Sick of all the closing threads
 

Fighting is normal, being upset is normal. Closing threads just reignites the fire and without question, a new more ignorant thread will open.

I must admit that I liked it better when only Reggie would close threads that would get out of hand. It only ever took a PM to Reggie to say hey this is getting out of hand. However it seems now that threads seem to get closed constantly, or maybe its just the ones I am reading and wanting to respond to.

Additionally I VERY much disagree with making final statements, then saying closed.

I have been a screamer at Nokia in the past and I went on to be a council member.

Some people around here need to separate themselves from there feelings and let others have their rants. Why has this changed? Is it because Nokia has a perceived ownership, is it moderator madness? WTF??

There has to be a better way to deal with asshats who open complaining threads.

I personally would rather create a new section, called asshats and move all the potentially trolling threads to it. Then have them not show up under active topics, or on internettablettalk.com homepage (Am I the only one who still uses it as this entrance?)

Anyway, I personally think that very few things should cause a thread to close or a person to be booted. Slurs against race/religion/sex/sexual preference.

I hate Nokia or I love the Iphone IS NOT A VALID REASON. Saying Nokia screwed me and **** on me and ate my first born, just doesn't cut it for me.

This is all just my opinion, however I believe some of what goes on here is perpetuated by the people who are vigilantly trying to stop it.

There has to be a better way......

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

I do think there should be another forum called asshats. And penguinbait, critcizing Nokia is not what's the problem, hell I do it. It's the manner in which people do it (both the fanboys and the trolls).

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Sorry there is no other way. Look other popular forums with highly devoted users like hydrogenaudio and doom9. Those places kick people even talking offtopic. AND those places keep on going. This place has been recently gone down.

AND i very very much agree on making final statement and closing. Also i would like to see in final statements where users get banned for some time period so that they can cool off.

Of course we can have our little offtopic/ /b/, but before that i think little clean up doesn't make bad.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

QUOTE
This is all just my opinion, however I believe some of what goes on here is perpetuated by the people who are vigilantly trying to stop it.

There has to be a better way......

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

You aren't the only one who still uses the internettablettalk.com homepage to enter here.

Unfortunately I think that some things happening here are the result of the Nokia affiliation. As we know, when you start hanging out with the wrong sort, bad things are bound to ensue.

It would be much easier to deal with trolls except that Nokia affiliation is like a lightning rod. And I wonder how many people here are really loyal to Nokia anyway? I only have five Nokia products because they happen to be the best for my purposes right now. The minute I find better products, good riddance to Nokia.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

I see it says you joined in Dec 2009. I have been HERE since Jan 2006, and this place went down hill as soon as Nokia became involved.

EDIT

IMO

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Sure. The threads that are working towards developing an app or to collect info for a dev. should be kept clean. to be able to find useful info.

But if a thread is created for the sole purpose of "trollin". let it go. people need to vent. If it clutters an important category. just move the thread a new category.

But closing while saying a statement that agrees with any of the arguing parties is nazi work.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Pretty much, people see that Nokia sponsors this forum and the servers and they think Nokia pays attention to it. And as a result they kick and scream thinking that Nokia pays attention to this forums when all they are doing is annoying the people who actually want to be here.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Not necessarily. I've been here a long time and recently noticed that mods are taking action based on content of remarks and not conduct or breaking forum rules.

The following thread was closed because a few people thought the discussion should occur on another forum, not because any forum rules were broken:

http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=48929

I sent a PM to the moderator and he didn't respond. A shame IMHO.

EDIT: and it was a stickied thread.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

I'm going to close threads that are solely designed to attack the community.

Of all people penguinbait, you should be aligned with that.

Ah, the inevitable hyperbolic invocation of Godwin's Law [1] :rolleyes:

Feel free to find a forum dedicated to hatred, anger and anarchy if this one doesn't suit you.

I'm tired of spending my rare personal time plowing through PMs and reported post emails to deal with the occasional nastiness here only to encounter rank exaggerations like yours. Be very careful in your wishes-- I'm actually a light moderator and if I get disgusted enough to quit you might not like either alternative afterward.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law

Not THIS moderator. I'm very tolerant but lately I've had enough of the community attack threads. They serve NO purpose, SD69.

But anyone who doesn't like my approach is free to complain about it to Reggie. I almost quit this thankless gig once and I've been on the edge of it lately. I'm trying to strike a balance and help the overall community and I'm not going to cater to a shrill minority. Anyone who thinks this role is easy is deluding themselves.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

its all nokias fault.if they were a good company who cared abt customers,people wudnt find the need to complain

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

This is NOT a Nokia service forum.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

BTW.. I have a question.. if it's been answered somewhere else, kindly point me to it and I'll be quiet again...

What happens to maemo (1. community \ 2. site \ 3. support framework) after MeeGo?

ps: this is strictly about maemo (n770, n800, n810 and n900). I've read the early threads about MeeGo migration (forum, community, etc).. but I don't recall the continuation of support on maemo.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

It's not what you do mate. It's how you do it. No one said your job is easy. But just because a job is hard, that doesn't mean you don't do it in the best possible manner.

Take a look a this:
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=55991&page=3

Your closing statement doesn't not signify any maturity. Infact it'll only make the person want to open another thread.

The community are not idiots. They are professionals. Good apps have 100s of pages thank Posts. I think the community is smart enough to differentiate..

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

True, and it pissed me to no end :mad:

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

I align with free speech. I am complaining here, please don't close the thread :p

Nokia's problems are Nokia's fault. I understand you feel a personal connection to the community. However I feel if we can actually feel and hear the pain it will get better. If we ignore it, it will not go away.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

I don't mind the closing of threads... however - if a thread has gotten to the point it needs closing; it doesn't need a "final word" from the moderator.

A simple post, from the mod (so that people know who did it) saying "Thread closed" is all that's necessary.

A moderator should not, IMHO, add their own personally biased $0.02, and then close the thread disallowing anyone else from countering them or continuing the debate.

Obviously if the thread is close-worthy, there's nothing worthwhile left to say and it has derailed into a mindless mess of insulting nonsense, and therefore does not require anybody's $0.02. Simply close it, post that you're closing it, and leave it at that.

If a closing statement is more than one sentence long... you're doing it wrong IMHO.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

And guys, remember the alternative. If Texrat quits, I might step up again to moderate.

Who would you rather have, Texrat, or me?

That's what I thought. So let's all try to give Texrat a break, and stop the incessant attacking and slapping the same old things.


Interesting point of view; thank you for raising it. It is indeed true that sometimes, blinded by the passion to stop certain things, people start doing those things themselves.

This being said, I disagree that too many threads are being closed. I would like to remember each and everyone involved in this thread, that if you believe that a moderator is going too far, you may want to take it to Reggie. Please let me stress the very, very important part of that previous sentence: you may want to, that doesn't mean you should and will. As with everything, parsimony helps everyone, especially those who have to manage incoming requests from loads of people.

@Reggie and moderators: Maybe it would be better if moderators could "opt out" of the alerts they get in their mailbox. I know that, in my case, frustration arose immensely from having my mailbox literally spammed by tens and sometimes hundreds of reported posts.

Maybe an alternative would be that one post can only be reported a number of times before the auto-mailing feature is deactivated.

With the growth of this community, some functionalities need to be adapted to cope with the noise they generate.

Edit: @fatalsaint. $0.02 or 0.02¢?

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

I hope you are joking...

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Free speech is between provided and supported by your government. It does not apply here and you know that. Civics 101.

And again: this is NOT a Nokia service forum. You know that as well. You should also be aware that there are much, much better ways of getting Nokia's attention on their failures. Do you ever read my blog? Try the latest article if you ever get time. There have been almost 3000 views of that one.

And where is your community support, penguinbait? Right now you are supporting the so-callled "right" of people to attack it. Not the mindset of a former council person I would think.

FYI: the community is asking me to act on trolls. I'm not catering to the will of a malcontented minority but the general will of the community.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Not at all. Care to explain why that behavior belongs here?

I'm open to a logical counterpoint. Emotional appeals, however, will find little if any resonance.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

the thread you linked to proved that some people here are, in fact, idiots. they have a right to be treated accordingly. - seriously, this community deserves to be protected from such verbal excrements. i mean... new n900 users and developers come here looking for help and support. do you want them to be greeted with these stinking threads?

closing them is the only right choice. (i changed my mind on this topic during the last 4-5 months.... i was all against closing threads and banning users. but that was before those people came aboard.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Whereas equating forum thread closure with the acts of genocidal nazis does???

Please.

Only a sociopath would react that way. Think about it. Talk about immature!

:rolleyes:

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Sure.
Censor based on conduct and breaking forum rules; not because of the opinion expressed or other content of the remarks.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Tags sometimes make me roll my eyes. Misguided rant? really?

I think PB has seen something he disagree's with and brought it out for a discussion... I see nothing misguided about that at all.

I may not agree 100% with him, as I haven't seen much (if any) moderating around here that I don't like (in fact, this is one of the more lenient boards I've been too): However, I do think sometimes it gets out of hand when one of the moderators themselves are a part of the debacle, and then close it with a final "note".. looks more like a fit of rage than actual moderating (even if the close was warranted)..

But still, tagging the thread as "misguided" is just silly. :rolleyes:

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

And yet I was taken to task for closing threads WITHOUT a closing statement by others.

I don't see anything wrong or even immature in my statement in question.

And I really love a no-win position. But I never expected you of all people fatalsaint to encourage me further to bail on this madness.

EDIT: okay, I can see where I could have chosen my words better in h3llraz0r's thread. Very sorry about my poor choice.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Texrat, no I don't read your blog. I was not trying to pick on you, I am pointing out that I think that the mods are handling things the wrong way IMO IMO IMO

You are taking it personally and saying I am not supporting my community. I disagree.

You say free speech is not for this forum. I disagree. If free speech for the most part was not allowed here I would have left LONG ago.

What I am saying is I believe some mods attitudes around here are perpetuating the exact thing their fighting against. IMO IMO IMO

Which I am entitled to, again I cite FREE SPEECH. Of course you could close my thread and ban me, then I would take my free speech elsewhere.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

sorry OT(I'm a OT kind of guy). best line yet. :D

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

SD69 if you think I actually closed the thread over raw opinion rather than the original poster's rule-breaking actions then we're speaking totally different languages.

I'll make you guys happy though: I'm taking a break from moderating while I rethink once again why I'm spending my rare free time trying to help the community. Someone else can respond to the appeals for decorum. Enjoy.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Well, if you wanna go by that logic? why just close them? why dont you go out right and delete them? have it all super clean?

Ah. you're one of those. You actually don't want to be convinced. so you pick on the parts of the analogy that suit you. I've encountered that before.

In nazi analogy my dear friend, I did not mean the physical aspect of mass murder. I meant the aspect of my way or the highway.

So now you are diagnosing them too? nice. Sure they could be soiciopaths or simply very offended

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Without addressing specific complaints (which a thread like this is bound to attract, and has already) or going into whether or not things 'have gone downhill', it really is telling to me at least that I really cannot remember the last person I asked about talk.maemo.org who noted its good atmosphere.

Sure, there are good threads and moments here, but there is so much negativity and pointless bickering and fighting that really, I start to wonder why there is a point in reading it.

A lot of that 'bad karma' comes (as Texrat points out) from people who - incorrectly - assume that this is the right place to direct complaints at a company concerning service or products, and really, it isn't.

When the people who do get involved in those discussions end up feeling worn down and like "punching bags" (as a phrase I've seen used in this context in the past), then you have to start wondering whether perhaps there is a problem with the approach, and whether something fundamental needs to change.

Some food for thought.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Come again?

I've said nothing at all about you bailing on this madness. What I said was, (and I said this originally in a generic statement, not yours in particular originally, but now that I see a link to a thread you closed I'll address it specifically) - that adding a personal opinion when closing a thread leaving the parties you're talking again no ability to defend themselves is not the best way to do it.

Specifically the thread linked just a few posts up: All you should have said was (at most) "There is nothing to be gained from this thread. Closed."

However, in your closing statement when you go for someone else and then close the thread generates more negativity than was there before. It makes, what is otherwise a sound judgment (closing the thread) look more like a ragequit. I am not at all against the closing of the thread, threads need closing sometimes. That one specifically included.

It's just my opinion that there is a separation (or should) between Texrat the community member, and Texrat the Moderator. The moment it becomes necessary for you to put your mod shoes on and mod, you need to leave personal bias and your community side behind for a minute and simple execute your mod job as you must and move on.

This, again, is just MHO. Not like I'll be messaging Reggie with complaints anytime soon.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Of course you're attacking me and my decisions. It's in your original post. If you had instead taken an objective approach instead of a personal one we would be having a very different exchange right now.

But please read my latest blog article. Maybe it might help your perspective.

And again: there is no protected free speech in a discussion forum. I don't know why that has to be repeated.

And please quit with the passive-aggressive talk about closing your threads and banning you. Have I done anything yet? Have your posts in this thread been touched? You are being allowed to express your opinion. I have never and will never act on that alone. Period.

I think the continuation of this thread proves my point and disproves yours.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Why must it be your way, or you take your toys and go home Texrat?

This is not the first time. Understand MAYBE there might be a better way. Did I offer a real solution to the problem NOPE, I offered a opportunity to discuss it.

The threats that we will all be happy or unhappy with you gone, is nonsense. Cmon, you must admit that your remarks in that thread were unprofessional at least. Nobody is trying to chase you away, but clearly the current way that mods are handeling this is not working IMO IMO.

IMO

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

w00t I love you, man. Thanks for the sanity and understanding.

It just amazes me that people are so fast to pass judgment without considering the context of why I would inject my opinion into that closing statement in question.

I would respectfully request that people consider there's a history when that happens. I don't jump the nebulous gap between member and moderator on a whim, folks.

I'm out. Had enough today.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

no reason not to. they don't help anyone. they are made to destroy. so why not "destroy" them instead?

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

I didn't respond about the thread. You said you were going to close any threads that attacked the community. I responded to that. You said no free speech. :eek:

Yes, I think you may need to take a break from moderating

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

I am sorry I mentioned NO closed posts or mods, I DID NOT MENTION YOU.

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

And you are obviously considering yourself the one indispensable tool for preventing the community from going into complete chaos, the lone hero, the last guard at the gates of hell, keeping the devils in? How familiar...

Re: Sick of all the closing threads
 

Where do you see that I made such a statement?

Nothing is "my" way. There is an expected behavior for the forum. *I* didn't set it. I simply moderate in alignment. Talk to Reggie and the super moderators about rules.

And if you think getting frustrated by the decline in civility here is "taking my toys and going home" then you are severely trivializing the issue.

Maybe you should try this role for a while?
I never said such a ridiculous thing. Quit reading into what I say.

You're also invited to try the job.