Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

While writing this post dissecting the reasons why people are unhappy with N900 and Nokia in general, it got me started thinking. We have a situation where Nokia is unlikely to put too much resource into N900 moving forwards because it is not worth them doing it (or so they think, even though I disagree). So this is just a thought experiment to see if an alternate model exists.

So the exam question is

Would you pay Nokia between £1(€1/$1.5) to £5, dependent on the features, say every 6 months if they promise to bring you a firmware update which brings it at par with the corresponding Meego release? It could be a subscription model or pay to download.

The logic is of course reasonably straightforward. We do know that Nokia sold 100,000 N900s in the first 5 weeks of release, so there are probably at least 300k-400k N900 owners out there, if not more. So even if say 20% of those agree to pay for the firmware update, that would mean that Nokia can hire 2-4 full time developers to maintain and port features to the N900 (and possibly to older Maemo devices). Question of course is whether such a model is feasible and would customers pay for it? (I know there are issues around piracy etc., but let us not go there yet)

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

One word: NO

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

one word: yes

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

I would pay $5 per a yearly firmware upgrade, provided it includes significant features addition.

Not fixes. Fixes should be provided in timely manner and for free, in the incremental updates following every major OS update.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

I think people might prefer to fund a community effort?

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

no.............

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

I was willing to pay back when the N770 was being left behind...

I felt burned with the N770, held off purchasing the N800, saw that it got left behind too, waited to see what would become of the N810, saw more of the same treatment, hoped that the N900 would escape the same fate... and now it looks to be more of the same... why? The hardware is capable. It just needs some software love.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

why should i?!!

1. Flash 10.1
2. equalizer
3.orkut application
4.proper facebook application
5.proper maps working without A-GPS

i want all this for free

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

For something like fully functional MeeGo to N900: yes.
For normal software updates: no.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

Yup. I'd be quite willing to. I love the device and the platform, and if they realise there isn't just a negative (cost) aspect to maintaining older devices (leaving aside arguments about future purchases etc.. be realistic), then it's likely they'd be more willing to undertake it, I think.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

Not right now. I love my N900 but I still have the feeling that I could get more from a 600€ device.

If that changed... then yes, I would pay for firmware updates

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

yeah, we can get all of those free on a desktop PC (i dont know with gps though) why cant we get it free for mobile?

well i will pay for new OS (like i use to pay on my PC) but updates should be free (sane on PC). am i correct?

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

Much like paying to upgrade your windows or mac os, i'd be more than happy to pay for an upgrade to maemo. I do however think minor updates and fixes should be free, kinda like service packs in windows.

edit: like gabby131 said.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

Development costs on Harmattan will be subsidised by sales of new hardware.

To make a backport to the N900 will not only cost more that Nokia would ever recoup with such a low upgrade cost, but it would also eat into sales of the new device by extending the life of the old one.

Yes I would pay, no it's not going to happen.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

that will not even scratch the idea of a paid update.

think about it: if there are 100000 phones sold, at 500u$s each, you got 50.000.000 u$s. and that is not enough to make them put love on n900.

thats because software engenieer is dead expensive, never profitable by its own. it only has a role in the business model.

Nokia is a PHONE maker, not a computer maker.

and the business model for every phone maker out there is to make a device and let it die.

there are few exceptions of course

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

ysss speaks wisdom!

Imagine if this was funded!

People would be in a position to justify stuff like Flash and OVI maps similar to Symbian version.

It will also show Nokia how much demand (hopefully revenue too) from maitaining/improving existing hardware.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

I would have to learn what was in the firmware upgrade before I was willing to pay for it. I think that the next firmware upgrade will basically be solidifying this upgrade, and that doesn't deserve payment. At some point, when cool new features or compatibility were being offered, I would certainly be willing to pay for them. I am not willing to pay for, say, "stability". Stability is owed when the device is released.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

@Spanner, @Clasificado

The fact that Nokia is a hardware maker and hence it is in their interest to let the device die hasn't escaped me. However, for the fact that people continue buying Nokia devices would take a bit more than purely hardware. I do agree that the model can't go on ad infinitum, however the N900 can certainly last for 2 years or so, and the benefit for Nokia would be that these people would probably buy another Nokia device after the end of the support period (seamless transition and all...a model that has worked well on PCs and even iPhones). So effectively they are subsidizing the costs of the current development against future revenues from these customers, whom they would have probably pissed off otherwise.

This is not all that far fetched given what every major software house has been doing for ages and is quite the accepted model in a lot of other hardware/software combination heavy industries (e.g. the CCTV industry upgrades you to the next available codec if you have the support contract and the hardware can support it). It definitely needs a change of mindset from Nokia's perspective though

EDIT: Another thing I forgot to mention is that Revenues is not the same as margin. While Nokia would have made a lot more revenues by selling the hardware, the margins on hardware, after factoring in all the distribution costs etc. are tiny. So $600 for N900 is not all profit...if anything the profit can be as little as $50, whereas a service such a a firmware upgrade can be much more profitable because there are very few overhead costs.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

These comments really make me wonder...
Why oh why do people always want something for free. When is it getting through to some peoples thick heads that nothing is for free.. There is no such thing in our world (except the sun every morning)

PLEASE let me PAY for the software besides the hardware!! Then i can except something because i then i have something where i can say, look i want support, i want new upgrades because i pay for it with my subscription... No No nokia i dont want to upgrade to the next phone yet, i dont want to pay another 500 euro's again for a next phone, maybe next year i will do that, but NOW i just want new and updated software..

But we are going down the drain, everything is going the wrong way in my eyes, look at ovi maps.. I really dont like that it is for free now.. Why? Same reason as above, what is Nokia's incentive now to support older phones? Why would we ever get it on the N900??
Why would users of let say the N97 mini that has now an Ovi maps 3.0.x get Ovi Maps 4.0 if the N97 is already replaced by the next model? It is for free, you get want you get when you bought the phone, why would you get anything more after that, especially when the phone is not for sale anymore..

I just want to pay exactly for the stuff i get, i want to pay for the hardware, an then i want to pay for the software that gives me rights, then i am in my rights to complain that i dont get anything, Now many here are complaining and complaining (Voice Navigation, MMS and so on) but why? Did you pay for that? nope.. so why would Nokia give it to you?

I would pay Nokia 50-100 euro if needed if they then say you will get for 2-3 years the latest Meego releases fully supported by us including all the features new phones will get then in that time frame (except if the hardware can't handle it anymore)
(with firmware updates every 3 months)

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

I would like to pay! Yes!

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

dude i have paid so much for this device !! its not a cheap and i aint rich nor many are!!

i have been buying nokia phones long time now cuz they are the best!! and if i ask them for a lil in return that too for free aint gonna cost them much, in return they get more new fans more sales!!

think over it!! :)

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

The things mentioned presviously like Flash 10 should be free... they're just updates to software. They are not new operating system, new features and they don't warrant charging for. As for other things like Facebook client, A-GPS etc. these should have been included in the ORIGINAL released of the phone, Nokia short changed customers by advertising the phone to have features and capabilities like this and then not providing them.

As for something like MeeGo... Apple provided the major system update to iPhones, iPods etc recently. If you had a new-ish device you got it free. If you had an older device there was a £20 (I think) fee so you could get it too.

I don't see any reason why the Maemo -> Meego situation should be different. Nokia need to sort out their planning, communication, product lifecycles, customer care and general act!

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

If it meant the difference between the n900 continuing or dying a death then I would pay to keep it going

But then im tied into a 2 year contract so why should I pay more than I already am

I think there needs to be a change as no device has a shelf life of 2 years in this technological world we live in, in fact most things are out of date the day they are released, much like cars lose 20% of the value the moment the car leaves the forecourt

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

I already paid for that when i bought my N900.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

Why are people moaning about that they payed already a lot for the n900? Every phone in the same range is as expensive as the n900. We get free apps and free games because of the great community work. I don't mind to pay for updates / software / games..

I'm in:D

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

I refuse to pay anymore money to nokia, I would much prefer to pay the money to a keen dev on this site, hell id rather see the money go to a few students keen on development, all the money goes into a kitty and gets shared out for devs a bit like the coding competition, it would be nice to see people who own the phone develope on it! since pr1.2 my phone seems worse than before, keep gettin errors on websites, some dont't even use flash!

having two or more teams competing for the best solution to a problem with the incentive of a nice sack of cash would be a much better idea i think...

I just feel like Nokia would waste the money, if we look how long it took to get pr1.2 out, how much would that have cost us? They would blow the money on one update with nothing in it and then tell us they had a small problem they couldn't fix even with the 100 developers they had on it and we would be screwed yet again! :(

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

Personally I would pay a smallish fee for a new OS, but I wouldn't pay for fixes or smaller feature updates.

I can live with paying a fee because companies have to factor in the costs of developing and porting a new OS to older hardware. But, at the same time, they also have to factor in the cost of alienating and losing their old customer base when they try to sell their new hardware.

I look forward to a time when we can purchase mobile handset hardware and install the OS of our choice, much like we can with PCs and netbooks today.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

Features yes, fixes no. Fixes should be provided free, as they are after all fixes.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

To be fair, I don't think one can get the choice between features and fixes. Under this model, we would be paying for full software support on a hardware, which may not be supported otherwise, and porting an OS and apps which won't be available otherwise (not officially supported anyways). The fact is that even releasing and testing fixes has an associated cost would mean that Nokia needs to employ someone to do it. So it would have to be a combination of fixes and features that one would be paying for.

As for the sentiment expressed by a few of you that you would rather pay open source developer(s) than Nokia, again the issue is that Nokia would probably not release the source code of their drivers because that contains their intellectual property. So building an image from scratch would probably mean extensive reverse engineering. Given what has happened to older Maemo devices, I don't think that is a viable option, though I would love to be proven wrong and have that option.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

I would if the device itself would've been half its price

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

Yes, of course:)

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

No matter what nokia is going to do. after tens year of a loyal customer and being disapointed time after time i decided that my next phone will be the iphone 4G. The n900 was the last phone i bought.

Im really fed up with it now! lame apps, half baked software, 5000+ bugs and a company that keeps saying "sorry that features is not planned" stuttering menu's ugly UI etc. etc. i really started wondering why the hell i bought the n900

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

For security updates and bugfixes, I think it would be inappropriate to ask for money.

For new builds of the OS (ie. Meego/Maemo 6), major updates with new software and features? I'd pay $50CAD if that's what it took.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

i dont know much about it as im a n00b!
but if nokia are ditching maemo and putting all their resouces into meego, would it not be better to give maemo to us somehow?
there are some very talented devs here, they could probs upgrade the firmware on a 'donate if you like it' basis in their spare time

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

And that is weak point of Nokia. Without a working app ecosystem, their phones will be a one-off income for them.

Look at Android, iPhone and BB. Even the old phones have the potential to continue to be useful:

- People can still use them to download the latest apps and add new features through them.
- In turn, these devices continue to be fertile potential revenue generators for both Nokia and the contributing developers in their app ecosystem so there's incentive to keep supporting them as long as possible.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

I'd pay it to the community.

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

tell Nokia to S**k my D**k

They r the biggest failure!!!

we waited half a year to get the N900 to what it should-have-been out of the box.... its still utter s**t

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

Hmmm... I'm not trying to read between the lines... but is that a hint of bitterness in your post..?

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

LOL, I am impressed that you picked it up....it was so subtle

Re: Would you pay for a firmware upgrade?
 

lol, just a wild guess