N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

I've been looking hard at the N900 as a replacement for my two year-old Blackberry 8330. From a hardware perspective, it's a no-brainer -- but that's to be expected when you're replacing years old hardware.

But from a software perspective, I've combed through the posts about the N900 and here are three important examples where the BlackBerry user experience seems superior to the N900. Maybe some can tell me if I'm missing something:

1. Mail

BlackBerry push mail is tightly integrated with Gmail and Yahoo mail. Mail appears almost instantaneously on my device, and all of my email accounts can appear as one stream, or as separate streams. Deleting mail on the device deletes it on Gmail/Yahoo.

Apparently, Nokia's OviMail is the equivalent of BlackBerry on S60 devices. But, according to this post on Maemo Guru, that's not what will be shipping with the N900. Instead, it's Modest email.

Modest supports IMAP-IDLE ("push"), but does it really work? Can I see all my inboxes in one stream on Modest?

2. Google Maps

Google Maps on BlackBerry look much better than Ovi Maps. I tried Ovi's latest web version and looked at reviews, and it appears that Ovi has nothing like Google's integration between search and navigation. For example, I can search for Thai restaurants near my current location, view the addresses and reviews of the results, call to make reservations, and get directions, all in one application.

Anything beyond simple mapping is an add-on for Ovi, and then the source of the data in Ovi is places like Lonely Planet (at an extra cost) which aren't comprehensive.

Is my take on Ovi Maps way off? Do Symbian users who have Gmaps find that Ovi is just as good? Is "POI" data any good?

3. Device notifications

Blackberry has the ability to have customized notification profiles, which control how each type of communication (SMS, email, phone, IM) rings, vibrates or lights up the device indicator. Blackberry "knows" when it is in a holster (via a magnet) and can change notification profiles depending on whether it is holstered or not.

I haven't seen anything like this for the N900. Have I missed something?

Thanks in advance to anyone with more experience with Nokia or Maemo who can help.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

From what I've seen on screenshots, each account shows up separately, rather than having a universal inbox. Some people like to keep inboxes separate (e.g. work and home) and some people like them combined.

Maybe they'll be an option to combine them. Modest is open source so could possibly be hacked by the community.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

Well if your primary concern is emails, then I would very much suggest a Blackberry, I have been using blackberrys for 3 years now and nothing comes close to what those guys at RIM do,

Regarding google maps, google should out a map version for maemo soon, so that should be ok, also I hear Navteq a Nokia subsidy is planning to get its GPS services on the N900, so that should take care of that

I have no idea about your third question I m afraid, prolly some of the other guys could answer that.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

you should get the newest blackberry, i think it is 8900. If you are coming from a two yr old BB The nokia n900 will blow your mind, and maybe not in a good way.

If you just want to get out of the BB lockin chains and want something similar, i would suggest the e-series, like e71 or e72 coming out soon

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

Thanks for the reply. My guess is that Google won't bother to build a version of maps for Maemo until there are millions of people using Maemo, and I wonder if that's only going to happen in the next version. That's why I'm curious what Ovi Maps can do in the current version of Maemo.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

Yeah. You should consider the N900 as a BB replacement only if Nokia releases Blackberry Connect for it.

Otherwise the feature parity will be too wide.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

Wow! I'm shocked at the responses here. Definitely differing opinions from Maemo users versus Symbian users.

Nokia/Ovi Messaging isn't available for the N900 yet, but will provide PUSH email for up to 10 simultaneous accounts, including webmail. It keeps the accounts separate, unfortunately for your single stream preference, but it actually is a plus for me, and the interface is excellent. I'd wait for Nokia/Ovi Messaging on the N900 to be released before making the jump from the Blackberry to the N900.

True. You'll have to wait. But Nokia Messaging/Ovi Mail is a big part of Nokia's services strategy, and it is expected for the Maemo platform as well. Its not ready now, but is confirmed to be planned, and could still be ready by launch. We'll just have to wait. :(

Are you talking about Ovi Maps on the web or the dedicated application? When most Nokian users talk about Ovi Maps, they usually mean the on device application, not a website, which is nothing like the former. The Ovi Maps website is just getting started, but the app is a class leader.

I think you must understand that Ovi Maps is in a class above Google Maps on any device for a couple reasons. First, Ovi Maps allows sideloading of maps and offline map data. This means when you get dropped off in the middle of the Sahara with no cellular or data connection, your map software still works. You could theoretically find your way home with it, while Google Maps is a web service without offline maps.

Also, Ovi Maps is more closely integrated into the OS. It will allow other apps to use your map data stored on the device, and new apps for the Ovi API are coming all of the time.

Ovi Maps allows you to search for restaurants or anything else, and gives all the same information as Google Maps, including directions, for free. Turn by turn voice navigation is an extra cost handled by subscription, but route planning and directions are free. POI differ depending where you are, but developed countries are all pretty well covered. You can buy supplemental POI and guides from third parties, but they aren't necessary. Built-in POI is in depth and accurate for the US from my experience. The Lonely Planet stuff is commercial marketing stuff.

I've used Ovi Maps since it was Smart2Go, and it will be an upgrade from the Blackberry Google Maps service by far. Nokia owns Navteq, the world's leading cartography company that deals with world militaries and navigation software makers to supply the map data for their apps. This means Nokia's maps will be better than the competition most of the time. This is something that is overlooked, but it will make a difference down the road. Nokia saves money on map data, and makes more selling the data it owns. These cost savings mean more spent on developing the Ovi Map experience.

I'd suggest you find a friend with an Nseries or Eseries device and try the Ovi Maps application for yourself. You'll see it is full featured, and you can install the maps you need at your PC or OTA while navigatiing, either one. It is a great app you can't overlook. I only use Google Maps for quick stuff, since it seems to connect to the GPS quicker, but when travelling away from home, its Ovi only.

I'm an avid and long time Symbian user, and I'm speaking on the Nokia "way", not the N900 or Maemo 5, which I obviously haven't used yet. But Nokia devices have always had PROFILES that allowed customized alerts for each type of notification. You could also select custom alerts for individual contacts by setting an alert in the contact application.

Nokia has always allowed any audio file to be used as a ringtone, and some MP4 videos as well! Nokia is OPEN, the biggest advantage coming from a Blackberry to a Nokia smartphone.

As for the profile "awareness", the Nokia N900 doesn't support changing profiles when in a holster (they still allow those in your city?? just joking...) out of the box. But the Symbian ecosystem had various apps that use the clock, light sensor, proximity sensor, and/or accelerometer to change the profile based on these settings. I'd expect those same applications for the Maemo ecosystem, but we'll probably have to wait for the community to provide them.

The N95 was out for about a few months before we began seeing them in development, and that was for a device with unprecedented hardware, and the ideas were new. The N900, albeit a juggernaut, isn't very different from previous high end Symbian devices, so the space will be filled with apps similar to those on other similarly equipped Symbian hardware. This is an assumption, and you'll hear people say I'm only speculating, but being close to many Symbian developers, I can assure you that many apps will be coming from that side into the Maemo space.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

Navteq is Nokia's cartography division. Ovi Maps is that service you mention, and it will ship on the N900.

I have to remember this. You're so right. The N900 is so amazing, if I had a BB and depended on it for work, I'd STILL carry the N900 BECAUSE it will blow my mind, but it may not be a good experience for all. The N900 allows so much, I'm not interested in what it won't allow simply because of its open nature. It is capable of doing whatever we want it to do. That is the N900's selling point. You can get the N900 to do anything. You can't do the same for the BB, no matter how hard you try.

I guess I agree with you, this time, but only for the email part. I'd actually stick with the BB and wait for the N900 to get it right before spending $500+ on an Eseries, as long as the wait isn't over 4 months from release.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

I think you're right about this. Nokia's N900 launch page shows Yahoo as one of the supported services, and the only way I can think they'd do that is Ovi Mail, because Yahoo does not support IMAP without paying an extra fee.

Thanks a lot for your overview of the "Nokia way". I agree that the best thing for me to do would be to look at someone's Nokia smartphone, but my friends all have blackberries and iPhones.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

Well, I'm a current hardcore blackberry user who is FULLY fed up with it's low amount of ram (I'm on a Bold 9000, I've had every device (GSM Device) that has been released, 8100, 8300, 8800, 8900, 9000 and 9500) and it's always the same device. I feel very locked into their system and as of lately their system hasn't been working that well. Instant messaging options are very limited (BBM is breaking down and has been like this for 4 months and hasn't been fixed yet either), and the VERY limited resources on the phone make it difficult to install lots of apps. Having to do battery pulls every day are nagging me because I want to keep SOME apps on my phone. Graphics are low. Games SUCK. The ONLY thing that they have going for them is PUSH EMAIL. Imap Idle is a solid. I love it. If not, you can sign up for nuevasync dot com, and you can get push email for gmail and push contacts and calendar. I've used it on WinMo, the iPhone and now I'll give it a try on the N900. It works very well.... So that should take care of the Push Email. If IM is well integrated and doesn't lose connection every 5 min (like android) or BB (every 6 hours on native IM apps) then I'll be SOOOOOOOOOOOO happy! :D. I just want a nice new device. Push email (multiple options here, and Nokia Messaging coming soon) and a nice OS. Let's see how the battery holds up :) I'm a heavy emailer and a heavy instant messenger (I will have to use GPRS like I used on the BB, which will be noticeably slower due to the lack of data compression).

I'm too excited about this change of device and OS to go back now. I've pre-ordered my N900, and im' excited. It's a change from the aging oses, Symbian & BBOS. Palm's Web OS, OSX and MAEMO seem like REALLY good Operating systems. Each with their pros and cons. OSX is simplistic. Palms Web OS is ... well... Palms Web Os xD Lol. And Maemo I've never had, and I'm going to give it a try :) I was debating between the Pre and the N900, and the huge keyboard was a deal breaker :D.

Really, what's YOUR reason for staying with blackberry? Company infrastructure? Then stay with BB. They're AWESOME at Push Email and making beautiful devices. But it's OS is archaic, yet functional. I need some bling bling.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

Being that modest supports imap idle, doesn't that mean that the n900 supports push email?
In which case it is just a case of your email provider supporting it (in my case that is me, so I do :-D)

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

Yes, that's exactly what will happen if Modest does support imap idle for maemo 5.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

i have the Bold, and the straight and simple is that you cant geek out with BlackBerries.

I have to give BB that their intuitive means of organizing contacts, and allowing you to select the means of communication (BBM, call, PIN, MMS, SMS, etc) right from within the contacts app is a real convenience. *AHEM* protocol association *AHEM*

The screen on the bold is like no other BlackBerries screen, but surfing the net on it SUCKS DONKEY NUTS. pages are zoomed out, scrolling every which way, because half the last word on a line is obscured beyond the side of the screen... if your trackball sensitivity isnt right, you cannot scroll to links that happen to be in an unfortunate place on the screen. overall hogwash in terms of usability.

the BIS or how the phone gets to the internet when using cellular or WiFi access proxies the connection with a squid 3.6 version (cool), but does not allow you to circumvent the proxy (not cool) and is proxied in canada (invasion of my rights to privacy as an American citizen) as those oppressed liberals watch my traffic even more closely than the Bush-ist PATRIOT act allows for. for those who care, i would need to put my squid instance into transparent/intercept mode, and make the linux box the default router on the network to force the blackberry through my proxy. The BES server for Exchange has a mechanism to allow the configuation of the proxy that the BBs uses, but i dont have that, dont run exchange, and dont want to invest that much into a phone that will be replaced with the n900.

The wifi stack is horrible, and frequently drops connection to my AP. Its the only device i have that does this. 2 laptops, printer, n800, wii - they all stay connected without problems. the bold wont stay connected for more than 10 - 20 mins, and then reverts back to cellular connectivity. PITA

the available apps for the BB arent that cool either. and the selection is poor. most are pay apps, and the few that are cool lose their luster quick. i really havent found too much in terms of useful or amusing apps that i would install on my bold. i found an ssh client, and was a bit apprehensive on using it, as i didnt know/trust the source. i removed it once i realized it could only go through the cellular network. screw that.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

I agree with this an pretty much all of the rest of your comment. I just wanted to know well the N900 compared to a couple of the strengths of the BlackBerry. I realize it has a number of weaknesses, especially the browser.

So, are you going to leave AT&T to get a N900? Do you feel the device is so good that it's worth switching networks?

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

http://www.forum.nokia.com/Tools_Doc...son.xhtml?dev=[N900,E72,N97]

check this out. I was comparing a few nokia devices just to see. Nokia Messaging is supported and so is Ovi Maps. :) Wooo!!!

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

My plan is to wait out the early adopters, and see what it takes to unlock the device, which is my right as an American consumer. I dont think it will be that hard to accomplish. I dont plan on leaving AT&T, as I get a business discount on hardware and services, but if they balk at the device I will be using, then they lose the business. I really dont have any other loyalty to them.

i got the bold 1) because my g/f wanted it and she is not allowed to "out geek" me. 2) motorola milked the RAZR too long (had 3 of them, good phone but got long in the tooth). 3) it has the OMAP 34xx processor. 4) supports SDHC. 5) supports A2DP.

there are several aspects of the bold that i think nokia should pay attention to.

firstly, like i commented before - the contacts app on the bold. no matter what kind of communication type you define for a contact, using that means natively is a click or two away.

second, and a big kudos to RIM for this one... a firewall that allows me to reject specific types of messaging. the phone can be configured to allow or deny SMS, MMS, PIN (for Blackberry Messenger or BBM), Blackberry Internet Service (cellular internet service) , and Enterprise Mail (Exchange eMail, if you attach to a Blackberry Enterprise Server or BES). Since i dont have a texting plan, i only allow PIN and Blackberry Internet Service. This prevents me from paying for "drive-by" and advertising texts.

Aside from those couple of notes, i expect the n900 to be more of what i want in terms of capability and functionality.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

I am an Nokia N95 user, ( so I am biased ) but I have NEVER seen the point of using a BB, I have ALWAYS got my IMAP emails in, ok most will say BB keyboard...but I honestly have not suffered W/O keyboard dont write novels on my pocket phone, I have a 3lbs Ultraportable Vaio for that.

EVERY user is sooooo different, I see people wanting to watch videos on their device I am not one of them ( YouTube OK).
and I do see a bit of difference between North American users and espicially Scandinavian ( Ericsson / Nokia Countries)
if people like BB for their needs fine for them, but I have a hard time seing BB devices ( I'm not fully up-dated) being much more than a phone with push email.
take into account that I've used 3G broadband for several years now, so that may be very different from your usage.
that is my 2 cents

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

The device is sold unlocked, so an AT&T SIM would give you GSM phone and EDGE data. Or am I missing something...

(BTW -- I had to chuckle about our "rights" as American consumers. As far as I can tell, we have one "right" -- to pay whatever the cell carriers want us to pay.)

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

The device is unlocked and will work with AT&T with 2.5G. But the frequencies used for 3G differ between between AT&T and T-Mobile. Nokia had to make a choice, and decided for the frequencies that allow it to operate in most countries.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

i make no assertion of knowledge on the following:

my kid bro has an HTC WinMo phone and has been able to flash it with different ROMs, that can activate "different radios" as he put it. He currently has Sprint as his provider, but his "radio settings" are what Verizon considers optimal. He says that the signal and coverage are better with these settings.

Would such a feature be able to get me true 3G access, or would i be stuck with some half-assed access? besides i thought all the rest of the world was ahead of the states in the mobile market and 3G was everywhere else, and we were lagging behind. seems to me that the GSM access would be better in most other places, than in the states.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

Well you'll love Nokia, then. You'll lose the PIN option, but gain SIP calling and IM in the contacts options. You can set defaults or choose at the time of the communication. If you aren't married to a BB server for business, the Nokia will be the over the top upgrade option. I don't see the appeal of BB, either outside of PUSH email, which Nokia Messaging provides, supporting 10 email accounts at once.

I'm a former N95 user and loyal Nseries flagship user for nearly 5 years now, having had 8 different devices in this time. I post all of my articles, reviews, and forum posts directly on my device, and I hate QWERTY, preferring T9 for better speed. I DO write "novels" on the device, having written this old review while walking my pit bull. (he's extremely strong, and probably walks me as much as I walk him, but typing on the N95 was no problem at all). Took about 25 minutes total, without a rough draft, spell check (as you can tell), or anything.

http://www.symbian-freak.com/news/00...ed_price_2.htm

The Nokia T9 implementation is underrated, but it smokes QWERTY on any device if you use it for a month or more straight.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

He's referring to the activation of the 800 or 850 MHz radio, which was deactivated on some branded WinMo devices. I thought maybe I could do the same for my N95-1, and quickly learned about all that stuff done by the great xda developers. You can unlock frequencies already present, but not add any.

As for the settings, that refers to the data compression done via the device. Certain carriers use different settings to keep the network running smooth and keeping bandwidth as open as possible. He may be using a less or more compressed setting to make things seem faster. But Nokia is known for having good network optimization out of the box, and the Symbian OS maturity is part of that.

So just know that no hackery can make the N900 work on at&t. There's a Chinese guy that manually does it by adding the proper radios, but I haven't tried it, and who wants to send his baby away that far?

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OK, so the #2 provider in the states (AT&T) is not going to let an n900 on its network (at least in a properly functioning mode), but Verizon which i can also get a discount with is using antiquated CDMA, unless you have a "world phone" and pay premiums for that service. Most of their phones dont have SIM cards. Since they have to "pay" for blackberries to be on their network, and pass that "savings" on to their customers, will i have to pay a "tax" to have the n900 on their network too?

several co-workers have blackberries on Verizon, and they pay the $30 data plan charge, plus the ~$15 "blackberry" data plan add on. I resent having to pay for whatever they botched up with RIM, just to have a device on their network.

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Are you kidding!? Wow... That's total BS. I pay 18 euros a month for my personal blackberry, and for a company corporate account BB you pay 15... Standard unlimited data plans are 12 euros or 10 euros a month (depending on speed). So they charge MORE for BB data plans, but 30 + 15!? WTF.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

Brendan, the number 2 carrier probably couldn't handle the traffic of the N900 at this point. It would perform badly in many areas of the US. at&t has sever capacity issues right now, which is why some apps are blocked on the iphone per at&t's alleged request.

TMo has great capacity and a growing network in the US. Coverage expands quickly, and they plan to boost speeds to 21mbps by next year.

You'll probably never see the N900 on Verizon. The production costs for such a small market would be probably prohibitive. Just my opinion, though. Anything's possible, but I think Verizon and Nokia won't get in bed until LTE launches next year.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

I got a Blackberry Bold (my first ever Berry) after getting sick of the T9 keyboard and the browser closing automatically for no reason at all. Typing IMs on fring was getting to be a pain too
I can type with one hand on the BB when necessary as it's small enough for one hand. The push mail is great and the indicator LED is great. The iPhone users get annoyed that they have to constantly unlock their phone to see if they've received any messages :p
I use the N82 mostly for skype via fring, the camera and text messaging when replying to SMSs sent to that number. Also, Garmin GPS is pretty good on the N82 but the Bold has a much nicer screen. Good enough for me to watch full length DivX/XviD movies as well as TV shows like say Top Gear for example.

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I would also say the majority of my emailing is done from the Bold since I got it last August. The keyboard is great and I can touch type while watching TV easily.
The majority of my browsing is done on here as well. The first thing I did was to install Opera like I did on my N82 and that works well. The standard BB browser is fine and you can use column view to see evrything on the screen but I find it easier using the 2 and 8 to pague up and down quickly on Opera.
I read somewjere that RIM bought up a company that will make their browser much better.

I stayed away from the Storm due to lack of wifi, divx and keyboard.

The N900 would be an N82 replacement. I'm not siure about downgrading that great xenon flash though. I am due a free upgrade and have my eyes on the SE Satio for the 12MP with both xenon and LED flash (and it's Symbian) or the N900. I would really like the N900 if it can do everything I want to overcome my reservations of the missing xenon flash.

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PS. I'm a BIS user (internet email, personal not business).

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And I agree, the RAM can get low. Or at least the Bold should allow installing applications on the internal 1gb storage or my 16gb SDHC card and maximize the RAM available for actual phone functionality in practice.
My N82 has Garmin installed on the SDHC card and it's great, so I see no reason not to have the option to install on memory cards.
I have read somewhere that Blackberry App World *may* install on the 45hc. That or archove uninstalled apps on there if you want to restore in future.

I hope the N900 will allow application installation on the 32gb internal (or external) storage.
Leave that lovely 256mb RAM and the 768 swap file available for the running of the machine :)

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

I guess we'll have to wait and see :P Even though I've read many reviews (previews?) about the N900, and it's CERTAINLY going to be the best phone out there (in my personal opinion). I just want to see if the Keyboard has some good travel, and I can type w/o having to look (like on my bold). I know it'll take time to get used to, but hey. :) I don't mind.
Push email, always online, great UI. I'm game.

Re: N900 vs Blackberry User Experience Questions
 

I'm hopeful too.
And excited by the potential.
Imagine going to a friend's house, connect up the N900 to the TV and use bluetooth joysticks/pads to play Streetfighter via MAME.

Ok this should probably be another discussiom :d