i hate ipod touch
 

we were given ipod touches at work in order to test out an app being developed. After the "cool, shiny!", I then thought, "oh, only 8GB, it's just a cheap gadget". then I checked price and found it wasn't cheap at all.

so then I had to boot windows because it seemed I couldn't get it initialised under linux. then I had to register with itunes, and then they had the temerity to ask for credit card even though I had no intention of buying DRM infested s*** from apple.

I tried doing it without giving apple my credit card, but the app downloader would report invalid login, so I wasted a lot of time on it before I tried app store in itunes app and realised it was that my account wasn't fully set up. I finally succumbed and gave it a credit card, which is due to expire soon. I later removed the card from the itunes/app store account - it said it was optional and I was able to download/install other free apps later.

oh yeah, did I mention that I had to weaken the WPA2 key because even after 8 goes it wouldn't work? it clearly doesn't like punctuation in the key. the nokia tablet had no problem, neither did wpa_supplicant.conf file for zaurus.

I copied on some music, using itunes naturally.

at home I reluctantly booted windows and installed itunes as I thought I might as well put some music on it. then itunes got stuck asking me to turn on/enable genius, so I did, but it kept going back to the genius enable page.

so, finally, I added some music to the library. then I wanted to sync it on. oh no, you can't do that, you can only sync it with one computer at a time!?

OK, it might be crude, but rsyncing on a directory of mp3 files is a piece of p*** by comparison. In the time I have wasted on this POS, I think I could have written a simple webapp which would make choosing music to rsync to the tablet's memory card very easy.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Kinda over exaggerated, but yeah. Its a closed, private ecosystem. Either you follow the rules, or you go through hell. And iPod Touch is the worst because it has the App Store. A normal iPod is a little easier because you do not need a credit card, etc...

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Oh, yes please! An rsync music app would ROCK! Thanks in advance!

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

since I'm on a roll with b1tch1ng, I figured I'd also complain that the device, which is brand new, wasn't up to date with firmware already, but of course it'll cost GB£6 (US$10 ?)

unlike TomTom who promise that brand new devices will get latest map upgrade within 30 days, there's no such mercy with Apple iPod touch. So, I had to, er, find an alternative update process ;-)

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

i was actually going to get an ipod touch until i read about the n810 (thank god:p) but i was reading along here and i'm not sure what rsync is...:confused:

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Ah, but Wikipedia knows.

A wonderful use for the tablets is tapping into that universal consciousness and knowledge base, the Internet, when confronted with an unfamiliar word or concept. Google and Wikipedia often make great starting points in such efforts.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

and after using them ( Google and Wikipedia ) i thought to look to the maemo community for the simple answer, not only what rsync is in "laymens terms sicne we all aren't as technologically inclined", as well as maybe get insight on how it would benefit a inexperienced tablet user, me being a newbie and all. :rolleyes:


Thanks,

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

In that case, you'll get better results asking the question you have, rather than asking a vague, alternative question you expect people to somehow guess means something else. So, perhaps:

Well, "file synchronization" means that given a desktop with files A, B, and D and a tablet with files A, B, and C rsync could be used to synchronize the two computers, making sure both have files A, B, C, and D. rsync can do the same with entire directories, and it does its work across the network, so there's no need for a USB connection. The desktop and tablet need not be anywhere near one another, in fact.

Therefore, someone could use rsync as the basis for building a tool that synchronizes audio files, video files, and playlists between a desktop computer and a tablet. An iTunes replacement, of sorts.

Plus, the rsync-besed solution would potentially have the advantage of working anywhere a tablet can get an Internet connection. So, upon emerging from the wilderness after a week of backpacking on another continent, you could find a cafe with WiFi, power up your tablet, and pull in all the podcasts your desktop has downloaded while you were out of touch.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Eh.. Yawn.. Complaining about the touch but using Windows...Yeah..whatever.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

He did say he used it reluctantly...

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Just for the uninitated, the DRM has been removed on any file that has a "plus" sign which at this point is just about every file. And yeah the previous lock in was a contractual requirement made by the RIAA.

Shocking! not doing what was asked resulted in an error. Truely shocking

truly interesting. Did your password contain a "/" ? That's the only character I've seen trip up the OS (Well, Finder).

I copied on some music, using itunes naturally.

iTunes newbies tend to get stuck here. The genius addition was handled badly by Apple, but it's not hard to turn off.Other than that, you may have a bad install (but then again it is Windows).

Well that sync with one computer was/is another RIAA thing. So we can cast stones at the proper party. That said, there are plenty of third party software that will happily move your data from the iPod to any computer you want. Even playlists that you created.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Regarding the credit card issue: the larger question is, why SHOULD one be required? There ARE alternate means of payment (e.g., Paypal) after all. I think his complaint is legitimate.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

thanks sjgadsby, though it was a very saucy response I wont complain, knowing is half the battle and i didnt stand a chance lol.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

True, however I think the thinking behind the credit card would be a combination of age verification and payment guarantee. Though I clearly can't confirm that. However upon thinking about it, i'm pretty surprised on the need to create an iTunes account to USE the iPod thing. I've been through two of them and never had that requirement. Perhaps it's a touch thing.

You'll note that with the Tom Tom you're paying for map updates, not OS updates (per your text), the iPod Touch update is for the OS and under the accounting rules that Apple uses apparently they are required to charge for changing that actual product. Not a lawyer or accountant so I can't speak to the specifics of the law.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Credit card

- you only need it to register and then to purchase music & apps
- for free apps, you don't need any credit card registered, so, after registration, you can easilly remove your credit cards informations


One computer only

- Apple has the most permissive DRM system managment on the market : it allows you to copy your purchased files (music, apps ...) on 5 devices ...
- Please compare with Microsoft or Sony online music stores and take a good relaxing laugh ! :D
- Indeed, you cannot share music between iPods or iPhones, and you cannot use these devices to share music with any computer. In fact it's just because of intellectual property considerations, you know : you don't have the right to share the music you buy. It sucks sometimes but it's the law.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

8 Gb

Well, 8 Gb is ennough for the music i want to carry with me, i don't see why the 8 Gb model is ludicrous ...
Overall what you say is typical from Windows as well as Linux users :
They just look at the numbers and don't really think about the use.

Often Apple solution were bashed because of showing smaller numbers than PC : smaller hard drives, smaller memory ... but the numbers never reflected the usefullness and the ergonomy of a device.

A good comparison would be the usual person looking for a compact camera : he/she would buy a 14Mega pixels Samsung not-so-cheap **** rather than a 8 Megapixel one with quite good sensor & noise managment.

I truly prefer a 8 Gb iPod touch than a 16 or 32 Gb Creative or Sony device using only their enbelievable **** called "Sony Connect".

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

You'll want to amend this to say that you cannot move music between computers (other than purchased music) without the use of third party software. Something any user of the IT can complain about since most all the good stuff here is third party.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

People really need to learn how to use smart playlists that automatically update. After a certain point it is impossible to listen to one's entire collection in a single day, so most people would be suited to playlists that load certain music on rotation. Most, not all, people are served by this.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

You can easilly copy any music you compressed in iTunes from a CD, just by a click-drag ... and the the copied file can be transfered to any computer, and played by any player able to read M4A files. but it's true the iPods&iPhones cannot be used for the transfer

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

This is not true. E-music has no DRM. I can play music that I purchase there on any number of devices. I don't know why people think Apple stuff is so great. It is completely crippled with DRM. Brainwashed into thinking 5 devices is somehow a good deal.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

It's possible to install openssh and use something like rsync or whatever over a jailbroken device. not sure if that updates the music library though since the music database is created by iTunes

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

It is very new that Emi stopped using DRM. So i suppose that your e-music service with no DRM is very new too.

And it is still quite new that Apple removed any DRM from the music sold on iTunes store. Now, you can copy it without limitations too. If I remember correctly, Apple was very very involved in convincing Music Majors companies to let go DRM ... There even was an open letter from Jobs who criticized very much the DRM system ...

But there is still a DRM limitation for the applications : you can only install your apps on 5 devices.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

On a Mac, Apple+K, connect to another machine, move your files in your network. I do it all of the time. From Mac to Windows, from Windows to Mac, from either to Linux, mostly via Samba or even removable drives.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Again, there are third party software that can transfer music from an iPod to any other computer. Since the iPod can be used as an external HD it is trivial to keep copies of said programs on the iPod for such purposes.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Amazon.com MP3 - DRM Free music...I love it!

Jesse~

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Too bad they sometimes require that Amazon MP3 Downloader software... which would be 3rd Party software as well.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

They don't require it. But without it, it's harder to download full albums. They have download instructions when you don't want to use the downloader.
Anyway, the downloader software is available for (x86-)Linux and works really well.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

You are absolutely right. Its not strictly needed like Apple's iTunes.
I use the Linux version and it works perfectly.

But one of my wishes has always been to have a Amazon app for the Nokia Maemo. That way we could buy ( albums) directly and also play it from the player. Of course some have earlier suggested a web browser - but it doesn't cut it.

Amazon has tied up with Apple, Palm for the WebOS and Android as well for an Amazon app on all these devices. If only Maemo would have an app too. Again its audience is limited to only people who buy from Amazon, so its a limited demand.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

my foray into windows was mercifully brief; the device is now updated with firmware 3.0 and jailbroken and mplayer is installed; doesn't seem to play videos for some reason but at least the device is under my total control (to be read with evil laugh, mwa, ha ha. eight meelion kilobytes!!)

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

"The groundbreaking digital music retailer was one of the first to sell DRM-free music in the popular MP3 format beginning in 1998 and became the first service to sell audiobooks in MP3 in 2007". from the emusic website
iTunes began in 2001 and has only recently begun selling DRM free music.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

At least here in Europe you don't need a credit card to use App Store. I'm using my bank number over a 3rd party (PayPal-like). Goes very easy.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

another solution is to use paypal's temporary credit cards or visa's gift card which are acceptedd anywhere credit is. Just be careful about using them for things like XBOX LIVE or Netflix because they will setup a monthly billing charge when you use their services, the gift card will eventually run out of money unless yout put more on. and then you account gets suspended for not paying.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

More *****ing.

1/ the device is a fingerprint and scratch magnet. I dont abuse my mobile phone or tablet or ipod but it looks quite shabby.

in contrast my N800 looks very lightly used, not 1y6 months!

2/ the internal speaker is a joke

the n800 speakers are quite respectable especially for speech podcasts and radio

3/ no shoutcast AFAICT

n800 does streaming very well

4/ very restrictive codecs, but ok, this is Apple. at least mplayer solved that

n800 has a fair selection of codecs, in fact it's usually only let down by CPU performance


5/ no linux support whatsoever, it's clear from reading up that apple deliberately kill any attempt by linux devs to make it possible



6/ safari is a miserably basic browser
- bookmarks are a linear list without folders and sub-folders!
- no begin/end of page - big pages require wearing out finger scrolling
- no search function in page
- no save page, no save-target-as (can't download an mp3, can play it though)

n800 browser is a dream in comparison, especially with flash

7/ copy/paste - doesn't work everywhere

n800 "just works".

8/ hardware
8a/ no FM radio. ok, maybe the iPod generation doesn't listen to the radio.
8b/ no camera. ok, the n800's isn't a good example here :-)
8c/ no replaceable battery. I guess it keeps it slim
8d/ no memory slot. even a single microSD would make it far less expendable.


9/ minimal bluetooth stack - basically it's for headphones only

n800 is relatively good - UI needs some work though!

10/ no background tasks without hacking

user should be allowed to control/choose this!


11/ relatively low screen resolution for the price

the n800's screen is fab; even the zaurus with VGA is better! it reminds me of wife's palm TX.

12/ having to pay for firmware updates. and it seems to be all-or-nothing, I could understand it if they separated bug fixes from new features/upgrades.

well, that's enough for now. the only time I pick it up now is either when I have to do my routine testing at work, or when the n800 is on charge!

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

The end-of-page part is a bummer, but just tap on the status bar (where the time is) and it will take you to the top of the page.

Have you tried double tapping in a column of interest? Safari (any iPhone OS webkit-based view) will zoom and fit the column to the screen. Double tapping again will zoom back out.

And Apple finally added the option of opening a link in a new window to tap-and-hold.

These features help my browsing experience quite a bit.

I'm not sure what n800 browser you're referring to, but if it's microb, for general browsing it can't be compared to mobile Safari on an iPod touch 2G.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

speculatrix:
1. fingerprints permanently smudge your ipod touch?
2. Don't know about ipod touch, but the speakers on my 3G and 3GS are better than my N800.
6. Safari bookmarks always had folders. Tap 'edit' in bookmark view. Even though it's feature-crippled (no flash, no generic save-as), it has some rather advanced features not yet properly implemented in other mobile browsers (great zoom in\out functions) optimized for <4" screens.
7. The copy paste has some additional features, like copying formatting, not only the text. Also works with images and videos.
11. I'm not sure of the perceived DPI on iphone and nokia tablet screens and what the standards are, but of course higher resolution would be nice provided there is a way to easily manipulate the text to your desired size. Having one without the other sucks.
12. I read this has to do with their R&D cost calculation (for tax purposes). The same software stack on the iphones aren't encumbered by this fee because the iphones generate subscription revenues, thus they can book their r&d for OS updates as expenses to maintain the iphone software stack. They had to engineer some sort of 'fair income' for the ipod touches to tie with the subsequent OS updates for the same reason above.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

1/ fingerprints aren't permanent, no, but the fine-grained scratches on the back are.
2/ the iPodTouch doesn't have an ear-piece/speaker like iphone, it seems to have a piezo buzzer attached to the metal case. reminds me of my childhood and crystal earpieces on AM radios!
6/ I stand corrected, I found the folder feature in bookmarks edit, thanks. It doesn't drag and drop though (unlike tablet bookmark manager), you have to edit the bookmark and choose folder, so useable but not great.
7/ interesting. copy/paste on n800 is purely text, useful/useable but basic. it's still feels a bit like it's "shoehorned in" rather than a well-planned feature.
11/ agreed. the higher res of the tablet is unfortunately not matched with the bandwidth of the video controller and thus I guess the apple's ability to play full motion video at full screen 100% resolution means as a media player it's a better compromise. I know we use the tablets for video but Nokia did indicate with the n810 and its more restrictive storage that they didn't see it as a video player per se.
12/ whilst I can whinge about being charged for software updates for ipodtouch, at least they haven't abandoned it, whereas all I see now are "fixed in freemantle" :(

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

That's not true at all. Maemo inherits the "same Copy&Paste feature" than your desktop GNU/Linux has. In fact, I just copied a full HTML table with images and links from MicroB to OpenOffice.org Writer. Doubt some girl operating system is going to exceed that :D

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

1. Argh, just buy a $10 case for them or something.
6. I've found iPhone\Touch's UI is way more optimized for single-hand usage.
11. Well, there's that, and the different UI paradigm also. iPhone\Touch = optimized for 1 hand navigation.
12. Apple also don't give a fuss if you download the OS update from alternative sources (*cough*torrentsnstuffs*cough*) even though they have means to enforce it.

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Once I bought a Chinese Z80 based music player for like US$50. The same store had silicone covers for iPods selling for the same price!... :)

Re: i hate ipod touch
 

Really? Like better quality or louder? When I tested my cousin's iPhone 3G and my n800 the n800 was louder. As for quality I'm not an audiophile so I can't tell a difference.