what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

i've noticed programmers and their assistants say that this phone is not made for non-developers and that it's full linux: not built for noobs. i'm just wondering what this phone can do to earn that description since i haven't really seen that many great apps, even in the extras repositories, that windows mobile, ios and android phones cant do. it lacks in so many aspects that calling it "open source" and "linux" is probably an insult to those two characteristics. android does it so much better. if your defense is saying that maemo is more "open" than android, then why is it 10x worse?

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone os brought us?
 

I suggest returning to /g/. At least there no one cares about deliberate flamebait.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone os brought us?
 

First... which phone are you talking about? N900? A Symbian model? Are you calling all the Maemo devices phones (the Internet Tablets were never phone-capable, btw, although I used to use Gizmo to make phone calls despite that).

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone os brought us?
 

Delusional appreciation for Nokia's closed "open source" practices, typical symptom of Stockholm syndrome.

Open source/Linux promoters always talk about free software and the benefits of having an own understanding of software.
In actuality most of them aren't doing anything useful with their knowledge, it isn't paying the bills for anyone, it is just providing a free platform for a few basement dwellers and some people who don't want to pay for paid alternatives.

These promoters are analogous to the so-called experts who think they know better than their doctors just because they have access to Wikipedia.

That is until they realize that developing is practically a job and requires pay. And thats why Nokia will never fully release their sources.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

I have 9 assorted computers running various unixes in my house and a virtual private root server somewhere in Dallas. I'd estimate that I can achieve 80% of every computer related activity I perform with my N900 in my hands, as long as I have network connectivity.

It also mean that I don't need to carry my ipod or a gps, although I'm not entirely converted to the device convergence concept yet, as an ipod is easier to carry around than a mains charger.

Heck, its still easier to carry a phone, an N800 and an ipod around than a mains charger. So battery life is the biggest single turn off for me, and I'm not saying the N900 is particularly bad - I don't think it is, but a revolution in battery tech is what we really need. Oh, and USB ports that fall out. Damn them.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

N900: OpenOffice, Pidgin, EasyDeb, dual boot...
Android: Dalvik.

I don't think this line of argument is valid, OP.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone os brought us?
 

Oh come the **** on man, your insistence constantly that those of us who don't hate the device are somehow abused and suffering from some mental illness is pretty goddamn pathetic. Nokia's handling of Maemo has been bad, but then we look at MeeGo which won't suffer from having things like a closed media players. I knew the device wasn't 100% open when I bought it, but it sure as hell was nicer than Android, which keeps you bottled up into a nonstandard Java sandbox. And with MeeGo, everything comes from upstream so you aren't reinventing the wheel or running something so horribly branched that it isn't compatible with the project it came from.

Drivers are the result of software patent BS and a closed mentality driven by Microsoft for years. Fortunately this is changing, but video chip companies (and Broadcom, for some reason) keep fighting it.

That you can't take advantage of it is no reason to dismiss the concept.

Come on man, **** on us some more. Bring up more piss poor arguments. Some people like the fact that their software vendor can't hold them hostage.

Are you a psychologist? Can you identify "Stockholm syndrome" or are you just saying that because you have access to Wikipedia.

The people who promote open source tend to be involved in the industry. They may not drop down into the code of every program they use, but they do see the advantages of having what is effectively a transparent system.

Many developers are paid quite well to work on open source. Most kernel contributors these days are paid to work on it. Suggesting that by being open source you are fundamentally incapable of earning money, and that the only way is to be closed source, is the height of ignorance.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

no, the question is what did you bring to open source community?

Maemo might not be as open we wanted but there is a very different mentality of people who work on open source projects :)



Oh and OP before trying to answer please read Ubuntu's code of conduct it might enlighten you a bit :)

http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Open source: a half finished product that works sometimes. Occasionally made deliberately worse by zealots refusing to include "non-free" components (see: MeeGo).

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Looks like the ignorant are out in force tonight.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

so are the delusional.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Yay, another terrible thread filled with people who can do nothing but insult others for what they do. Please, this thread is wonderful. More ignorance, lies, and insults directed towards other people are desperately needed.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

you started it bro. hate to say.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

I criticized his point. You came along with a bunch of ignorant nonsense where you attacked the efforts of other people.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

you called me ignorant. Show me one sucessful open source product that is a commercial sucess, and isn't half finished. Just one.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Why does it have to be commercial? Does something only have value if you pay for it?

How about GCC? MySQL? Numerous and sundry content management systems? Qt?

Define half finished? Do you define "finished" as being something like Windows, where it's never actually finished but simply has HUGE gaps between updates? Or OS X, which is similar?

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

They're probably fueled up by their company release party.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

I define finished as a product that works completely as advertised and has all the features, advantages, and benefits of a similar product in the market.

To be fair GCC and MySQL (while unfortunately not as sucessful as oracle) are excellent products, but we're talking about a consumer grade electronics here not server room software choice.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone os brought us?
 

Since there are already similar or even better choices its a classic example of too little, too late.

There isn't much to take advantage of when I can get the same somewhere else for a bit more money and alot less hassle. Its the same reason I would purchase a car instead of collecting junk from the scrapheap and trying to make one myself.

I'm merely sharing what I have learned from experience and observation of both experience and statistics. In the real world consumers use predominantly Windows and OSX.

Medicine student, the psychiatry lecture on the syndrome which my professor gave was quite fascinating.

Like alot of things, the N900 and communism to name a few, it may seem good in theory, but in practice it plays out quite different.

They get paid to work until someone else completes their work for free!

If they are working toward getting money for what they develop and therefor gain more ground in the market, they are no better than the big bad closed corporations, only smaller and envious of the other teams' success.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Consumer grade electronics: Asus WL-500G running Linux. Popcorn Hour A100. And Nokia N810. Each top products in their markets. Oh, and each capable of running MySQL.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Ok, and shockingly most Open Source software fits this definition.

And most Open Source software fits this bill too.

However you're defining a "finished product" to be something that is "feature equal with an arbitrarily different product." Please don't move the goalposts here. Last I understood a "finished product" was one that was feature complete, and performed as described.

This is like bashing the GIMP for not -being- Photoshop, which is eminently unfair, considering it's capabilities versus what the average person actually needs.

Not as successful by what measure? Oracle brings in tons of money, but it also has a byzantine licensing scheme and way more features than most websites will ever seriously use. On the other hand, MySQL lacks features that make Oracle and DB2 essential on the higher end.

You'd be shocked at how many devices just barely perform as described, and aren't capable of doing anything more. Certainly, I'll take a little less polish if it means I don't have to deal with the vendor telling me (via encryption and security policies) what I can and can't do with my property.

EDIT: More blather from PradaBrada follows.

And yet there are always people building custom cars and restoring old ones found at the scrapheap. Do you normally insult them as well?

Use of OS X is a reaction to Windows. Windows is a result of their monopoly, really, and familiarity.

So essentially you are doing to the field of computing what you claim people do to medicine with Wikipedia. Please stop. It's what you'd want us to do, right?

What?

What nonsense is this? I hope you're better at medicine than looking at how the computing field works, or you might kill someone. How is someone making money writing open source software being no better than the "big bad closed corporations?"

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Define "commercial success".

Because every time I bring up the list of qualifying candidates (Apache always comes to mind) someone has to start sputtering with disqualifiers.

signed,

Someone who sees the benefits in both open AND proprietary approaches and thinks these religious wars are asinine.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone os brought us?
 

Professor Byagam Gokulden is indeed an amazing luminary. :ohpek

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Awesome, a router, a set top box that uses proprietary codecs, and a tablet that people only know about because of the n900 (half-finished). Surely open source is poised to conquer the market!

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

MySQL has so much success that Oracle bought it and will keep supporting it because they want to use it as an alternative for Oracle in less complex setups. Let me repeat that. So successful that Oracle wants it to be an alternative to Oracle.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

If you can't win with logic, always trump with the Sarcasm Card!

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

What is your point? These are my only router that I use, the only set top box that I own and a tablet that I bought because it was the best mobile internet product in the world. Each of these products had better rating than any other competing products, or I would not have bought any of them. So, I repeat, what was your original point?

I don't even have a preference for OpenSource. But OpenSource products sometimes kick proprietary mule.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Here's some logic. I run a company that makes widgets. Recently two other companies that make widgets made some widgets that are way better than mine, and no one wants to buy my widgets any more.

I want to make a better widget, so I grabbed an old doohickey and half of one of my old widgets and taped them together. It doesn't quite do everything that my old widgets did, but boy does it look good on paper.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

That's some pretty... faulty logic. At this point you're just slinging barbs because you've got nothing.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Explain to me how that is not exactly what has happened.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

You're making the assertion here, you show how it's true.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

i swear there is no sense to be made in there. there's no point beyond trying to ridicule opensource. i honestly believe you wrote that, making high pitched voices. next time, try to make an comprehensive argument.

i'm out. see ya, tex.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Hint: I'm Nokia, My widget is my symbian phones, the other two companies are apple and google, the doohickey is the NIT, and the half-finished doohickey-widget thing is the n900.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone os brought us?
 

Do they still qualify people as psychiatrists after they take one or two psych courses?

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Oh, but proving negatives is more fun! Almost as entertaining as "debating" with sarcasm and obtuse metaphors. :D

Pass the popcorn, the zealotry is just heating up!

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Trolls .

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

Wait, so you've suddenly gone from wide, general attacks to something very, very specific. Please, keep a consistent line here or you'll lose people.

Realize also that the N900 is pretty much directly descended from the NITs with a cellular modem added and has NOTHING to do with Symbian. If you ask me, it is and always has been what the NITs should have been.

I mean, you can ***** at Nokia for their poor handling of things but that has nothing whatsoever to do with open source software.

YHL, HAND.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone os brought us?
 

As a matter of fact, yes, I do, especially if they are doing so solely to not pay for a real car and so leave a chip in the economy.

So what? Cry wolf moar.

Except for the fact that I actually took several years of Computer Science classes :rolleyes:

No work = no paycheck

They are both making software to make money. That is all that matters. Hating on closed corporations is simply hating on the competition for naive reasons, which is childish at best.

He's simply the best :D

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

It's not even an assertion. it's history. painted in a cute little story to make the big business world more easy to understand for the people who apparently don't.

Re: what has "open source" and "linux" phone/tablet maemo os brought us?
 

OpenOffice.org, Blender, Ubuntu, . . .