also tried to modify the qmake conf so that qt-tools are built without these but the libs are built with it. I failed understanding all the flags..

For me, the only thing that I'm looking for is a _packaged_ kde. Penguinbait's looks good enough but I simply don't like big archives with no uninstalls. It's like going back 10 years before. I'm a "long time" deb user, that probably explains it, it's not meant bad for people doing archives.
But I'd still be interested to see kde _4_
By the way, there is an amazing thread in 770 subforums where somebody discovered a huge (9000 packages?) armel port repository. It contains qt4.3.3 and kde 3.5.8 packages. When I get back home and play with my n800, I'll try this kde.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Hi! I'm trying to package KDE4 for OS2008.
I've packaged kdelibs and kdepimlibs, (the packages are available at kblogger.garage.maemo.org), but i don't understand because if i try to run a kde4 application it segfaults! :(
For Example:

[sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: ~/kblogger/kblogger-kde4-1.0~alpha2/build/src] > kdeinit4
qemu: uncaught target signal 11 (Segmentation fault) - exiting
I've the same error with my executable "kblogger"! :(

kbuildsycoca4 instead hangs up!
Any suggestion is appreciated.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Try running it on your tablet rather than on the scratchbox. The arm cpu emulater (qemu) doesn't have great support for actually running binaries.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

I have heard that kde4's memory footprint is significantly
smaller than 3.5.8's plus qt4 is supposed to be a lot
faster. So that would in principle be very good if
these advantages carried over to the tablet.

So please keep trying - it's just amazing to have a complete
desktop environment in your pocket!

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

I've installed my kde4libs (~ 54 Mb with dependecies ) package (from kblogger.garaga.maemo.org) and it segfaults also on my N810. :(

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

It would be so great to have KDE4 on the IT...
KDE 3.5.X is so slow and i think, that KDE4 will run faster.
Wouldn't it be possible to install KDE4 to the integrated 256mb flash memory!?
And/or a full replace of hildon... !?!?

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

*bump* Any updates on KDE4s progress? I just started using it on my laptop and it's so much better and faster than 3. I have always used GNOME, but now it's completely gone ;) I'd love to know if there's some work going on.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

I've stopped working on it as my free time has been completely eaten up. There is a chance that I will resume my efforts with kde4.1 when I have more time later this spring or during the summer. (June at the3 latest). I am still very interested in having KDE4 on my N800 and I think that with some tweaking plasma could work very well for the environment and small screen.

Sorry if you were anxiously awaiting anything soon =/. I also am using kde4 (compiled from svn with the excellent kdesvn-build tool) and find it very comfortable and fun to work with.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

I don't think it'd be possible to install KDE4 to the integrated 256 flash memory. To small of a space for KDE.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

On the subject of KDE, is there any real, complete solution for RealPlayer? Meaning, comprehensive support as in plugins, links open it when necessary, etc.

Any help with regards to do this would help immensely. Thanks alot.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Looks insteresting.

On the PC Desktop side, I installed KDE 4.0 - Kubuntu and it was so weak, I downgraded all except Konqueror and Amarok to gnome again.

I don't think KDE 4 was really ready to release.

Nice work on porting what you have so far though!

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Keep up the good work on the port of KDE 4 for Nokia tablets. If you can make it a simple install process like penguinbait did, you will have a huge following. Penguinbait's thread has over 45,000 views! So there is an interest for sure.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Hello!

I've been trying to compile KDE 4 in Scratchbox. QT has gotten build along with all the other dependencies, but when I start on Kdelibs, I get this error after I run cmakekde (this is at the very end of the text):



-- Configuring done
make: *** No targets specified and no makefile found. Stop.


Then I try:


[sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: ~/kde/build/KDE/kdelibs] > make
bash: makeobj: command not found


Then point it to the scripts I downloaded:


[sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: ~/kde/build/KDE/kdelibs] > PATH=$PATH:/home/ty/scripts


Make again:


[sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: ~/kde/build/KDE/kdelibs] > make
no objdir found. Tried /home/ty/kde/build/KDE/kdelibs



I have tried this with builds from the trunk and stable, but all have given the exact same results. Is there anything special you did to compile KDE4? Any help or advice would be very much appreciated!

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

I used kdesvn-build instead of the build scripts on techbase.kde.org. The build process kept failing for me though... seemingly on the qmake parts (which would indicate the arm emulation, because qmake runs as an arm binary). Does that help?

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Yes, thanks for the info! I will try that out asap.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

I have been using KDE4 on Kubuntu 8.0.4 and I must say, I think I like 3.5.8 way better. Although the network connection piece is really nice, it probably won't work on the tablet anyway, not with standard maemo under the covers anyway. FYI, I am working on KDE 4.0.3 also, but don't expect anything anytime soon from me.

pb

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Good to see that we have a bunch of people working on it. Does anyone else have any clue why qmake is hanging for me? I have determined that it is qmake, but I can't seem to have any reliable way of making it fail other than running a cmake build for a long time.

Is there any way to specifically use an x86 qmake? Does it even make sense?

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

I have completely given up on compiling it in scratcbox, but I've installed all the build tools on my tablet and am going to give that a try.

I kept getting the same error, even with kdesvn-build... Let's see what happens ;)

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Oh man, that is going to be slooooow. Good luck!

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Imagine a Beowulf cluster of N8xs'

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Hehe, like wolf says, slow... :p

Is it really worth it (it's not final) ? I found kde 4 to be buggy, with 3 running better . I removed it from my ubuntu and use gnome and kde 3.*

Still if it works, we know it will work for final :)

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Like I said, I want to try and get a svn build working, as it's much closer to what will be 4.1. It would be interesting for a possible Google SoC project to get kde working on the tablets and a configuration for plasma that is meant for the n800's screen resolution + touchscreen.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Ah skeen, I mean no offence :)

Regarding your first post, not sure if you still need it but FAM and gamin compile fine in sbox, I've got a deb on gamin if you want.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Well, some news... I've gotten qt to compile and run fine, kdelibs is also compiled (several errors during make, had to use -i to even get it to proceed). But, I keep getting errors when compiling kdepimlibs "No KDE 4 Headers Found". Any ideas?

http://tablethacker.com/temporary/screenshot00.png

http://tablethacker.com/temporary/screenshot01.png

http://tablethacker.com/temporary/screenshot02.png

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

Heh, never occurred to me (I'm slow I guess); I've got PenguinBait's KDE debs installed, so I just ran Konqueror from the maemo terminal and hey-presto, I've got Konqueror running without having to start KDE. Of course, it takes a while to start (and close), and I have to use my bluetooth keyboard or run kvkbd, but it is a nice alternative to the brain-dead file manager app, and it's actually not bad as a browser, either.

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

libs and pimlibs done, working on base now

I thought it odd though, the make for the kdepimlibs completed 101%

Maybe its the love I added :)

I am occaisonally getting these errors popping up, so I am not sure if things are really going that well. Has anyone else gotten these?


qemu: Unsupported syscall: 264
qemu: Unsupported syscall: 264
qemu: Unsupported syscall: 264

It may be my core2 duo on the laptop??? Anyone?

Re: kde4 on os2008
 

X___X How the hell did you get kdepimlibs to compile? Dear god, I have no luck... PB, I believe I will leave it in you're excessively capable hands :D

Bonus for et dei volo!