KDE Anyone ?
 

Yes this is real, and it runs surprising ok, I still have a lot to set up, its about 600MB + flash

KDE 3.4.3 on N800, oh how sweet it is!! Now thats a screen shot!! And konqurer runs real nice too...


http://www.penguinbait.com/Screenshot-VNC.png

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Thats awesome!
You have a pm.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

penguinbait you think gkrellm would be possible to port?
I know some body try once for the OS2006 but it was not posible..
What do you think?

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

is this same kind of "trick" that thoughtfix did with windows ?
:-)

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Am i the only one that sees the VNC title bar? :o

Ton.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Guess it is the method he uses to capture the screen since he cannot use the classical applet used for maemo.

As far as I remember it was the same when the first images of ROX appeared.

Omar

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

TBH, that makes you *really* appreciate the Hildon interface: there's about 240px of usable browser space, the rest being taken up my UI elements much too large for the screen.

That's going to be the problem with many of these hacks, unfortunately.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

IIRC, just about anything can be turned off in KDE, e.g. the statusbar is completely collapsible. The same goes for Konqueror (doesn't it have a fullscreen mode?).

Now, "600 MB +" makes me go "Ouch!", but I guess that with 8 GB cards now and bigger coming, I really should recalibrate my ouch-threshold.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

This type of thing is very exciting and I really enjoy seeing progress porting things. I wish there was some way to make a clean transition to KDE or some other mature environment without missing critical parts-- device-specific controls for bluetooth/network, handwriting/keyboard input, and power management including locking/turning off the screen. The most painful problem revolves around input, since without a hardware keyboard and mouse KDE (and other environments) is somewhat crippled. It's really nice to have the Hildon keyboard pop up for all the text input fields, and not having a middle/right mouse button equivalent for KDE is rough. I've tried hacking on the X server to enable a bluetooth mouse but haven't had much luck yet-- displaying a cursor is easy, getting it to do anything, not so much.

Back on topic, how much memory does KDE use, penguinbait? I imagine it'd be kind of a tight fit in 128M.

Larry

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

If that is real... then damn.. Great job on getting all those libraries to compile for the arm. Now.. we get a righclick and we would reallly have something.


(I soo need to get my sdk running again so I can tinker with this stuff)

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

But KDE.. this must mean that QT has been ported then? I wasn't aware of that.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Xscribble (http://www.handhelds.org/projects/xscribble.html) is a Grafitti-lookalike for Linux. It works but, being window-based, its user-friendliness is rather low on the scales.

There's also wayV (http://www.stressbunny.com/wayv/) which is kinda cool because it doesn't need a dedicated window,
there was KGesture, but that hasn't been ported to KDE3 (http://www.botch.com/~mpilone/projects/kgesture.php), so unless penguinbait wants to port KDE2, you're SOL there.
Libstroke (http://www.etla.net/libstroke/) is another one I remember, but it too seems to be non-maintained.

Mind you, these are all character recognizers (which arguably the N800's native stroke recognizer is also), not handwriting recognizers, of which Linux has the overwhelming number of 0 (zero).

Does anybody want to join me in an email-nagging campaign (again!) to PhatWare (http://www.phatware.com/) to get them to port Calligrapher (http://www.phatware.com/calligrapher/index.html#wa) or, preferrably, PenOffice (http://www.phatware.com/penoffice/index.html) to Linux? Obviously either with a source code release, or with versions for different CPU architectures (I have an old tablet pc that would be very happy to run Linux). I'll tell you up front that the odds for success are discouraging, but hey! email is cheap, right?

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

qt and kde libs compile without changes. Just straight compile. kdebase, I had to hack the makefile to skip joystick, but otherwise compiled great. Look this is real. (As stated by others, yes its VNC connected to the n800) BELIEVE IT OR NOT. I think my reputation here, should tell you that I am not full of &$^%#, well mostly ;) I will post some video when I get some time. It was about 600MB but there is a lot of source mixed in there, I have not gotten kdepim to compile completely yet, that what I am working on next. Also KDE tries to find all the apps, and does, but errors, because it does not understand the hildon, in the menu entries. It does not load its own applications in the menu, at this point, but all the apps work.

Also yes, you can do full screen in konqurer and remove the toolbars, I was in a hurry to sleep when I posted this last night. Also the kde panel also folds away quite niceley. Also kshortcut, allows you to set the harware keys to shortcuts, and they can all be different for each application, what a novel idea.


Aflegg, no offense, nothing makes me appreciate the hildon interface, its an alright menu launcher, and toolbar? And dont get me wrong the development that has been put into it to makes it nice. They have done a wonderful job. But its not really hildon that is the issue. Matchbox is the problem, I want a windowed display. I have great vision, I can read really tiny fonts, and I can make any interface I want on this thing, thats just awesome... And one last thing, this is no hack, just straight compile, it might be a hack by the time I make it useable though.


I think we should start a KDE build team, and do this right.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Penguinbait: Does this mean that you're abandoning any further development of OPENBOX-ROX? And 770 users?

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

No it does not, OPENBOX-ROX is great, I like it anyway, and it totals about 100MB. (and thats mostly other software) KDE will be much larger, probably 500MB. I have setup openbox, blackbox, matchbox, fluxbox, window maker, afterstep, gnome, kde. So far ROX seems to be the best desktop environemt I can make, and its easily configurable/hackable, although WindowMaker and Afterstep are also nice. KDE is running really nicely though, is it superfast? like openbox and rox, nope, it is slower that hildon?, nope its about the same.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

penguinbait: if you've had QT luck, can you get me armel packages of QT/Embedded? (Ideally, scratchbox-i386 packages as well.)

Trust me when I say the results -might- be surprising. ;)

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

I'm sorry i fthis is off-topic on this thread, but will ROX run on the 770? And what about afterstep / window maker?

I know the N800 has pretty much horsepower more than the 770, so I guess there could be some problem (apart from the space, but hey! I finally got a 2gig card!) running it on the 770... :(

Omar

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

If you want the copies I have of the QT libs, send me an PM and I will send you a link, it might be a several days before I can zip it up for you and give you the link though.

However if you have scratchbox already, just download qt-x11-free-3.3.7.tar.gz. Follow the insctructions, you can be setup and compiled in about 2 hours, another hour for kdelibs if you need them.

Note this is not the embedded version, the QT embedded version does not use X, it has its own display server. I chose not to compile the embedded for several reasons, number one, having to setup the display properly, when it already is working, and more importantly, I want to be able to compile all sorts of software, and X is kind important, I dont want to be in the matchbox/hildon boat all over again.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

The first two tarballs I have posted work on the 770, the latest openbox seems to not be working on the 770, but I have not been given enough to go on by the community to figure out why it is not working, I have no 770 to test with sorry....

So again ROX on Window Maker will run and has been posted, Window Maker, also run without ROX and has been posted. Afterstep has not been posted anywhere and I do not know if it would run on the 770? I have afterstep if anyone wants to play, but it is just tarball with no menus or setup by me in anyway, so you would be on your own.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Anyone tried compiling Enlightenment v.17? I tried a while ago and ran into compile errors with the touch screen tslib (can't remember which library though). Maybe I could have hacked the makefile and got it to compile? I think it's memory footprint would be much smaller than KDE and it's already been used on the Zaurus. Anyway...I plan to try eventually.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Actually I have tried every combo out there, and I could not get enlightenment to compile. I do not remember why though..

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

I forgot....nice job getting KDE to run!

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

I'll just add that I'm impressed by the guts that got you to even try this.. and that it worked out too! Good stuff! :) @penguinbait: There's a beer on me if I ever run into you.:D

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

OK, you can't offer me beer if you run into me, and not tell me where you hang out, so I can get my beer.

1 Guiness Draft please...

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

I do think it would be possible to port, anything is possible. Unfortunately, I would not be able to do this. 1) if is does not straight compile, and its not a simple dependency problem or easily removing references to 386/686 from makefiles. It also looks like there is a lot going on, on that thing. I have seen that on screen shots, and I always wondered what it was called.

Anyway , sorry no luck here. If I get my gnome scratchbox up again, I will try again but its unlikely.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

cool thanks for your respon!
Grate work on KDE!!!!!
If you need testers let me know I have 2 770 and 1 N800

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

@penguinbait
Very nice work. Its hard to believe that KDE is that fast. So there is only the size reason left for not using KDE.

Would it be possible to compile a complete Linux Distro from Scratchbox?
Im thinking of Gentoo Linux since you can compile it from scratch.
If this is possible then we can compile all software from Gentoo portage
in Scratchbox and make packages for the Nokia devices.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Well I think you are a bit more ambitious than me. Yes I would love to see a armel distribution from scratch. And yes I did get KDE running, I know I said it was not slow. I may be a little slow, but its also a straight compile and not been optimized for this device. I really like the way this is running, but its a tad slow at times, I also have not setup any paging device yet, this will help a bit.

I think we should get a team of developers together to put out a KDE alternative to hildon/matchbox environment.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

That's actually not a bad idea; since all Internet Tablets within a series are essentially identical, the optimisation only has to be done once and then a compiled image can be created for all who want to install it, SDHC and USB host support could be included by default, as well as the option to install everything on the memory card.

I'm wary about the hardware recognition though: Are all the specs really open? Will a homebrew Gentoo distro give the same level of hardware control we get from Nokia's "distro"? What stylus input package are you going to install?

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Thats the excact reason I chose not to compile qt/kde embedded. There was already a working X server with stylus support, no need for me to reinvent the wheel.

BTW, I figured out how to get all my menus and configurations for KDE working, I might actually be able to put out a tarball of this. I compiled qt in place so the /usr/local/qt dir is like 370MB by itself. If I recompile and tell it where to install, I can significantly shrink that down. That being said right now in bz2 format its about 160MB, uncompressed to about 600+.

It is working really well, just got to remember to wait a few sec's, dont keep clicking.
finally got control center open, oh this is really cool.

I started looking into garage, but my projects seem to big to upload, not sure if there is a way around this? I might as well start looking for a place to host this, figure about 150MB, should be ready in a week or two. PM me if you have somewhere I can host this. I will post some video as soon as I have time....

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

qt-embedded + a bit of work on my part = full, working J2ME (well, no bluetooth or sound, but working network and graphics!)

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

This is precisely why I would suggest gentoo :). The number of apps in portage is much higher than the number ported maemo apps will ever be.
With maemo the nokia tablets are just PDA devices, with gentoo (or another distro with large community) they are UMPC.
Ok closed specs could be a problem, but there are people who are running gentoo on ipaq PDA (<- windows...) or on zaurus.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Modulok: Gentoo or Redhat or ubuntu or anything else, you have to compile everything. Just because you have gentoo, does not mean your audience or software pool is any bigger. You still have to compile every bit of the software you want to run on gentoo or other.

So I am not seeing the benefit?

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

https://home.comcast.net/~penguinbait/kde1.JPG

https://home.comcast.net/~penguinbait/kde2.JPG

https://home.comcast.net/~penguinbait/kde3.JPG


https://home.comcast.net/~penguinbait/kde-n800.avi


Not the best buts its all I am up for at the moment, seee, its real!!

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Penguinbait:

I'd like to thank you for the ground-breaking experimentation you're doing on all our behalf(ves?). I'll be trying out some of it this weekend.

But, did I see a VNC Server icon on one of your ROX desktops? How did you get it working on the N800?

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

That is really great to see-- konqueror on the n800! It would nice if there was some way you could distribute these beta copies of things easily. Maybe a bit torrent hosted somewhere? You could always start a sourceforge project and link to it from a Maemo Garage project, using SF to host the files. It's certainly something to consider if you don't mind packaging things up occasionally. If not, I may have to build my own copy since this is making me very curious about the possibilities. May have to hack on the X server some more to get bluetooth mice working.

Larry

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Software in the "pool" of a big Linux distribution works often nicely with the structure (configuration files) of this distro. I would choose Gentoo just because it is sourcecode based Linux distro. All others I work with are not.
Someone also found a debian pool for amel packages

http://www.internettablettalk.com/fo...ead.php?t=4633

The simple idea is to connect to a larger community to get more support.
The maemo project only reaches developers who have a maemo based PDA (more precisely the N800...). This is obviously only a small fraction of the Linux developer community.

Nevertheless you already did a geat job.

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

The biggest problem with Gentoo would be the size. I used to use gentoo all the time, and still use it for creating custom live cds.. however.. on a normal running system, with only X installed, not even a window manager.. your looking at 1.5 gigs for portage downloads, source, and binaries

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

Perhaps you should try to recompile Gentoo with "-Os", delete
the distfiles, delete /var/tmp/ get rid of some dependencies (see use flags) ...

Look here

http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-178887.html

Its in German. He writes that the running system is currently 6Mb large...

Re: KDE Anyone ?
 

If I ever get my 770 back from Nokia, I will surely try this. Couple of questions though:
1. Did anyone try this except for penguinbait?
2. Is there a (basic!) "HOWTO" available?
3. Is the USB Host support enabled?

Cheers.