Reliability of the N800
 

After spending time searching this forum and reading the various reviews it like the Nokia N800 COULD replace my Dell X50v. It only needs better Video performance and USB Host capability to be complete.

Its larger screen will help my eyes but what is holding me up, besides a complete lack of linux knowledge, is the reports of screen problems and the random reboots. Since Nokia Service seems to be less than ideal I am wondering what is the chance of getting a bad unit? It seems to be high but I know a person usually only reports problems not sucess.:confused:

Also how hard is the N800 to figure out for the complete Newbe? Seems Nokia could take some lessons from MS and Apple in making a consistant user interface. It seems to be incomplete in many areas. ???

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

the interface itself is actually rather intuitive, based on its simplicity. Both a blessing and a curse.

My n800 has never actually crashed on me. I have had no hardware issues, or default software issues with mine what so ever.. all my problems are strictly user introduced.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

remjax- you are less of a newbie than I, I hadn't used any sort of small electronic device (PDA-esque) before 2 days ago. It took me a bit to understand how things work on it, but I'm already getting the hang of it and I know nothing about Linux. I'm a WinXP guy. So far, no crashes, just me ignoring the "low battery" warnings, which of course means I have to wait while it charges. Hoping to customize it a bit and get the email set up today...
- SL

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Sam, only running two days and already low battery warnings.. what are you doing man? Also whats your brightness at.. I run my at half all the time.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Only had mine a few weeks but am enjoying it a lot.

Things it doesn't do that a PocketPC can are view/open MS Office documents. PDF is fine. Web browsing is great, Opera has a few issues. Hopefully the email app and video will be improved.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Thanks for the information folks.

I have started converting my .doc files to .rtf which solves one problem.

My most used programs I will havae to find replacement for are:

uBook (Ebook reader)-best one bar none! FBreader is getting there but not there yet.

Olivetree Bible reader - Has Esword been ported?

Mort player - lowest cpu time on my Dell & I like the interface.

Looks like I will me taking a closer look come Income tax refund time! Then I am sure I will have MORE questions!

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

I have had to reflash my n800 about 5 times to get out of a stalled system. Can someone give me an example of a user-caused crash? All I have done is installed availble programs and eventually run into problems.

I'm not complaining, but if no one else is occasionally having to reflash, how am I causing this?

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Hello remjax,

Welcome. The N800 is a pretty good piece of kit. It is not quite ready for the mass market but it is very useful. I have had mine for a few weeks, and have only once regretted the purchase and that was related more to this forum than anything else. Other than that you have a nice piece of gear that is for sure a conversation starter.:)

Install the apps: GizmoProject for one, and some of the other that are available and you will pretty much surprised at the functionality that is provided.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Hello! I've had my n800 since about the middle of January and haven't
regretted it at all. Out of the box, it's very intuitive for a new user if you have
some basic computer knowledge. The web browsing experience is overall
enjoyable though opera does have a few shortcomings next to firefox. The
outdated version of flash hasn't been much of an issue for me but that can vary
depending on what sites you frequent personally. I was installing apps that had
.install files the second day of owning it (which are a really great way for
newbies to install apps and will be even better once more programs start
coming with these) and just learned how to install apps using repositories last
week thanks to all the great information on this forum.

I have had it lock up while I was on the road trying to find a wifi signal to look something up but that was fixed by taking the battery out, putting it back in, and turing it back on. That's not enough to bother me after using Windows since '95.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

remjax: The 770 (or some of the units) had a hardware screen problem. The N800 doesn't. However, there are some (a few) reports about another type of screen problem, which isn't the actual LCD but instead a sensitivity problem with the digitizer (touch-screen) near the side of the display. Others will have a better idea of how many units we're talking about, e.g. Texrat. I've only seen my own unit, and the hardware is good in every way.

Edit: About random reboots: Yes, I've experienced them. But, they _only_ happen when the unit is idle.. I've never had any type of crash of the OS while using the unit. I use it a lot. But, occasionally when it's just sitting there, not connected to a network but possibly searching, I suddenly hear the Nokia jingle and it has rebooted. The cause of this is known by Nokia (it's a watchguard program that detects that the DSP doesn't respond, and decides to deliberately reboot the unit in a controlled fashion -- this is not a 'crash and burn' thing). Presumably they have a fix too, in the near future.
But, as it only happens when it's idle.. it's never impacted my use of the N800. Then there's also a case of timed reboots around midnight or something like that, this is caused by the alarm system having somehow gotten an entry which tells it
to do so (a calendar event, if you want). I haven't seen this. In any case it's easy to fix.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

I'm pretty much a newbie to this neck of the woods. I bought a n800 to be a x50v replacement. So far, I think the only thing really holding me back is internet access via USB to a PC. Which I think you can do, I've just not figured it out yet.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

The N800 has wifi-capability so I don't think the USB connectivity would be necessary. If you have wireless networks in your range, you can click on the globe in the upper right hand corner, select connection and connect.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

I've had my n800 for about 10 days, and I'm keeping it. :-)

The likelihood of getting a bad unit is anybody's guess. Mine exhibits pretty good build quality. Some screen shadowing, a minor annoyance, is the only obvious deficiency. It's only visible on white screens and under some lighting conditions. As you've no doubt read here, this is an issue with the current screen technology.

To be honest, though, I'm avoiding adding RSS newsfeeds to the borked reader. Even the Nokia team admits it needs to be rewritten.

So that's two small strikes, one of which is fixable and the other tolerable. You mentioned the notorious video performance, too, which we've heard will improve. This is a serious deficiency. I watched an hour-long mpeg and the performance was barely acceptable, as long as I didn't go full screen which caused intermittent freezes. By most reports, the email client is crummy.

The fact is the n800 does a few key things superbly and that is quite enough for me. I surf, do email (through a web client), and read ebooks. Using FBReader is a delight, and in rendering quality the n800 puts to shame my faithful aging Ebookwise/GEB 1150 while offering text as clean as Sony's e-ink machine.

As for Linux, I'm a newbie learning as I go along. That's half the fun, isn't it? In truth, you need no Linux at all to get started. Some software can be installed quickly and easily, while other packages need you to identify a repository. In some cases this means installing separate libraries if you want to get something like the very good Evince reader running. That sounds more daunting than it turns out to be. Installing the libraries for Evince (which displays comics) took me about 15 minutes of searching this forum and making one or two tries, not such a burden, eh?

Learning the n800 interface is child's play. Yes, it's got idiosyncrasies, but it isn't nearly as problematic as some purists have argued. I was impressed by the Newton developer's blast at the Nokia GUI--and he makes many good points--until I got my hands on the n800 and found it plenty practicable. As for taking interface lessons from MS, good lord. Happily Nokia hasn't. ;-)

My chief interface complaint is the physical rocker buttons on the top. They're too small, too tightly spaced and require fussy manipulation. They should be redesigned. The front panel buttons are much better.

I give the device an A- for web browsing, B+ for overall design, and a C- for overall execution (mainly because it's broken in some advertised areas). That said, it's usable and enjoyable today.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

I like my N800 too.. :)

But I wouldnt give A for Opera browser, course I have had some problems with it. Sometimes add bookmark doesnt work and it does open window that doesnt accept any buttons you press and then you get bookmark called null. Also I have had some problems with flash, everyone knows that old flash version doesnt work so well, but also sometimes I have got window that cant be closed. Something that says that.. Wait it could have been Java window, but anyway that.. its running script that can make your computer slow.. Keep running it or cancel.. After I did try cancel it wouldnt close anymore.
Also sometimes Opera browser doesnt just load pages, it just stops middle of loading and usually refresh helps.

Havent had problems with RSS reader.. Whats wrong with that?

Anyway.. N800 is great :)

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Personally, I've had the 770 RSS reader filling up the entire internal Flash partition once. It hasn't happened on the N800, though.

The e-mail client is slated to be rewritten; the new client will be built on top of tinymail, which is a super-slimmed down libcamel, the e-mailing backend of Evolution. Hopefully we get it soon!

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

I have had 0 problems with the RSS reader. I'm using my N800 in a Nevada library as I type and really feel like an elite user -- no bulky laptop for me! Still, for the normal user I would have to take some points off because Linux is the basis of the environment. Sure, fanarics like me use and like it, but many users wouldn't like to abandon some of their favorite programs or sites to use Linux, not to mention the problems they might have to deal with.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

.... Your not missing out on websites because its Linux. Linux is just the kernel.. the brain of the OS. Your missing some websites because they run java and this version of the opera browser doesn't support it. its not a linux problem.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Yeah, I have WiFi access at home and often on the move, but not at work. To be a full replacement for my PDA I need (free) internet access on the device during the day.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

My PDA is a Samsung SCH i730 PDA phone running Windows Mobile 5.0. I wirelessly syncs, through the cell phone to my MS Outlook syncing email, calander, ToDo, files etc. It also has limited ability to read/edit MS Office files.

In order for Marvin (Named after the paranoid robot in Hitchhiker’s Guide) to replace my PDA he would have to be able to do all these things. Granted that the hardware (tethered to a cell phone with Bluetooth) is probably capable of doing all that, but so far the open source community has not been able to come up with the necessary software.

From reading posts here and at Maemo, these shortcomings are well known, and someone is probably working on some or all of them, but until then Marvin remains a high tech toy.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

I like my N800. haven't had problems with the RSS reader. The lack of a current version of flash is a problem for some sites but not most of the ones I go to. some AJAX sites wont work but Minimo got me through that. The lack of codec support is annoying and Mplayer apparently wont take a stream from twonkymedia. But that may be a Mplayer issue and not a Nokia issue. The calendar program appears to be able to subscribe to online calendars so i'm thinking I could use that to sync with my local Mac BUT being unable to sync with my Mac PIM is a growing problem and keeps me using my wrist PDA.

Installing Gizmo has opened up possibilities but so long as I have to deal with a phone plan for the land line, it's real usefulness is limited as I'm not paying yet another company for phone service.

Maemo Mapper is also coming in quite useful and has helped me find places (and parking in NYC) and having the map in my hand has proven very valuable.

Like Wotin said, it's still a high tech toy, but I foresee it becoming more than that if a PIM syncing app finds it's way to the platform.

On a side note, this thing has shown me the disturbing number of people who have wide open WIFI out there. Scary.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Oh,

and if anything, this product WOULD definitely warm me to an iPhone.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

The more serious problems are extremely rare. I have 95% confidence any random purchaser will not experience them (sorry, can't divulge the details!). They only seem more prevalent than they really are here due to the nature of this forum.

The device isn't hard to figure out-- for general use. It gets progressively more difficult the deeper you get into usability that isn't readily available. However, you will find this forum a valuable resource there.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

I spoke too soon in vouching for the RSS reader. Under some circumstances, the cache gets corrupted and it would lock the device up (triggering automatic reboot), until you remove the cache manually.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

How did you remove the cache manually?

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

I have just picked up a N800 and I have no reboots and no screen problems.
The device works as promised, but feels a bit 'unfinished'. Streaming audio/video is 90% NOT working (trust me, I've tried) and the device itself is not 100% stable yet. But firmware updates may improve these problems.
The biggest let-down to me personally is the unfunctional videoconferencing. Google Talk? Don't think so. Jabber? Don't think so either. Skype? Where?

I really like the N800, but it's still in beta in my opinion. I think Nokia rushed it because of all the other gadgets (like iPhone) being released. The N800 got great potential though.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

It is quite common and acceptable in Open Source to release beta-quality software and rely heavily on the feedback of users.

So, congratulations! you're a N800 beta-tester. Welcome to the fold. Resistence is futile, etc...

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Nokia didn't rush the N800 due to the iPhone; they're not really in the same device space. Nokia's intent was to gain the early foothold into the wifi-enabled internet device space.

Yes, there are certainly some gaps, and they're being addressed. Just hang tight where missing functionality is concerned, and enjoy the other functions!

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Hmm, maybe my post sounded a little negative. Not my intention.
I like the N800 a lot, I really do. But I feel that, when polished, it could be great. Browsing is neat, but could be better. Wifi reception is very good.
The screen is brilliant in every way, the resolution just about perfect. The zooming function is very good and smooth.
The camera is next to useless now. I don't get that. And streaming doesn't work at all. Don't get that either.

Overall, at this point: Nice gadget. Nothing more, nothing less. And yes, I enjoy that. But don't wait too long with the fixes...

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

ha, einstein, all your sentiments were echoed a year ago with the n770 and the fix was to issue the n800! :D

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

lol@Phi

Well yeah, I agree. But the 770 was to slow to be useful. The N800 has greater potential. (I hope...)
I'll keep my fingers crossed.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Well, after spending some time with the N800, I can't be anything but dissapointed.

Battery life: bad. The battery sometimes discharges itself when the device is supposed to be off.

Streaming audio/video: not working 99% of the time

Videoconferencing: not working

Videoplayback: 99% 'no codec' error

Browser crashes randomly 3-4 times per hour

This device isn't finished and the new firmware doesn't solve any of these problems.
If you're stil in doubt of buying a N800: don't. You can do better things with your money. I am sorry I bought mine.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Einstein, I agree with you 100000%. This is a device is no where near ready from prime time or even play time. What kind of device is it when it gets stuck in a loop rebooting and rebooting and rebooting, and the only way to fix it is to put in a Linux disk? This makes no sense at all. I could be wrong but many of those working on developing software for this device do not pay the full price that we non-developers pay retail. I have spent many days reading this forum and seeing what is written about this thing. For the most part is it not a device meant for the average Joe. It is a nice gizmo, early adopter plaything, but not really practical in any way. There is no syncing software, the video works sometimes (better now than before), the battery is well moving right along. In short this is an barely finished device that will appeal more to the developer side of the house. Nokia screwed the pooh with this device. Mine will go in the draw and sit there until maybe some apps come out to make this a more usable device.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Any of you want to sell your N800? And for what price?

Mind you, after your damning criticisms, I'm not going to pay you even close to full price. After all, you both claim it's basically worthless...

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Goes in the draw. Thanks for the offer. Luckily I make enough money to throw it away on stuff like this.

Didn't mean to sound smug. Luckily working for the govt allows me to get things to test and demo for the govt. I was going to hook up SE with a nice contract until they said that they will not support Mac. The US Navy just bought a bunch of Mac servers and laptops and wanted to use SE phones (1000 to start), but SE said they do not care and won't support them. Needless to say, Nokia got my recommendation.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

@Karel

Value is never based on opinion. So thanks, but no thanks.
Mine is going in the box it came in. Maybe I can make somebody happy with it, I also don't really need the money.

I don't like umpc's and I don't like this thing. Looks like I'm stuck with my Thinkpad T60 again.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Dang! I could have used a second one...

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Lol! What would you do with two N800's?

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

Why, one for the couch and one for the road, obviously. My 770 is now permanently shacked up in my bedroom where it serves light duty as a very nice ebook reader.

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

No offense guys, but maybe you should read about a device before you purchase. It all depends on what you want to do with the device. If you did not know what you were buying, and how it worked, its probably a sure thing that most products you buy would not make you happy. It seems to me you need to put a little blame on yourself if you purchased something that does not work for your purposes. The 770 is a well documented platform, if you were fooled by the fancy packaging on the n800, this seems like its your issue. I have some nice waterfront property for sale in florida if you are interested. I had a 21 day return policy at Compusa, which was plenty of time to evaluate the device and determine if it fits your needs. So forgive me if I do not feel sorry for you making bad decisions. Would you buy a car without a test drive? Would you marry a virgin? Not I :cool:

Sorry if it seems a bit harsh, I had a 770 for a year, and I am very happy with the n800. Personally I think if you are not a linux savy person, you should probably not purchase the 770 or n800 unless it works for you as is, you can't count on possible software or firmware releases in the future will make it so you like the device. I agree you wasted your money, just not sure Nokia is completely at fault, a little of that blame falls on your shoulders!


Take note, you don't often see me defending Nokia :)

Re: Reliability of the N800
 

@penguinbait,

I did not ask for your pity or that of anyone here in this forum. I am simply stating a fact about a device that Nokia is marketing as a finished product, ready from mass market up take, but which is actually suited for developers, in terms of availability and price. As for it being Linux, or Palm, or Windows Mobile, I could not care less. I only want functionality and not to have to load a Linux disk because a Nokia product is having a bad day and can not be fixed even by reformatting the device. For this I do blame Nokia. They made the OS, and bear the the responsibility for the good and the bad. They got paid for it. I didn't bounce a check to them, or say come back with I have Euro Version 2.0. I know that devices need upgrades and have quirks. I was prepared to live with this, but at retail prices, I feel that I am not getting what I paid for.

The N800 is well suited to be a practical device but in terms of software, and the everyday things that most people would need it for, it is lacking. If you can't see that I can recommend a good eye doctor to you. As for a 21 day return policy. Great to have but some of us live in Europe, me in Finland, and I don't have this policy. Another moot point.

As I said, I will put my N800 in a draw, continue to read these forums and see if any advances have been made that would make this a device that is more appealing to those that aren't developers.