[Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

As Nokia focuses more and more attention on Meego/Harmattan, it appears that the majority of the responsibility of supporting the existing platform of Maemo 5/Fremantle will fall on the community. However, with some components (such as the phone stack) being closed, it is impossible to develop some solutions without Nokia's assistance. Therefore, I am would like to request from Nokia that we receive ALL source code for Maemo 5 and/or the n900 in order to more effectively support the n900.

We need a system in place that allows us to resolve bugs in real time (similar to the app approval process) and releasing all source code for Maemo 5 and the n900 is the first step towards this becoming a reality. Waiting months for massive firmware updates is not how open source should work!

Disclaimer: I am not a developer, so if anything I have said above doesn't make sense please don't bash me too hard :) I do, however, try to do my part in helping with testing.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

At the end of the day, Nokia is still a business and I doubt they'd want a closed source competitor snatch up some proprietary code in the name of being open source.

Even if there's an NDA, look at the Ovi Suite Beta thing. Some people just don't know when to STFU.

Maybe sharing some closed code with some trusted developers like they are doing on the MeeGo project.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Ha, good luck with that. The closed components of Diablo are staying closed. I'll suck my own dick if we ever see the closed Diablo components.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

The existence of Mer indicates that Nokia could be willing to do it.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

It may be a long shot, but it doesn't hurt to try. Please either indicate your support here or refrain from replying so we can keep this thread clean.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

The major closed components are the ones that control access to the hardware (e.g. battery management, phone/modem hardware).

I know the developers over at MeeGo are working on some solutions to reduce/remove closed components. If it ever becomes a reality then the code can hopefully be shared.

As far as I know the opengl drivers are written by a third-party and may never be open-sourced.

What more can you ask for? open source components and free porn!
:).

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

well, some of it is probably not up to nokia to open at all. nokia likely has license agreements with ti and other chip manufacturers for that stuffthat they cant just violate.

it is not going to happen, doesnt matter if you have a million signatures on a petition, give up now

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

if you are capable of this, why would you wait for opening diablo stuff to do it. talk about self control, wow

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Maybe he's just showing off!

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Any chance of honouring the OP's request to keep this to affirmative petition responses and not chatter on the subject?

I would like Nokia to make this code open.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Actually is Mer still an active project now that MeeGo is being developed?


Dear Nokia please open source your stuff because:
(1) It fosters a happy community who will buy more of your products.
(2) You can return the favour of open source helping you to develop your products
(3) It's good publicity
(4) You will be entertained by qwerty12 trying to pleasure himself.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

I believe Mer has been retired. Since MeeGo will have a fully open stack (save a handful of drivers) Stskeeps is already working to coordinate a port for the N8x0 series devices.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

i support this petition. this os is going down the drain unless nokia decides to redeem itself by opening its code to developers.



on another note, why are posters like nosa101 such negative dolts? they keep storming threads as if they are the voice for nokia. shills. if you don't agree with this petition please don't give us your short sighted feedback. we don't need you to tell us your take on the issue because it's just counter-productive to the whole process of making maemo better for everyone. your mere presence in this sort of thread might be directly linked to maemo's failure so please go away. if you're sick and tired of stumbling into constant posts then quietly ignore them just like in any other forum. and yes, this is just like any other forum.


nosa, remember this little lady, you're not in kansas anymore... don't get mad. you can apply for nokia if you feel like you've got something better to offer than the petition itself.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

I would love to see this too. Mainly my interest is for the Nokia closed source applications (like File Manager, Contacts, Media Player and the browser UI) to be open-sourced, so that the community can fix bugs/add features as desired. However, I see very little chance of this happening.

MeeGo will apparently have open-source "reference" implementation of the above applications, which is a good step forward, although Nokia may still be coding up their own closed-source alternatives for their MeeGo devices. Without knowing the difference in capabilities between the open-source and closed-source apps, it is difficult to know how much of a problem this will be in the future.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

There should be no issue, really, if there's an open-source version. If anything, it'd be better as the existing media player on the N900 is generally terrible (I have never gotten the thing to play back video.)

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

I would like to see nokia opening their source code, specially the phone app code so the community can fix it and make the n900 a good phone and not only a good mobile computer with phone capabilities :P

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Don't forget in some cases Nokia might not have a license to distribute the source. Nokia doesn't not design the Cortex processor, GSM, etc. The rights to these are purchased from their respective manufactures for Nokia to use under contract which might not include distributing the source.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

There are no issues regarding the CPU itself. It's the graphics chip that's the problem.

I'm pretty sure they did, but that's a trade secret for them.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

It would already help if they only distribute what they do have. If that includes the camera for example, it may open up the possibility to fix the video stuttering issue, which Nokia themselves have apparently set to Wontfix :(

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

I really don't get the point of the personal attack

I am holding back Maemo's progress because I gave a possible reason for the closed nature of the code?

Where is the petition anyway?

Nokia has every right to withhold code if they choose to, it may be unfair but it is true.

Nokia is sharing some closed components on the "MeeGo to N900" project and that is a very good thing.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

It is a good thing but what they should realise is the quicker they can make a fully open phone then the sooner they take market share off of Apple.

The more open it is the more the community will be able to help them make a world class phone.

Opening the code does not necessirly mean it has to be GPL they could open the code to be modified only for this device, no rights on other devices for instance.

Opening the code does not transfer copyrights in much the same way as reading a book does not make you the owner of the book.

Trouble is it takes closed minded corporate managers a long time to realise this is the best/most profitable way on the route to opensource!

My vote goes towards opening the code.

rgds

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

But this hasn't been proven. I might be ignorant but I do not recall any company that has gone the open source route and remained competitive.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Giving the Full Open Source of Maemo 5 to TRUSTED Developers is a good idea.. But you know wat NOKIA means, NO HOPE!!! That is why im trying to sell my N900 from NOW!

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Do you recall Intel?

I seriously doubt it.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

I think you mean Redhat. Intel maintains profitability by pumping out chips like nobody's business. Effectively, the same thing could be said for Nokia, who sells handsets.

They could totally offset the open sourcing of their software by offering services to owners of Nokia branded devices, the catch would be getting around the incompetence that is interfering with their services delivery for the N900.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Sigh... I guess no thread is safe from hijackers. PLEASE - only post replies if you support this initiative.

Otherwise, go here http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=703730 and have at it.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Fair enough and I did admit to being ignorant. I didn't know Intel was open source. But seeing as intel is not in the mobile device (or established) market, I can see why Nokia would be apprehensive.

To me, it could be a big risk. They could be wildly successful or they could fail woefully. Nothing in-between and that thought sounds scary to most managers. They could, however, use the n900 as a case study for open source development. I am willing to be a guinea pig.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

How is this petition going to Nokia? Through this thread or do we have to sign something somewhere?

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

I am just gauging support at the moment. If there are enough votes I will put together something more official I think.

Everyone please take a moment to vote in the poll I just added.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Didn't see the poll until now

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

That would be my fault, didn't add it until just now :o

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

We already had this discussion. Main points: Nokia applications are closed source and it's more important we spend time opening as much regarding the hardware interfacing parts as needed so we can bring a proper MeeGo on to the devices.

Nokia's stance on their applications: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=532930&postcount=8

Discussions: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=688409 (from Master of Gizmo's proposal at post 17 and down)

I'd like to remind everyone of the licensing change requests queue: http://wiki.maemo.org/Open_developme...hange_requests

As a personal question to people here: Did you know that the e-mail client of Maemo5 is called Modest and is open source? Have you submitted any patches or contributed to it? That the RSS reader is open source? That Marbles, Chess and Mahjong games are open source? That the PDF reader is? That the X-terminal is? That the Hildon Desktop is?

There's nothing more sad than spending several manhours on open sourcing an application and hearing the sound of crickets when it does arrive. Noone contributing to improve it. How about we make targetted requests and show who's ready to contribute if something was open sourced instead? And also, most of you are going to stop caring about Maemo5 when real MeeGo comes around, even on another device. History clearly shows that.

If you want 100% open source (by that, I mean the platform excluding some hardware adaptation bits), go help out in MeeGo. Make reference / open source applications that are -better- than what Nokia can come up with. I bet you can.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

THIS

Considering a lot of people have issues with Modest, surely some special fellow could help with this.
http://modest.garage.maemo.org/

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

@Stskeeps - thanks alot for weighing in here. I wasn't aware that these discussions had already taken place.

As I stated in my initial disclaimer, I am not a dev and know very little about coding. But I am learning more every day and contributing where I can (even if it is just starting an active discussion here) My primary concern is opening the platform in a way that bugs can be resolved more quickly by the community rather than semi-annually in massive Nokia firmware updates.

I am also somewhat concerned at this point about Meego, as it will not be officially supported and the handset UX is not due for sometime. Not to mention we all bought the device with Maemo and may prefer to stick with it even if Meego is fully functional.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

There's a perfectly functional community SSU for the N8x0's, same model can be used on Maemo5. Handset UX development should be opened sometime this month, as far as I know. Reminder: this is not the same as a release.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Yes.
Basically, Nokia gains money from selling hardware, not software.
They would lose nothing by releasing all of the source code.

Exactly my point.
Still, the N900 was only an "experiment" from them.
If they can learn from its mistakes, the next tablet product will be a success.

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Now we're talking. If we could get minor fixes on a monthly or bi-monthly basis I would be more than satisfied.

I just have a problem with huge firmware updates that have only been QA tested internally @Nokia. Invariably, once released to the community more bugs will be discovered. Now, if they were released more frequently, this would be less of an issue.

And yes, I am aware of the irony of hijacking my own thread. :cool:

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Yeah, I don't know how anyone can break the almighty NDA.. oh wait that was sarcasm. You agree to it just like you agree to EULAs. But besides that.. there isn't much to talk about with the Ovi Suite Beta.. unless I'm missing something (never really used the original).

Anyhow, I will agree that it would be great if we could have a 100% open source phone, but I just don't see it happening. It's more likely that nVidia would publish specs to their video cards...

slaapliedje

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

Redhat?

Novell?

Re: [Petition] For Nokia to Open 100% of the Closed Components in Maemo 5/n900
 

"I might be ignorant"

"I do not recall"

#carryon