Comparison of alternate environments
 

Hi N810 environment gurus,
I have recently entered the n810 world. I am trying to figure out how do different alternate desktop environments compare with each other. Here is my limited understanding after reading the forums for alternate environments for a week. I request others to give their opinion about these environments and correct any mistakes in my analysis.

• KDE: Full Linux environment. Light weight and fast compared to the others. Full suite of applications including Open office, Firefox etc. not much new development going on now.
• LXDE desktop on maemo environment. Another light weight desktop environment.
• Easy Debian: Another bootable Linux environment. Little bit slow in comparison to others.
• Ubuntu: Popular Linux desktop environment. Has full suite of applications.
• Mer: New version of Maemo being developed by the Open source community.
  [*} Android (NITdroid): Touch oriented environment from Google. Good touch based environment. focused on browsing, games and entertainment. No office based apps.
• e17 on Mer/Ubuntu: Touch based environment on top of Mer/Ubuntu

For Entertainment/game oriented environments: Android or e17 environments are best.

For full Linux desktop like environments: LXDE or KDE or Ubuntu.

I have couple of questions and feedback from others: How does LXDE compare with other desktop environments.

Regards.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

I dont think that KDE is actually lightweight ;) KDE and GNOME are probably the heavy weight champions among the window managers on Linux. LXDE, E17 and others have a much smaller footprint.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

I had a question similar to this. I am considering an alternate os and I don't know what to choose between these three popular ones amongst this community, Easy Debian, Ubuntu or Mer. What do you guys think? Which one would you recommend?

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Easy Debian isn't bootable (Deblet, Mer and B-Man's Ubuntu are).

You can get Gnome, XFCE, LXDE, and other desktops from both Ubuntu or Debian.

Penguinbait's KDE and Easy Debian's LXDE run without rebooting the tablet; ED's LXDE runs on top of OS2008, which might be the slowness you're talking about.

PB's KDE does not have OpenOffice or Firefox, all of the others do.

Mer is a version of Ubuntu running a Hildon desktop by default, but you can install any of the other desktops instead.

Android is the most advanced hack so far; you really need to know what you're doing and it isn't suitable for a multi-boot setup like the others.

It all depends what you want to do. What do you want to do?

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Qole,
Thanks for the information.

My requirements are to:

run a browser that is reasonably fast, email, rss reader, Yahoo IM and skype with finger touch based operation. Use Open office for MS office compatibility.

I would like the new environment to multi-boot with the regular environment.

Is Mer with E17, my best bet for these requirements?

Thanks,

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Hello
The best would be ubuntu mobile but unfortunatly it doesn't work on ARM yet :(

About e17, I never found how to install it, if you find a good tutorial tell it I would help me ;)

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Ubuntu-mobile IS working on ARM but it SUCKS. It's like a bit modified old version of maemo. It is not good. :(

Mer is the best choise for another bootable OS. You can install e17 just like any other app: sudo apt-get install e17 gdm :)

There's also thread about e17, search for "e17 mer"

For you needs, web-browsing, instant messaging and OOwriter. i recommend maemo. Install Tear for fast browsing, pidgin for instant messaging, Easy-Debian for OOo :)

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Do you know how to install ubuntu mobile on the tablet? :)

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Seriously, as meizirkki wrote, everything you listed (except OpenOffice) is set up the best in OS2008 at the moment. All of the alternatives are for hacker types who are willing to make compromises.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Yes, first install ubuntu following b-man's guide. then go to terminal and type "sudo apt-cache show ubuntu-mid" grab the depends and install what is possible manually. then you have to fight with mobile-basic-flash or kourou to be able to start up any app. Believe me, the application menu (witch is supposed to be in the middle of the home-screen) is not working correctly, mobile-basic-flash is not working at all (even with the adobe-flashplayer), and kourou isn't much better... it just won't work correctly. It's just pain to mess with. Ubuntu-MID is based on old maemo components, witch makes it just an old version of maemo with complicated application-menu.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

In your opinion the workflow in E17 + Illume is not comparable with Maemo? Just wondering. I thought E17 + Illume at its core would be a viable alternative, especially for stylus users.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

E17+Illume might someday be comparable with Maemo. The ideas and concepts in E17 are good. But frankly, it is just too unfinished at the moment to be useful. The on-screen keyboard, especially, is extremely problematic.

There's a reason why they haven't released a "real" version of E17 yet. It isn't ready.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

OK, thanks.

The OSK is N800-related though.

Hmm, well, it depends on purpose and they haven't released E17 for years, while maintaining E16. One could argue E17 is more usable than E16.

I believe some kind of review (in an article-way) would be beneficial to users although it seems the news section on this website is not updated anymore. That kind of stuff keeps the Maemo community alive. I'd be interested contributing to such article btw.

Maybe we can write one together? I can do for N810 and you for N800, for example. Just need to set up the right/best environment. I have a 8 GB microSD card doing nothing.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

I did a little blog post a few days ago about my E17-Illume experiences, not very extensive or in-depth or anything...

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Also, for the original poster, it depends on whether or not you want your apps pre-installed or whether you want the open pastures of being able to install a lot of your own. From what I've read, Easy Debian is in the first category.

For myself, I moved the Wayfarer maps off my n810's internal memory card & I'm itching to install more apps on it. But I need it to be as dummy proof as possible. (I still haven't successfully gotten my PC to properly recognize my n810 into my PC -- I need to figure that out first!) So I'm trying to decide between cloning OS2008 or installing Mer or something.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Well, I've decided to try Mer and I am gonna install Easy Debian to run on my cloneos. That's it. I am not a very good beta tester so, I am trying to stick to the stuff that works. The reason I choose to to try Mer is because is suppose to be the next upgrade to Maemo. So I don't mind getting on it early and see how it progress.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

What are you going to run with Easy Debian?

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

A full Samba file server and high-traffic LAMP web site.

Oh sorry, were you talking to someone else? Right. Carry on.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

openoffice mostly.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Yes, sorry about the stupid question. i missunderstood your earlier post :o

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

hi,
Thanks for all the informative replies. I have installed the Webkit . It has speeded up the regular browser in maemo to the point it is quite usable. Does Tear give me some more performance boost? I have installed pidgin which is also quite good. I am trying to easy debian and will report on its findings.

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

Right, I'm wondering what the top icons are for. And if there are good replacements for it.

What I found thus far is..

http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Illume
http://illume.projects.openmoko.org

Re: Comparison of alternate environments
 

The top icons on the keyboard (if that is what you are referring to) are functional ( the one on the right allows you to select a different type of keyboard and the one on the left allows you to select a different dictionary for the word correction on the keyboard.

As discussed on the e17 thread, I've been wanting to look at making a different keyboard layout for the NIT that would fit the screens better, but haven't had time. Instruction for how to do that are available in first link you posted (it also has a screenshot showing a keyboard that might fit the screen better in portrait mode). If anyone could give it a shot, that would be great.
Personally, I found e17 to be quite usable on my N810. The size of the keyboard didn't bug me much as I was used to the maemo one that always pops up using even more space (but honestly, I never used either much). E17 has a very light footprint and even though you can't log out as qole mentioned, you can't log out of hildon either as this isn't something you'd expect to do on the N8x0. Besides, to log out, you'd need a login manager which would only use more of your precious RAM. E17, like hildon does allow you to shutdown and restart your device.

E17 still has quite a ways to go, but in generally I prefer it to hildon on my device. It's fast, nice looking, light on the memory, and easy to use.

See the e17 thread for more information.