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-   -   iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1? (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=58533)

DarkPand0r 2010-07-15 17:47
iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GSM Arena
It was about time. Apple got quite a hit by the wave of user discontent about the iPhone 4 antenna issues. It's been 3 weeks since the premiere of iPhone 4, but it is tomorrow that Apple will confess. Or not.
And this is all we know so far. Apple sent invitations to select press representatives for tomorrow's press conference. It will start 10:00 AM Pacific Time (6 PM European GMT) and will surly concern iPhone 4. Whether Apple will admit the issues, offer free bumper cases or start a recall campaign - nobody knows. But this sounds surely as the first step into the right direction.
Meanwhile iOS 4.1 beta is already available to developers and here is a glimpse of what we should expect.
The reception bars now make use of both a new formula and a new size. The first reports show that a full-bars situation is now a rare event. The bars are also a bit taller than before, which sounds like a clever mind trick.

The new reception bars • the redesigned Game Center
The Game Center has been redesigned too. It's now painted in green with yellow buttons.
Finally, there are some rumors of watermarking of jailbroken devices. If your iPhone 4 has joined the pirateland, it will have some watermark showing onscreen all the time. Don't worry just yet though, there's still no public jailbreak solution and it's all just a rumor for now.
So Apple have realised their love child may not be perfect....Thats not my issue here, Personally after playing with the new iPhone I actually think its a pretty good product (I've even recommended my Dad get one, its perfect for his usage)

My problem is the last Paragraph, Apple adding a watermark to Jail Broken devices. Its like adding a big "Hacked" sign on N900's with modified Kernels.
What do you guys think to this news?

gill_za 2010-07-15 18:40
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Just like apples protection against jailbreak the watermark feature will be removed sooner or later :) I hope

(i do not own iphone and dont plan on getting one )

Zibeb 2010-07-15 19:05
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
After reading this, and reading the story about the Droid X tripping a fuse and bricking itself if it's modded; it really cements the fact that truely open source operating systems may become a safe haven for smartphone owners. Meego and Symbian might get some converts that way, who knows?

gerbick 2010-07-15 19:06
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Even though I'll get slammed for saying this... at least the company is actually talking to its customers.

There's something wrong, they may/may not address it; but they're at least talking. Most other companies would make you wait months before issuing a rather cold, impersonal, non-admission that sounds closer to "That's how it is..." and then they'll clam back up.

It won't fix anything, it won't make things better, it'll just give ammo to those that dislike Apple... and to those that like Apple, it'll give them more false hope.

But at least they're communicating with their customers.

Texrat 2010-07-15 20:38
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerbick (Post 753139)
But at least they're communicating with their customers.
I'm of the thought that I'd rather see no communication than the disingenuous spin and manipulation that's coming from Apple on this. "Holding it wrong"? "No technical problem"?? Deleted forum posts???

Thumbs down on all that crap.

imperiallight 2010-07-15 20:46
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Hardware fix on the way:

http://www.slashgear.com/iphone-4-in...alyst-1594059/

gerbick 2010-07-15 20:54
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texrat (Post 753241)
I'm of the thought that I'd rather see no communication than the disingenuous spin and manipulation that's coming from Apple on this. "Holding it wrong"? "No technical problem"?? Deleted forum posts???

Thumbs down on all that crap.
Those are all indeed all wrong. But which would you rather have? No communication or communication that says "It's in the fine print. That's how it is, tough." or that BS that Apple has been spreading?

Regardless... I have my own feelings. And non-communication is higher on my list of no-no's than bad communication (sometimes) but at this moment, Nokia and Apple are neck and neck for companies I will not purchase until they both do better.

And I own stock for both. Imagine that.

Milhouse 2010-07-15 21:13
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkPand0r (Post 753055)
My problem is the last Paragraph, Apple adding a watermark to Jail Broken devices. Its like adding a big "Hacked" sign on N900's with modified Kernels.
What do you guys think to this news?
Apparently it's a hoax and there's nothing like it in the new 4.01 firmware. Then again I've also read that Apple won't be releasing said watermark feature just yet as they're trying to patent the idea. :)

The theory goes that Apple store "geniuses" will check for the watermark and declare it out of warranty should the watermark be detected.

If it ever appears I can only see it driving more Apple owners into the arms of Android.

fatalsaint 2010-07-15 21:23
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerbick (Post 753257)
Those are all indeed all wrong. But which would you rather have? No communication or communication that says "It's in the fine print. That's how it is, tough." or that BS that Apple has been spreading?

Regardless... I have my own feelings. And non-communication is higher on my list of no-no's than bad communication (sometimes) but at this moment, Nokia and Apple are neck and neck for companies I will not purchase until they both do better.

And I own stock for both. Imagine that.
I say don't choose...

They both suck.

A firm "No." is one thing. May not be good news, but at least it's news, and it's not BS.

But I consider blaming Algorithms, or how you hold it, or maybe if we jump 3 times backwards... or the sound of crickets... to both be signs of both utter disrespect and uncaringness for their customers.

Just give the answer: You're either going to fix the complaint, or you aren't. Don't sugar coat it, don't ignore it, and don't treat your people like idiots: Just answer the f*ing question.

Why is that so hard for companies to do?

gerbick 2010-07-15 21:25
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatalsaint (Post 753288)
Why is that so hard for companies to do?
I've been wondering that same exact damn thing for a very long time myself.

ysss 2010-07-15 21:32
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
What's good about apple (or Jobs) responding (in anyway) to this issue is that he can be held accountable for what he says in the future.

Compare that with a company that keeps absolute silence...

Texrat 2010-07-15 21:33
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gerbick (Post 753257)
Those are all indeed all wrong. But which would you rather have? No communication or communication that says "It's in the fine print. That's how it is, tough." or that BS that Apple has been spreading?

Regardless... I have my own feelings. And non-communication is higher on my list of no-no's than bad communication (sometimes) but at this moment, Nokia and Apple are neck and neck for companies I will not purchase until they both do better.

And I own stock for both. Imagine that.
I will take zero communication over spin, lies, etc. Every time.

And deleted forum posts are chilling ANTIcommunication.

fatalsaint 2010-07-15 21:33
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ysss (Post 753295)
What's good about apple (or Jobs) responding (in anyway) to this issue is that he can be held accountable for what he says in the future.

Compare that with a company that keeps absolute silence...
That.. actually.. would be an argument for companies not wanting to say anything :D.

fatalsaint 2010-07-15 21:38
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texrat (Post 753297)
I will take zero communication over spin, lies, etc. Every time.
I'm a little confused... how is either solution beneficial in any way.. at all?

Thesandlord 2010-07-15 21:58
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zibeb (Post 753138)
After reading this, and reading the story about the Droid X tripping a fuse and bricking itself if it's modded; it really cements the fact that truely open source operating systems may become a safe haven for smartphone owners. Meego and Symbian might get some converts that way, who knows?
You realize that the N900 has an eFuse chip also right? Any phone with an OMAP3 has an eFuse chip, just no one activates them. The original Droid has it also, and it was never activated. No reason to think Moto would do it now...

Milhouse 2010-07-15 22:11
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thesandlord (Post 753323)
Any phone with an OMAP3 has an eFuse chip, just no one activates them.
OMAP3 uses e-fuse technology in the M-Shield security hardware, most likely to allow reprogramming of the public keys that are stored in the chip - a wise choice considering private keys can become compromised which would render the entire line of OMAP3 SoCs insecure.

I don't think the e-fuse technology is capable of crippling the OMAP3 hardware intentionally, however - seems like another hoax to me.

gerbick 2010-07-15 22:12
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texrat (Post 753297)
I will take zero communication over spin, lies, etc. Every time.
I'll take neither, thank you very much.

Texrat 2010-07-15 23:12
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatalsaint (Post 753303)
I'm a little confused... how is either solution beneficial in any way.. at all?
I'm confused-- who said either was?

The point was given a choice, which evil I'd rather settle for. Thought that was clear from the conversation...

DJRedline 2010-07-16 12:21
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Analysts have estimated a recall could cost up to $1.5bn (£1bn) whereas the cost of issuing free rubber bumpers to alleviate the problem would be cheaper. Estimates based on the retail costs of bumpers suggest giving out the protectors would cost nearly $180m (£118m).

I highly doubt they will recall the product as they are still struggling to keep up with demand.

daperl 2010-07-16 13:48
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJRedline (Post 753834)
Analysts have estimated a recall could cost up to $1.5bn (£1bn) whereas the cost of issuing free rubber bumpers to alleviate the problem would be cheaper. Estimates based on the retail costs of bumpers suggest giving out the protectors would cost nearly $180m (£118m).
I'll go out on a limb and say these numbers are a misrepresentation. Lost revenue is not equal to cost. And lost revenue that you would never have had in the first place, is dust in the wind [see RIAA and Kansas]. So, if the rumored mark-up on the bumpers of $29 is accurate, the most the free bumber response would cost Apple, as of the time of this article, would be:

$180,000,000 / $30 = $6,000,000 USD

Shipping not included.

Milhouse 2010-07-16 13:50
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
If the conference call is about a "silent recall" (where owners have the option to exchange for a replacement phone, no questions asked) then Apple probably hope that it will be less expensive than an official product recall since most owners that don't have problems won't bother going in for the exchange. However if I owned an original "mk I" iPhone 4 - even without problems - I would still exchange it for a mk II (ie. fixed model).

Why? Think about it, when it comes to selling an iPhone 4 on the second hand market the original mk I models are going to be much harder to shift and command a much lower price than the problem-free mk II models - any mk I buyer will be taking a risk of getting a device that drops calls in their particular network location, or has a flaky proximity sensor, even though the seller may never have had a problem.

If enough people realise this, Apple could and should take a beating on this "silent recall".

fatalsaint 2010-07-16 15:13
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texrat (Post 753373)
I'm confused-- who said either was?

The point was given a choice, which evil I'd rather settle for. Thought that was clear from the conversation...
I don't get it still.. if neither provides any additional benefits over the other... what's the point of picking at all? It doesn't matter.. they are the same.

Both methods are completely useless, provide no value, and ruin trust. I suppose the silent option is more reliable: You can count on them to tell you nothing. On the flip side.. you can pretty much almost always count on the other side telling you lies... so again, no gain.

I don't see why, given the choice, you would pick either? May as well flip a coin or let the chips fall or ignore the choice altogether as there is no right answer between just those two options. The only right answer there is simply "No."

ysss 2010-07-16 15:22
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
So what's the prediction?

Mine is...

Jobs will show up, he'll talk about the success of iPhone 4 launch and give some great marketing numbers...

...then he'll mention the many 'unnecessary knee jerk reaction from blogosphere which spread to the media' of the antenna issues... then he'll pull up some sort of scientific measurements of how this sort of problem is prevalent in just about all cellular transmitter design (with varying degree) and that the iphone4's occurrence is still (measurably) within a certain tolerance...

...but they still strive to make their product the best/completely satisfy their customers, so they'll offer options (pick one)...

- free bumper? (this may be appealing to those with minor issue)
- replacement to new revision (with some conditions... for those with real problems)
- $25 itunes voucher (to quell the masses which doesn't have any problems with their iphone 4)

then as he walks off the stage, he'd pause for a second and turn...
"Oh one more thing... We have worked with Adobe to bring Flash 10.1 to iOS platform. It will be in the next update!"

And the crowd goes wild...

hassan_badredin 2010-07-16 15:30
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
then as he walks off the stage, he'd pause for a second and turn...
"Oh one more thing... We have worked with Adobe to bring Flash 10.1 to iOS platform. It will be in the next update!"

And the crowd goes wild...



lol thats exactly what i thought

Zibeb 2010-07-16 16:07
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thesandlord (Post 753323)
Any phone with an OMAP3 has an eFuse chip, just no one activates them. The original Droid has it also, and it was never activated. No reason to think Moto would do it now...
Ok, thanks for pointing that out. The story has since been updated, the Droid X won't *brick* the phone, but the e-fuse will reboot the phone until approved firmware is loaded.

Sauce: http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/16/m...sy-says-efuse/

If there's one thing that Nokia has done right, it's been to reach out to the modding community.

ysss 2010-07-16 16:26
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Found Apple's decision matrix...

http://www.9to5mac.com/files/categor...e%20Pizza.jpeg

I heard they will throw the dart 15 minutes before the event..

Milhouse 2010-07-16 16:36
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zibeb (Post 754012)
but the e-fuse will reboot the phone until approved firmware is loaded.
No - duff or improperly signed custom firmware will reboot the phone, nothing to do with e-fuse technology whatsoever. :)

Texrat 2010-07-16 16:48
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatalsaint (Post 753968)
I don't get it still.. if neither provides any additional benefits over the other... what's the point of picking at all? It doesn't matter.. they are the same.

Both methods are completely useless, provide no value, and ruin trust. I suppose the silent option is more reliable: You can count on them to tell you nothing. On the flip side.. you can pretty much almost always count on the other side telling you lies... so again, no gain.

I don't see why, given the choice, you would pick either? May as well flip a coin or let the chips fall or ignore the choice altogether as there is no right answer between just those two options. The only right answer there is simply "No."
I am completely perplexed at that response fatalsaint.

I am not saying I would voluntarily prefer either.

The point is if I *had* to accept either evil, which do I view as the lesser? IMO it's silence. Lies are more deadly.

This is a dilemma as old as man so I really, really don't get the disconnect...

Anyway that's the best I can do to explain.

fatalsaint 2010-07-16 17:05
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texrat (Post 754046)
The point is if I *had* to accept either evil, which do I view as the lesser? IMO it's silence. Lies are more deadly.
Hrm.. we'll have to agree to disagree then. Silence leads to speculation.. which can be equally as deadly as lies.

Again.. there is no "lesser" evil. If I "had" to choose one or the other.. I'm telling you there is no choice. It matters not which one happens as both are wrong. If they had a gun to my head saying "pick one" i'd just flip a coin.

Heads - Silence
Tails - Lies

Laughing Man 2010-07-16 17:23
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
I like how he's comparing the iPhone 4 reception problems to other phones. While all phones will have reception problems if you cover up the antenna, it seems Apple is the only one that brags about having an external antenna that's revolutionary.


Edit: At least Apple does something. Nokia just sits tight lipped.

Edit2: Full refund with no restocking fee for within 30 days if you return it. Or a free bumper case. Which they probably should've given in the first place considering their 17 anechoic chambers, 18 PhDs and engineers could've figured that putting the antenna where people hold the device might be problematic. But good move nevertheless. And as expected this announcement came with tons of Apple marketing and brainwashing.

colnago 2010-07-16 17:32
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Free cases. LOL at watching share price turn positive for the day on the case announcement.

Milhouse 2010-07-16 17:32
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
"A free case for every iPhone 4 buyer. If you got one, we'll give you a refund."

"And if you're not happy, you can bring the phone back. We'll give you a full refund within 30 days. No restocking fee. We want to make everyone happy, and if we can't make you happy we'll give you a full refund."

So no free replacement/silent recall.

Texrat 2010-07-16 17:33
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatalsaint (Post 754070)
Hrm.. we'll have to agree to disagree then. Silence leads to speculation.. which can be equally as deadly as lies.

Again.. there is no "lesser" evil. If I "had" to choose one or the other.. I'm telling you there is no choice. It matters not which one happens as both are wrong. If they had a gun to my head saying "pick one" i'd just flip a coin.

Heads - Silence
Tails - Lies
We're definitely going to have to agree to disagree-- especially since speculation is 100% in the purview of the individual, whereas in this case the lies/manipulation are in the hands of the corporate entity and directed at individuals as an attack. Which is why I see lies as much, much more harmful. Not even a contest IMO, so forget coin flips.

ysss 2010-07-16 17:34
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ysss (Post 753977)
So what's the prediction?

Mine is...

Jobs will show up, he'll talk about the success of iPhone 4 launch and give some great marketing numbers...

...then he'll mention the many 'unnecessary knee jerk reaction from blogosphere which spread to the media' of the antenna issues... then he'll pull up some sort of scientific measurements of how this sort of problem is prevalent in just about all cellular transmitter design (with varying degree) and that the iphone4's occurrence is still (measurably) within a certain tolerance...

...but they still strive to make their product the best/completely satisfy their customers, so they'll offer options (pick one)...

- free bumper? (this may be appealing to those with minor issue)
- replacement to new revision (with some conditions... for those with real problems)
- $25 itunes voucher (to quell the masses which doesn't have any problems with their iphone 4)

then as he walks off the stage, he'd pause for a second and turn...
"Oh one more thing... We have worked with Adobe to bring Flash 10.1 to iOS platform. It will be in the next update!"

And the crowd goes wild...
Well, I missed the Flash part ;)

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget....826-rm-eng.jpg

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget....835-rm-eng.jpg

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget....802-rm-eng.jpg


http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget....858-rm-eng.jpg

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget....878-rm-eng.jpg

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget....916-rm-eng.jpg

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget....956-rm-eng.jpg

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget....983-rm-eng.jpg

Texrat 2010-07-16 17:38
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ysss (Post 754104)
Surprise = bad. The antenna performance problem was a surprise.

Milhouse 2010-07-16 17:42
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
"We love our users so much, we're giving you a half-arsed cheap fix for the problem rather than redesign the product as we should!"

* Crowd goes wild *

The sh1tstorm is likely to continue, but free tacky bumpers should help quieten some of the noise.

Funny how he quotes the "Applecare" figures saying that only 0.55% of owners reported a death-grip problem - would anyone experiencing this problem really bother contacting Apple to complain after reading Jobs' snotty "You're holding it wrong" email reply?

ysss 2010-07-16 17:44
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
So... is it better to completely ignore the users with a wall of silence or give a theatrical sh*tspin and $30 in their pocket?

The question remains...

fatalsaint 2010-07-16 17:44
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texrat (Post 754103)
We're definitely going to have to agree to disagree-- especially since speculation is 100% in the purview of the individual, whereas in this case the lies/manipulation are in the hands of the corporate entity and directed at individuals as an attack. Which is why I see lies as much, much more harmful. Not even a contest IMO, so forget coin flips.
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." - Edmund Burke

The first couple lies someone tells you is harmful, sure. Once you know you're dealing with a liar you can act accordingly and take what they say with a grain of salt (an intelligent person anyway..)

Silence on the other hand breeds lies and assumptions from unknown sources. They grow and people look and search for reasons to "prove" their on hypothesis.

Further silence, and no official wording negating those lies is seen as a confirmation of those speculations.

Silence itself is a form of action. So it is still in the hands of the corporation to allow falsehoods to flourish. That is equal to having started the falsehood itself.

(I know we're agreeing to disagree here.. I just like debating with you Tex :p)

fatalsaint 2010-07-16 17:47
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texrat (Post 754110)
Surprise = bad. The antenna performance problem was a surprise.
Lol. Exactly.

It's funny.. I hear people walking around my office here now going "Well Steve Jobs did the right thing finally. Giving free bumpers to people with iphone 4 and allowing refunds."

Keyword here is finally... it's amazing what people will overlook and "forgive". How many different deflections has apple made since the release of the iPhone4? They "finally" are giving "free" bumpers.. and that makes it all ok? LOL.

I love people.. they remind me so often why I hate them.

Laughing Man 2010-07-16 17:55
Re: iPhone Press Conference, iOS4.1?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ysss (Post 754115)
So... is it better to completely ignore the users with a wall of silence or give a theatrical sh*tspin and $30 in their pocket?

The question remains...
How about, give a free bumper and no spinning? But fat chance of that happening, Apple isn't like that.

Oh well, let's hope consumers learned from this experience that Apple isn't godly and infallible. I'll settle for that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Milhouse (Post 754101)
"A free case for every iPhone 4 buyer. If you got one, we'll give you a refund."

"And if you're not happy, you can bring the phone back. We'll give you a full refund within 30 days. No restocking fee. We want to make everyone happy, and if we can't make you happy we'll give you a full refund."

So no free replacement/silent recall.
They might slowly replace the devices as they get serviced? A recall would be expensive, more expensive than giving away free bumpers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatalsaint (Post 754117)
I love people.. they remind me so often why I hate them.
Don't take too many courses in psychology and sociology. Nor read alot of philosophical books, it just makes you more annoyed at people.


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