The moon is the door to the solar system
 

The high cost to the human race's colonisation of space is caused by the complexity and danger of reaching and leaving escape velocity within the earth's atmosphere.

The Space Shuttle turned out to be an expensive and dangerous white elephant, the reason the Shuttle was so expensive is, because of its complexity with millions of different manufactured parts, and the need to cover it with bathroom tiles.

There is another route, we can reach the edge of space no problem Burt Rutan proved this with Space Ship one, when he won the 'X' prize by reaching over 100 km twice in one week.

Yes the Shuttle was 'reusable' but in name only. They could not have turned that around in a week.

What NASA should be doing is creating rocket fuel on the moon, there is lots of water on the moon, use solar energy to split water into hydrogen and oxygen, which when combined make very good rocket fuel, because of Newton's third law.

Use the rocket fuel to fuel a space tug, use the space tug to accelerate and decelerate Space Ship one, to and from escape velocity in the safe vacuum of space, no atmosphere = no friction = no heat = no bathroom tiles and no foam shielding on the external fuel tank.

Less bathroom tiles + insulation foam = less rocket fuel = less pollution in the Mexican Gulf.

Once we can accelerate and decelerate space craft with rocket fuel that is obtained from outside of the earth's gravity well, space travel becomes cheaper by many orders of magnitude, ok the capital cost would be very high, but once the systems are in place, the number of human beings, living in space increases exponentially.

A good example for the way very high capital cost projects work, is the Panama canal.

http://dollyknot.com

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Hello kolos, nilchak, pasih, WilliePre and zairs

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

The only way out is up.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

im in orbit now!

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

I like the site. The feature on rollerman was fun.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

bathroom tiles? damn someone has pretty expensive taste for interior decorating....

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Then why not give the link?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qQ56qYy3r8

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

The decor for some people has more importance for some folk than the context.

Are you aware of the difference between 'top down' thinking and 'bottom up' thinking?

Or perhaps you think 'thinking' has no verticality of direction?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

but the panama canal has an instant and recognisable cash benefit for the massive outlay, while space exploration sadly does not, now if the moon was full of unobtainium... :P

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

I am aware about the fact that bathroom tiles and ceramic tiles manufactured to spaceships thermal shields differ so much that those have nothing in common. details matter especially because you seem to know for what the tiles are about..

and btw the tiles aren't for ascending at all, they're needed for descending only and just to make spacecraft reusable, nothing more.

and btw it would be realistic to discount the capital costs to the end price. for example if I pay 5 million dollars for a oil rig and I get 40 cent discount per fuel liter for that and I drive 10k km per year with 7l/100km average consumption for my whole life, is it worth it?

spoiler: I would save 18 million dollars in total, but with 5% interest the discounted price spent to oil rig would be 98 million dollars.... so in the last line there is only one number: $-80000000 (sorry for non-american marking of that)

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Plz try to imagine we are having this debate after http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferdinand_de_Lesseps had succeeded with building the Suez canal, but failed at trying to build the Panama canal.

And before the Americans had a try, imagine yourself standing before the American establishment and trying to raise the capital?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Of course hasn't.
Thoughts, by nature, expands in cloud shape, no way to direct it.
Why are you supposing directionality in the essence of human think?
How arrogant that assertion is, how can you introduce a concept obviously pointing to deterministic theories which only can result in failure?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

[QUOTE=ossipena;660078]I am aware about the fact that bathroom tiles and ceramic tiles manufactured to spaceships thermal shields

Why do you think bathroom tiles and spaceship tiles have nothing in common, is it because you are god and must win every argument?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

So you disagree with the idea that once an elephants trunk started to grow due to evolution, it had an inherent teleology then?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Wikipedia does not have an article with this exact name. Please search for Ferdinand de Lessepshad in Wikipedia to check for alternative titles or spellings.... good link!

and the search for alternative spellings failed too, forgive me for not immediately addressing the issues of advanced space flight with my mind in a previous century with a timescale referenced by a persons efforts i know little about. my bad!

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

So sorry.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferdinand_de_Lesseps

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

One more time taking suppositions as facts.
Why so thin attachment between EVOLUTION and teleology?
This is not the first time I must read this kind of assertions.
Please, you must reconsider your argument line, leaving sociological myths, and adopting the newer ways for solving this kind of issues.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

One question though: What for?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Your post is as clear as mud, let us declare this a win for you 'coz I have not a clue what you are talking about.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

One question though: What for?

More sex :)

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

So then, at last, we agree.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

well if we were having this debate between the suez canal and panama attempt, my rebuttle would be along the lines of "my good man i believe you are overdue back to the insanium, why to put a man into space is proposterous my old bean! whoever would have heard such poppycock!"

however i believe you are referring to the pioneering spirit of said projects, and again its entirely down to money. if i was trying to convince the americans to front the money i would know exactly who to go to. the ones who would make money from this venture. now who will make immediate and almost instant fiscal advantage from the massive amount of money they would have to invest? at this time no one. so now is not the time it will happen.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

if i have to travel millions of miles and possibly decades for it i think i'll just stay home and watch porn.

never mind once you find something its even possible to have sex with, its very likely the dregs outside any nightclub at 3am will look soooo much more promising in comparison!

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

"Everything under the sun is in tune
But the sun is eclipsed by the moon"

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

And you have no clear definition for the term 'arrogance'?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Yes, of course.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

arrogance is to confidence what ignorance is to innocence.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

funny thing is the apollo spacecraft that went to the moon probably had less technology than our phones :) how much you want to bet china will open up space exploration they are the richest country right now

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

That reminds me:

"...juntas y revuelves
azul y amarillo
sale el color verde
no es magia
es sencillo..."

Sorry, I can't translate its meaning to english.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Have you visited the fjords of Finland lately?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

nope sure havnt why?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Wouldn't you like to compare them to Danish fjords?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

slartibartfast won an award for norway's...

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

China could do it; my thought exactly.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

ok sorry im lost i live in ireland why should i care about fjords?

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Now, if you put that mud in a bucket and spin it around for a bit, that mud will be clear.

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

hell nearly anyone could do it its just trying to convince people that we need to do it countries are too conservative with their money these days we could probably be on mars right now if someone would just have taken the chance at going there

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

Well, one of the more prominent space-faring countries (cough...) is kind of in massive debt (cough...) I wouldn't call that conservative (cough... ) Especially since a trip to Mars would cause quite a bit more debt (cough...)

Re: The moon is the door to the solar system
 

well most of the governments would face a revolution if they started pumping 50% of their gdp into space exploration!
such a large investment would probably depend mostly on private investment, and with the short/medium term reward being cerebral rather than monetary, not many of the people or business with the amount of money we're talking here would be willing to invest at the moment.